Trailer looks good, gives me kind of a Die Hard, Christmas movie feel
I'm 100% in for that!
One thing that made me laugh out loud was the Broadway marquee for Rogers: The Musical.
Because there would totally be a Broadway musical about Captain America in the MCU.
It seems heavily inspired by Matt Fraction's run in the comics, which if you have not read, I highly recommend. I really enjoyed it and did not consider myself a Hawkeye fan prior.
Yeah I honestly agree with DQ, the show writers clearly scraped on some of, if not a goodly amount of Fraction's Hawkeye with some Young Avengers type deal. Hardly that surprising though considering Tracksuit Draculas were the bad guys...
Also, totally on board for a Captain America the Musical. They should do like a hip hop version of "The Man with a Plan."
Hardly that surprising though considering Tracksuit Draculas were the bad guys...
Wait, they turned out to be vampires?! I obviously didn't read it long enough.
RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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I think Rogers: The Musical should have numbers like "I could do this all day" or "End of the Line."
Here's hoping they don't spend the entire series as a training montage for Barton's replacement as Hawkeye. I hope the series pays off the ending of the Black Widow movie too.
I look forward to the hit song "On Your Left" from the musical as well!
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Andostre,
No!! They are not actual vampires. They just have Eastern European accents and thus they get called that.
Also the suggestions for musical numbers for the Captain America the Musical are pretty spot on... in this thread I mean.
I'm all for those, Kahnya. :)
Yeah it's got the right vibe, especially if you're fan of the run that Matt Fraccion did on Hawkeye.
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First two episodes were pretty entertaining. Lots of humor. Some decent action. Jeremy Renner is excellent as always. Hailee Steinfeld is pretty good so far. Love the Track Suit Mafia.
Some thoughts:
I’m interested in the watch the TS Mafia was trying to steal. Considering it seems to be from the wreckage of the Avengers compound, I’m wondering if it might be that blaster Tony used briefly in Civil War. That would definitely be something bad guys might want - an easily concealed weapon.
If they’re introducing Echo, I wonder if they have further plans for the Phoenix.
All in all, while I’m sorry to think Renner might be hanging up the bow after this, I’m thinking Steinfeld will make an interesting replacement. And she’s young enough that Disney can get a good 10-15 years out of her.
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Clint has got some great "I'm too old for this sh@#" vibes in this.
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That is all. :)
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Yeah Feros, I was like "If any Marvel character saw this, they'd probably run outside too."
Track suit mafia in TV form: Brilliant.
Yeah Lucky being in this show really helps.
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Pacing feels a tad slow, but otherwise this is shaping up well. And yes, all the love for Lucky. Tracksuit bros also well done.
Liking Hailee Steinfeld. I... am not a fan of Jeremy Renner, but I can say without hesitation that this is the most fun I've had watching his Clint Barton.
I am so glad they brought in the deafness. It always troubled me they removed his disability for the MCU version, and the way they explain it makes perfect sense--a human guy near that many explosions is gonna suffer consequences.
Aberzombie, I like your theory about Jack.
I kind of like the costumes for Rogers: The Musical. (Although I love the "Ant-Man was not there!" line, because as of Endgame, technically he was for a minute.) Man must be whirlwind plot if "Avengers" is only halfway through... that means they dealt with all the WWII stuff pretty quickly. Would second act focus on Bucky and Civil War or on the leadup to Thanos? Probably the latter I guess.
ETA: Marvel has uploaded "Save the City," the song we see from Rogers: the Musical, because of course they know what the fans want. It is the song in its entirety, not just the bit we see. There's some choice lyrics in there... the part they're singing when it goes silent is, "Black Widow’s a knockout who can knock you out
And when Ant-Man flies you won't hear a sound!
While Hawkeye seems cool, like a really nice guy"
And then this was an awesome burn:
"If the city’s trashed when you take your bow
We'll blame you then, but you're good for now"
I still maintain that while the musical itself is cringe worthy for many MC/MCU characters, the idea of them doing a hip hop version of "The Man with a Plan" is needed. Rogers the musical itself is kind weird but I am glad they put up the Save the City song.
With regards to Jeremy Renner, yeah he might not sell Hawkeye the same way you'd sell Chadwick Boseman as Black Panther or Chris Hemsworth as Thor...this series does sell us on Hawkeye in terms of being a guy that has gone through stuff and is feeling his age, while dealing with an exuberant and also very talented Kate Bishop (which I honestly feel Hailee does great.)
them doing a hip hop version of "The Man with a Plan" is needed.
No thank you. “Star Spangled Man” (actual title) is a great propagandist pastiche and using it as a marching band number in F&TWS was a great call-back.
Anything more than that definitely starts to lessen its impact.
I always enjoy discussing shows like this with the dudes at my local comic book store. Unfortunately, there were too many people in the store yesterday, and the staff was too busy, to have a conversation.
Stoopid Black Friday.
I understand your frustration; I chat at length with the woman who owns my shop about such things too. Good times. Still, I'm always glad to hear of brick and mortar FLCSs getting a lot of business, even if only for temporary sales activities.
I generally don't chat comics at my store because it's also where I do my in person gaming. But maybe I should.
Dirtypool,
You and I differ on that. But whatever. I still kind of hope Echo brings in D'Onofrio, but if not, at least the Tracksuits are still the major draw for me.
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I’d hope it’s more subtle than a Fisk cameo in this story. The auction took place in the wine cellar beneath the ballroom he and Vanessa got married in, so I think I’d prefer if he’s hinted at but never fully revealed so as to also canonize his last known status as having been returned to prison.
A shadowy Kingpin working through intermediaries from prison, setting up another showdown with Matt/Daredevil sounds far more appealing than a confrontation with the two Hawkeye’s
Eh I think either works.
Meh. One works, the other is just kind of ticking off boxes for fan service.
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RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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I’d hope it’s more subtle than a Fisk cameo in this story. The auction took place in the wine cellar beneath the ballroom he and Vanessa got married in, so I think I’d prefer if he’s hinted at but never fully revealed so as to also canonize his last known status as having been returned to prison.
A shadowy Kingpin working through intermediaries from prison, setting up another showdown with Matt/Daredevil sounds far more appealing than a confrontation with the two Hawkeye’s
Thought a Fisk post credit scene, possibly with him an Echo would be cool. The Echo TV show announced already could be a good place for him to show up. And in that show, the post credit scene could have him try to aim Echo at Daredevil, for a yet unannounced Daredevil show.
That sounds more like what I would hope for.
I'm good either way. I just want D'Onofrio and Cox back in the MCU proper again since they were great. Same with Colleen and Misty.
Misty Knight is likely the harder to pull off given Simone Missick’a CBS series All Rise is in its third season.
Colter’s also locked up in an ongoing contract with a CBS series.
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I'm not familiar with All Rise, but Colter's show, Evil (which is pretty good and worth checking out) is a 13 episode season. That still leaves plenty of time to have a 13 or less episode show on D+ as Luke Cage. And considering that they could do a show with Luke Cage which wasn't only about him, he might not even be in all episodes of a hypothetical show. If, for instance, they did a Daredevil show, Luke could be in 2 episodes, and make it even easier to have schedules which let him continue in Evil.
All Rise was a standard 22 episode Network show while it was on CBS and OWN gave it a similar full order.
My understanding of Evil was that it was a 10 day production week which not accounting for any production breaks would make it an 18 week production. The Marvel shows shoot at a more leisurely film pace so a 6 episode series was almost twelve - fourteen weeks on its own.
Huh. I didn't realize that OWN gave it a go ahead. I though it had been canceled. Which is why I never called for Mike Colter to come back since Evil seems to be doing well. But thanks for the heads up dirtypool. (I just assumed when CBS canceled it, it wasn't getting picked up by another network.)
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Watched new episode. I loved it, but I will avoid spoilers for now. I will say that I now have Sweet Gingerbread Man running through my head...
:p
Did the Tracksuits do more fun stuff?
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Ok really warming up to Kate. I mean who else would offer relationship advice to the guys holding you prisoner. Plus she is learning well and I think Clint sees potential in her.
If we do indeed have a Young Avengers project in the works I think it's going to be a lot of fun.
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Did the Tracksuits do more fun stuff?
Not only that, but we got our formal introduction to Echo who showed up at the end of episode 2, and man is she f**~ing awesome. They're also building a parallel between her and Kate which is interesting stuff.
The dynamic between Clint and Kate is everything, as it should be.
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Ok, so... I get that Kate HAS to become the next Hawkeye, and she's from the comics and all that... but what in her suggested TV backstory says that she, a 22 year old, gets captured and taped to a mechanical unicorn by a whole room full of people with guns and she's completely chill?
She had a little bit of a freak out trying to hide in the car from the TSM guys after escaping the auction, but then she meets Hawkeye and it's like poof; all of her fear and anxiety simply melts away. I don't know, it just hit me last night in ep 3 and I wondered if I'm overthinking things.
It also might just be the tone of this show. WandaVision had some grim moments in the "real" world, and the whole of Falcon and the Winter Soldier was meant to be a bit more grounded and real, but the jaunty music and buddy cop movie banter between Clint and Kate suggests that Hawkeye is MEANT to be a tad more lighthearted. Maybe I just need to take off my sensitive pants and enjoy the show for what it is.
Different people handle stressful situations differently. I have ADHD and like a lot of people with that neurotype, during crisis situations, I get weirdly very calm and relaxed externally--hyper alert and constantly going through a checklist of things to do in my head--but physically on the surface calm and can speak even very amicably to others.
Then a couple hours after everything calms down and I am completely alone and safe where I am, then I'll have a panic attack over what just happened.
Like last month a tree fell on my car while I was driving it (well, I saw it falling a second before and I hit my brakes, and then it fell and pinned down my car). And I assessed that I was fine, that I couldn't move my car, and then called my friend to get a ride to somewhere safe, and called the city to let them know the tree needed to be removed and my car freed from under its branches. The lady nearby who saw the tree fall ran out and was jumping up and down and screaming, and I, the person who it happened to, was like, "It's okay, I'm not hurt, and everything's going to be fine" and tried to calm her down. And in case this comes as a shock to anyone, I am not an Avenger or combat trained in any way. (As a Quaker, we generally frown on getting combat training.)
Some people handle really dangerous situations by joking or laughing, usually triggered by a dissociative response. "Ha ha, I'm not really being kidnapped, this is all an elaborate ploy."
Still others freeze or shut down and others get violent. People vary very widely.
The sight of Hawkeye triggering her to feel safe also makes perfect sense from what they show in the first episode: she is in the midst of the Chitauri Invasion, is freaking out, and then sees Hawkeye doing this cool stunt and she realizes: there is someone out there protecting me. It will be okay. At an impressionable age she came to associate the sight of Hawkeye with "someone is here to fix it."
And yes, this is supposed to be a somewhat lighter hearted buddy story, even if it also involves the Bratva (aka the Tracksuit Mafia) and Clint dealing with injury and PTSD post Avengership. So it's a very violent lighter hearted buddy story.
And Kate is awesome and exactly as she should be.
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I thought episode 3 was entertaining. Some thoughts....
Loved the escape fight, as well as the chase scene. I thought the revelation of the "Ant-Man Arrow" was interesting (though maybe "Giant Man Arrow" would be better). It hints that maybe Hank Pym is working with the Avengers now, which could be really cool for future movies.
Four arrows more dangerous than the one that blew up the van. Intriguing. Also, I have to wonder if Kate actually killed whoever was in the van when she blew it up. If so, that's her first kill they just kind of glossed over.
I really liked the scene with Clint on the phone with his kid and needing Kate's help. I thought it did a good job of showcasing Jeremy Renner, whom I've liked ever since I saw him in SWAT (even though he was the villain). It almost makes me sad he seems to be kind of aging out of the franchise.
Loved the nod to the old Hawkeye comic book costume. Classic.
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RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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I thought episode 3 was entertaining. Some thoughts....
Spoiler:
I'd really love to get a cameo from D'Onofrio as Echo's "Uncle". That would be sweet.
Honestly Kate taking over as Hawkeye and being the new leader for the Young Avengers would be my dream, but we'll have to wait I guess.
Also, glad Echo/Maya is coming off as a credible character. She wasn't my favorite street level hero (even though now she's wielding the g$%~!%n Phoenix Force in the comics), but she was interesting as deaf character in a hearing world.
Also glad they are giving us the dynamic between Kate and Clint that is needed for (not the series but the future) to succeed.
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Ok, so... I get that Kate HAS to become the next Hawkeye, and she's from the comics and all that... but what in her suggested TV backstory says that she, a 22 year old, gets captured and taped to a mechanical unicorn by a whole room full of people with guns and she's completely chill?
They sorta go over it during the intro animation. You have to pay attention but they show her going from child to adult by going through constant and diverse combat training: martial arts, archery, fencing, etc.
By the way, folks who join the military do so at 16 and 17 years old, so the typical buff soldier you see in Hollywood movies is in reality much younger (and may or may not be so outwardly buff: endurance gained following weeks of 10 to 20 miles forced marching with a 80 pounds backpack does not always translate to huge muscles - it's actually against the body's advantage to add more weight to it and strength can increase tremendously over a 10 week period with no relative weight gain or muscle size as they tone themselves and you replace fat with dense muscle fibers)
Someone who has endured combat training from a young age will be much more calm when faced to most situations. They get a sense of urgency when it's required (i.e. on command), and the daily things that used to stress them don't do so much anymore.
In the case of Kate, you can bet that even though she was calm, she could have gone from 0 to 60 in a split second. Reaction times and the ability to pump the adrenaline on demand is what combat training will do to you.
I think it's a stretch to say that because you can join the military at 16 with parental consent, that most people who join the military are 16. Without specific demographic data I'd say it's just as if not more likely that more enlistments are by people aged 18 than 16 or 17.
This Pew Research Data seems to indicate that the average age of enlistees is on an upward trajectory.