[witch] Sharesister and familiar's Deliver touch spell ability


Rules Questions


So there's a witch spell called Sharesister; you take 1+ negative level, and your target gain 1+ CL and DC on all her spells.

As a witch, I have a familiar with the Deliver touch spell ability: my familiar can deliver touch spells for me.

What happens if my familiar delivers Sharesister on me?

Note: same question arise with Vampiric touch. Who gains the temporary HP? The witch or her familiar? If the witch gains the temp hp with Vampiric touch, I guess she gains the negative level with Sharesister.

Subsidiary question: let's say I have an amulet of mighty fist with the spellStoring ability (I play a prehensile hair winter witch, so with may proves useful ;) ); can I store Sharesister on the amulet, give it to my familiar, and have him attack me and deliver the spell?

Edit: and I'm looking for a way to put Beguiling Gift on use and force an opponent to cast the spell on me... unfortunately, I can force the opponent to wear the amulet, but I can't force him to deliver the spell... :/


Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber

From the way the spell is written, it seems pretty clear that the caster and the target have to be two different people. The familiar does not change that in any way.


the deliver spell ability only let your familiar deliver the spell, you are still the one casting it (it has no caster levels after all) the pet is just like a very long arm.

also note:
"Deliver Touch Spells (Su): If the master is 3rd level or higher, a familiar can deliver touch spells for him. If the master and the familiar are in contact at the time the master casts a touch spell, he can designate his familiar as the “toucher.” The familiar can then deliver the touch spell just as the master would. As usual, if the master casts another spell before the touch is delivered, the touch spell dissipates"
-if the familiar was casting the spell there would be not need for the spell to dissipate.

an amulet of mighty fists should have the caster get the penalty once the spell is delivered. and in case one finds an amulet with such spell on it but with the caster allergy dead from old age the " Any effect that removes or prevents the negative level immediately ends the sharesister spell. " part of the spell would prevent it from working, dead creatures cant get negative levels.

as for beguiling gift, i like to use it with per-prepared 'puzzle boxp' wooden spears laced with glue (preferably the magical kind) then sit and watch the buffoon who can't even use a pointy stick as a weapon...


zza ni wrote:
an amulet of mighty fists should have the caster get the penalty once the spell is delivered.

I strongly disagree. How do you handle Vampiric touch in a spell storing weapon? Who get the temp hp: the caster or the striker?

At my table, it has always been the striker.


i stand corrected i was still thinking of the long arm delivering familiar. yes the aomf would be the one casting the spell like any magic item that cast a spell ( it's not a wand\potion\scroll or other spell completion items so the user is not he caster). but it can't take negative levels nor have a gender so the spell sharesister would fail

from spell storing ability:
"Anytime the weapon strikes a creature and the creature takes damage from it, the weapon can immediately cast the spell on that creature as a free action if the wielder desires."

from the spell sharesister:
"Target you and one creature of your gender....
Any effect that removes or prevents the negative level immediately ends the sharesister spell."

The Exchange

I agree; when a familiar delivers a touch spell you treat it exactly as if you had cast it, except for who is actually making the touch attack.

However you could use Familiar spell, in which case the familiar would actually be the one casting sharesister.


... As per raw you are right. :/

... This means a stored Vampiric touch doesn't give any hp to its wielder. And that's very strange because no one plays it like this... :/


that's because it was made to cast a spell at the target, not give the caster buffs. that is what the spell storing armor ability is for.

i found that the hard way once my ranger finished storing his instant enemy spell on his weapon in the downtime and then tried to use it in combat.


Belafon wrote:
However you could use Familiar spell, in which case the familiar would actually be the one casting sharesister.

That's a great idea... Except I don't have enough feats to afford an Improved familiar (...and the Familiar spell feat...), so my familiar won't ever be able to cast any spell (at least not before level 17 x) ). :/

(And actually, this feat seems very powerful to break the action economy - more powerful than the usual UMD-familiar. And a raven familiar is enough for many spells...)


In the other hand, the fact the Spell storing amof casts the spell itself means I don't lose my frostbite or touch of blindness when it delivers the stored spell... Say hello to my ill omen spell storing amof! :)

The Exchange

Gaterie wrote:
Belafon wrote:
However you could use Familiar spell, in which case the familiar would actually be the one casting sharesister.
That's a great idea... Except I don't have enough feats to afford an Improved familiar (...and the Familiar spell feat...), so my familiar won't ever be able to cast any spell (at least not before level 17 x) ). :/

I don't know what your familiar is (as you point out a basic familiar that can speak can use familiar spell) so you may not need an Improved familiar.

Familiar Spell is available in rod form. The lesser rod is 14,000 gp.


My familiar is a rabbit (an arctic rabbit), so no vocal component.

... But I think I'll change my build a bit: no Prestigious spellcaster (There isn't any full caster in our group, I'll be the best caster anyway x) ), but a pooka familiar. Because I just discovered the pooka can take the form of a rabbit, so PLOT TWIST! my rabbit was a pooka since the very beginning (and she has white fur instead of black, but hey, it happens). And another reason is that Favored prestige + Prestigious spellcaster is powerful but boring, while Improved familiar + Extra hex isn't (... I won't play a boring cackling witch, so there are many non-boring hexes).

I'll take Familiar spell instead of Quicken (as a winter witch, I have other uses of my swift action... My goal isn't to have the best action economy in the world, but casting two spells per round is quite "standard" at those level; and it's more fun to enhance my spells with my super-special-witch-power that to Quicken a spell like any caster. I don't think I'll use UMD abuse with the pooka).

At appropriate level, I'll ask the GM how she feels with Sharesister + Familiar spell; if it's too cheesy for her or if it's too evil for her (given the duration of Sharesister, and given the fact I don't want to lose my familiar x) , it's only for the very important fights. I see it more as an anime moment: "my friend, give me your strength! We can do it!"). At least, now I know it's legit this way.

The Exchange

There’s absolutely nothing evil about sharesister. In fact it’s typed as a “harmless” spell since the caster is choosing to take the negatives and the target only gets benefits. Cheesiness, on the other hand. . .

I made liberal use of sharesister on one cleric. I never used it during combat, it was always during the casting of buffs at the start of an adventuring day (hour/level or extended 10 min/level). Great for things like magic vestment and greater magic weapon where bonuses scale with caster level.


Belafon wrote:
There’s absolutely nothing evil about sharesister. In fact it’s typed as a “harmless” spell since the caster is choosing to take the negatives and the target only gets benefits. Cheesiness, on the other hand. . .

There's nothing evil about casting Sharesister. Forcing someone else to cast it, in the other hand...

Sharesister looks like a reverse Death knell: Death knell absorb the life force of someone to give you a buff, while sharesister gives away your life force to give someone a buff. At the moment you force someone to cast sharesister, it becomes a double-reversed Death knell...

(I don't consider my witch will force her familiar to cast it; as I explained, I see it more as an amine moment. But I'm not the one to convince: maybe my GM has another view on it.)

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