I'm thinking of trying the Proficiency Without Level variant for an experimental "old school" style campaign. (I run five PF2 campaigns using the default rules.)
How are Level -1 and Level 0 creatures supposed to be run using this system. The Variant Rule says to "reduce" all statistics by the creatures level.
In order for the Encounter Building chart in the PWL variant to work, it seems like I actually need to add 1 to the statistics for Level -1 creatures. This would be compensated for by their low hit points. (Level 0 creatures would, of course, have the same stats since their Level is 0.)
Would this be correct?
You’ll still use the same XP budget for a given threat level as shown on
Table 10–1.
That is a Moderate Encounter has an XP budget of 80 etc
Its just the XP of such creatures have changed from the base values. Lower level creatures are worth porportionately more than they were and higher creatures proportionately less.
Because instead of going up by an average of +1.5 per level on everything you are going up aroudn +0.5 per level
I'm failry sure you can work out what party level - X is to find where level -1 and zero creatures sit.
As for running them the rules don't mention using two optional rules at once so you may have to improvise. Bascially they have less skills and features and so get less trained +2 bonuses, I don't think I'd penalise them further.
You’ll still use the same XP budget for a given threat level as shown on
Table 10–1.That is a Moderate Encounter has an XP budget of 80 etc
Its just the XP of such creatures have changed from the base values. Lower level creatures are worth porportionately more than they were and higher creatures proportionately less.
Because instead of going up by an average of +1.5 per level on everything you are going up aroudn +0.5 per level
I'm failry sure you can work out what party level - X is to find where level -1 and zero creatures sit.
As for running them the rules don't mention using two optional rules at once so you may have to improvise. Bascially they have less skills and features and so get less trained +2 bonuses, I don't think I'd penalise them further.
I believe we're only speaking of one variant here. My question is: when using the Proficiency Without Level system, whether and how to adjust the statistics of Level -1 creatures. If they face a Level 1 party, I understand they will count for 26 XP each. I'm just not sure whether we actually add 1 to their AC, Strike bonuses, etc.
Yes its the level of the monsters that counts not the level of the PC. The monster had their level added to their statistics. With this variant that is what you are taking away.
So lower level creatures are worth porportionately more than they were and higher creatures proportionately less.
The monster had their level added to their statistics.
So Level -1 monsters have had 1 subtracted from their statistics?
If you are level 7. Then level -1 monsters have had 6 added to all their statistics. Remove that 6. The level of the creature. Not the level difference with the party.
I am getting confused by what you are saying thinking you mean level 0 monsters which are another optional rule.
I am getting confused by what you are saying thinking you mean level 0 monsters which are another optional rule.
Uh, what? Level 0 monsters definitely exist as a normal rule, I'm not sure what you're thinking of here.
Anyway, what OP is asking about creatures whose level is -1, as in two levels lower than level 1, not one level less than the party. Whether subtracting level from all creatures means subtracting -1 from their stats, and thus increasing them all by 1.
I, personally, would probably not - they already tend to have inflated to-hit values to better menace characters with a couple levels on them, and 1st level characters could use some mooks to beat up.
Your answer is yes.
For a "Level -1 NPC" you do subtract a negative number to get a +1.
Their XP is going up so their difficulty goes up too.
As Fowlj mentioned, they will hit a disproportionate amount of the time, but IMO that's okay since they're supposed to be tougher than before yet still do diddly damage. Probably the most important thing to remember is that EVERY monster will matter, so it's hard to have larger battles, and in turn, the PCs having a numbers advantage will cut down bosses quite fast (like in most RPGs out there!).