I have a 5th swashbuckler / a 4th level knife master rogue / and a newly minted 4th level weapon master fighter. If I take advanced weapon training focused weapon as my bonus feat for 4th level fighter, what is my sacred weapon damage die?
-notes-
Swashbuckler levels are considered fighter levels for the purpose of meeting combat feat prerequisites. Pg 59 advanced class guide
Advanced Weapon Training (Combat)
You are specially trained to use your weapon skills in new ways.
Prerequisites: Fighter level 5th, weapon training class feature.
Benefit: Select one advanced weapon training option, applying it to one fighter weapon group you have already selected with the weapon training class feature. Special: This feat can be taken more than once, but at most once per 5 fighter levels.
Special: Fighters that have the weapon master archetype can select this feat beginning at 4th level. The benefits of a weapon master’s advanced weapon training options apply only to his selected weapon rather than all weapons in the same fighter weapon group, and he can’t select the weapon specialist advanced weapon training option. A weapon master can select this feat as a bonus feat; if he does so, it doesn’t count for the purpose of the requirement that it can be taken at most once per 5 fighter levels.
Focused Weapon (Ex): The fighter selects one weapon for which he has Weapon Focus and that belongs to the associated fighter weapon group. The fighter can deal damage with this weapon based on the damage of the warpriest’s sacred weapon class feature, treating his fighter level as his warpriest level. The fighter must have Weapon Focus with the selected weapon in order to choose this option. Advanced weapon training page 18
Sacred weapon damage for medium character d6 d8 or d10 and does it multiply on a crit? Does this effectively double the base damage of a kukri?
The 7th column in the "Class Features" table is your sacred weapon damage. Note: only your Fighter levels count so you're currently equal to a 4th level Warpriest.
Levels 1-4: 1d6
Levels 5-9: 1d8
Levels 10-14: 1d10
Levels 15-19: 2d6
Level 20: 2d8
So at level 4 your damage is 1d6. This replaces your weapon's base damage.
Let's say you have 18 STR and no damage feats.
If you're using a dagger you'd normally deal 1d4+4 damage (2d4+8 on a crit). With Sacred Weapon it's 1d6+4 damage (2d6+8 on a crit).
If you're using a Composite Longbow (+4 STR rating) you'd normally deal 1d8+4 damage (3d8+12 on a crit). With sacred weapon it's 1d6+4 damage (3d6+12 on a crit).
Note that you don't HAVE to use your sacred weapon damage, so in the case of the Longbow above you would likely decide to use your regular weapon damage until you reach level 10. There may be times when you wish to deal less damage for some reason, in which case you have that option.
EDIT: I missed your note on Swashbucklers. I'm not sure if that stacks. You count it for prerequisites for feats (letting you take the feat earlier), but I don't know that it increases the benefit of the feat. It MIGHT work, but I'm really not sure. If it does then it increases your damage by exactly 1 step (1d6, 1d8, 1d10, 2d6, 2d8).
Sadly i dont think it works (I believe swashbuckler weapon training should be a weapon training and its own group including the things swashbuckler weapon training works with).
The feat isn't giving you the upped damage die, the feat is giving you access to the class ability unfortunately. Swashbuckler doesn't stack with fighter for the purpose of class abilities, just feat prereqs.
I think there is a case to be made that the swashbuckler levels SHOULD count in this case. If you view access to a given type of sacred damage die as a prerequisite for that die then by the RAW the equivalent is fighter levels and the equivalent of that RAW is swashbuckler levels plus fighter levels. Level in this case is a prerequisite for a given damage level. Supposedly there is a clarification on this in one of the play test documents, but I don’t have that. Does anyone have a link? Thoughts?
Consider the wording of war priest on this subject in the advanced class guide:
Bonus Feats: At 3rd level and every 3 levels thereafter, a warpriest gains a bonus feat in addition to those gained from normal advancement. These bonus feats must be selected from those categorized as combat feats. The warpriest must meet the prerequisites for these feats, but he treats his warpriest level as his base attack bonus (in addition to base attack bonuses gained from other classes and racial Hit Dice) for the purpose of qualifying for these feats. Finally, for the purposes of these feats, the warpriest can select feats that have a minimum number of fighter levels as a prerequisite, treating his warpriest level as his fighter level.
The wording here is different....
I think there is a case to be made that the swashbuckler levels SHOULD count in this case. If you view access to a given type of sacred damage die as a prerequisite for that die then by the RAW the equivalent is fighter levels and the equivalent of that RAW is swashbuckler levels plus fighter levels. Level in this case is a prerequisite for a given damage level. Supposedly there is a clarification on this in one of the play test documents, but I don’t have that. Does anyone have a link? Thoughts?
again, its not a feat though. Its like extra rage power. You cant take extra rage power for a barbarian rage power and have it scale with your skald levels, even though skalds can take rage powers.
But it is actually a feat. Advanced Weapon Training see weapon masters handbook pg 19.
ADVANCED WEAPON TRAINING FEAT
In addition to selecting advanced weapon training in place of additional fighter groups using the weapon training class feature, fighters can also gain advanced weapon training options via the Advanced Training
feat, presented below.
Advanced Weapon Training (Combat)
You are specially trained to use your weapon skills in new ways.
Prerequisites: Fighter level 5th, weapon training class feature.
Benefit: Select one advanced weapon training option, applying it to one fighter weapon group you have already selected
with the weapon training class feature. Special: This feat can be taken more than
once, but at most once per 5 fighter levels. Special: Fighters that have the weapon masterAPG archetype can select this feat beginning at 4th level. The benefits of a weapon master’s advanced weapon training options apply only to his selected weapon rather than all weapons in the same f ighter weapon group, and he can’t select the weapon specialist advanced weapon training option. A weapon master can select this feat as a bonus feat; if he does so, it doesn’t count for the purpose of the requirement that it can be taken at most once per
5 fighter levels.
But it is actually a feat. Advanced Weapon Training.
It is a feat like Extra rage power, or extra rogue talent. the only purpose of the feat, is to give a class feature, thats its only effect. Without explicit rules that class feature only scales with levels of its own class.
The swashbuckler rule lets you take weapon spec, greater weapon focus, ah, critical mastery where you can apply to critical feats, disruptive etc.
It also allows you to qualify for multiple levels of taking Advanced weapon training the feat (since you can normally only take it once every five, or as a bonus feat from fighter(weaponmaster) levels.
doesn't make the fighter class feature advanced weapon training scale up at all.
I think the key issue is whether or not you view the war priest level requirement on the Sacred weapon table as a prerequisite or not. If you do, then RAW you must add the two together, else it is just the fighter level.
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I think the key issue is whether or not you view the war priest level requirement on the Sacred weapon table as a prerequisite or not. If you do, then RAW you must add the two together, else it is just the fighter level.
nnnno...that doesn't have anything to do with it.
The fighter selects one weapon for which he has Weapon Focus and that belongs to the associated fighter weapon group. The fighter can deal damage with this weapon based on the damage of the warpriest’s sacred weaponACG class feature, treating his fighter level as his warpriest level. The fighter must have Weapon Focus with the selected weapon in order to choose this option.
This is a class feature, it scales only as far and with what it specifically says it does.
Swashbuckler levels are considered fighter levels for the purpose of meeting combat feat prerequisites.
This is the relevant portion of the swashbuckler rules
Prerequisites: Fighter level 5th, weapon training class feature.
Swashbuckler levels count toward the 5 levels of fighter you need to take the feat, but they don't stack with fighter levels for its scaling, in order to do that they'd need different rules text, similar but not identical to this
Skill and Heart as One (Ex): If the heritor knight has the weapon training class feature, her heritor knight levels stack with her fighter levels for the purpose of that ability. In addition, heritor knight levels stack with fighter levels for the purpose of feat prerequisites.
The bolded text would make it work the way you want it to.
I think I agree with Ryan Freire. You would be able to take this feat earlier due to Swashbuckler weapon training, but it would only scale with your Fighter levels.
I think I agree with Ryan Freire. You would be able to take this feat earlier due to Swashbuckler weapon training, but it would only scale with your Fighter levels.Swashbuckler Weapon Training =/= weapon training. While they have very similar effects, they are not interchangeable.
(S)he also has 4 levels in WEAPON MASTER Fighter, which gets Weapon Training at 3rd level. With 5 levels of Swashbuckler and 4 levels of Fighter he counts as a 9th level Fighter for prerequisites. That means (s)he fulfills the prerequisites for the feat ADVANCED WEAPON TRAINING.