Can I get some help touching up My Character


Advice


I wanted to build more of a social character Party face and I could use some advice on touching her up.

Name:????
Race: Dhampir ( Heir to Undying Nobility)
Class: Investigator (Mastermind) (6th LV)

25 point Buy
STR:(10) DEX:(14) CON:(10)
INT:(18) WIS:(10) CHA:(16)

Character Traits
1: Student of Philosophy
2: ???

Feats:
1: weapon Finesse (For Her Sword-Cane)
3: Dodge (planning on Osyluth Guile)
5: ???

Talents
LV3: (Underworld Inspiration)
LV5: Empathy


You have 10 Con, d8 HD, and no means of healing other than the natural way. This is a problem. First drop Cha a bit, you're using Int for at least one social skill anyway, and raise Con.

Next you need a means of healing. Cure wounds spells and extracts don't work on you, I'm assuming there isn't an evil cleric or similar in the party. The easiest would be to get wands of inflict light wounds or infernal healing and if someone else in the party can't use it use UMD, but there are other means - one way would be to invest in the heal skill and get a healer's satchel, other ways tend to require feats.

One thing I'm wondering though, what does this character do in a fight? If you study an enemy & have a +1 sword cane then at 5th level you're looking at +8 attack, 1d6+3 damage which isn't much for 5th. If you get extra investigator talent you could pick up some useful trick - effortless aid or sapping offensive or alchemist discovery (mutagen). 2nd level investigator extracts aren't combat gamechangers, but note alchemical allocation and get a good potion or two for when you've plenty of time to buff up.


@AVR.

Yep figured Healing would be trouble
The Inflict wand maybe. Is there away to get INT to UMD with a trait?

For combat I am not to sure. Like I want to be able to debuff my foes

Also would Polymath from pow stack with Master mind ?


Pragmatic activator does Int to UMD. Out of combat you don't really need the trait tho' since even with 14 Cha you'll be at +10, that's for in combat buffs if you get such wands.

Debuffing in melee takes more than one feat to be useful. I mentioned sapping offensive, that's a very mild debuff.

Polymath could stack and adds combat power, like all PoW stuff.

Silver Crusade

If your GM is OK with 3rd party material, Dhampir: Scions of the Night by Raging Swan Press has some flavorful and well balanced Dhampir options. There's an alternate sppell-like ability which gives you fast healing 1 for a number of
rounds per day equal to your character level + your Charisma
modifier (increases to fast healing 2 at 10th lvl).

Silver Crusade

You might want to consider a "Swashtigator" (Inspired Blade Swashbuckler 1/Investigator x). This can get you dex to damage at 1st level, and make you better in combat.

In my opinion, 18 Int is a bit overkill for an Investigator: if you lower it to 16, you'll still greatly overshadow everyone else for skills. I prefer a higher dex and con.


AVR

Ok so I am wondering if starting out with one or two levels in Stalker (Vigilante) would be worth it.

From what I can tell I'd Get

A: Maneuvers
B: Inspiration (Dose it stack??)
C: A Sneak Attack Die
D: A single Stalker Art (Killer’s Implements )
E: INT to Initi and Ref saves?

Buy I think I lost out on 1 BAB

Is it worth it?


PCScipio wrote:

You might want to consider a "Swashtigator" (Inspired Blade Swashbuckler 1/Investigator x). This can get you dex to damage at 1st level, and make you better in combat.

In my opinion, 18 Int is a bit overkill for an Investigator: if you lower it to 16, you'll still greatly overshadow everyone else for skills. I prefer a higher dex and con.

True but u really see her using a sword cane


Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber
avr wrote:
Pragmatic activator does Int to UMD. Out of combat you don't really need the trait tho' since even with 14 Cha you'll be at +10, that's for in combat buffs if you get such wands.

But you can't take 10 with UMD, and a wand becomes unusable for a while if you roll a 1 and fail. That means that your attempts to use a wand do not become completely safe until you get your bonus up to +19.


On a dip in stalker with the vigilante archetype - it saves you a couple of feats and gets you trapfinding as well, and compared to polymath investigator 5 you have several more level 1 maneuvers and one less level 2 maneuver. One less level 2 extract/day. I suspect you have only one inspiration pool but that's up to your GM. 1d6 sneak attack. It does not add Int to ref or init unless you get a 2 level dip. No hit to BAB, level 5 as an investigator doesn't raise BAB.

I think in the long run single classing would be better, but at the start stalker 1 / investigator 4 might be better than investigator 5.

David knott 242 wrote:
avr wrote:
Pragmatic activator does Int to UMD. Out of combat you don't really need the trait tho' since even with 14 Cha you'll be at +10, that's for in combat buffs if you get such wands.

But you can't take 10 with UMD, and a wand becomes unusable for a while if you roll a 1 and fail. That means that your attempts to use a wand do not become completely safe until you get your bonus up to +19.

There's not a lot of difference between +10 and +12, or even +18 though is there? A little since it requires less attempts on average, but +10 is perfectly serviceable for out of combat healing.


avr wrote:

On a dip in stalker with the vigilante archetype - it saves you a couple of feats and gets you trapfinding as well, and compared to polymath investigator 5 you have several more level 1 maneuvers and one less level 2 maneuver. One less level 2 extract/day. I suspect you have only one inspiration pool but that's up to your GM. 1d6 sneak attack. It does not add Int to ref or init unless you get a 2 level dip. No hit to BAB, level 5 as an investigator doesn't raise BAB.

I think in the long run single classing would be better, but at the start stalker 1 / investigator 4 might be better than investigator 5.

David knott 242 wrote:
avr wrote:
Pragmatic activator does Int to UMD. Out of combat you don't really need the trait tho' since even with 14 Cha you'll be at +10, that's for in combat buffs if you get such wands.

If I went Polymath what would you recommend for a feat lay out

And if I did stalker then in to Polymath how dose my Maneuvers progress?


Stalker 1/polymath 4 getting killer's implements for weapon finesse & deadly agility on the swordcane might get feats like these
1: Dodge
3: Extra investigator talent
5: Extra investigator talent
If instead you want to go for debuffing beyond what your maneuvers provide you could I guess by going for combat expertise or dirty fighting, improved {maneuver} and a 3rd feat related to the maneuver in question.

You would have maneuvers as a level 1 stalker and a level 4 polymath. They can be slightly higher level than if either was single classed; if you take polymath then stalker (do this only if starting at 5th) then the stalker maneuvers could all be level 3 I think.


@ AVR

How about Maneuvers

I am planning Riven hour glass & Scarlet throne ( the later cause it has a vampire theme to it,)


Polymath 4 gets 4 1st 2 2nd level maneuvers. Stalker 1 with 4 levels before it can get all their maneuvers as if they were a 3rd level initiator, i.e. 6 1st or 2nd level maneuvers (not 3rd, that was a mistake earlier). Polymaths gain access to neither of those 2 disciplines, vigilante stalkers can get both.

Assuming you're willing to go with the default disciplines you might get from polymath
1: dizzying venom prana, hunting serpent blow, sting of the rattler, solar sting
2: fading dodge, iron fang
Stances: body of the night, running hunter's stance
& from stalker
1: blade of breaking
2: sanguine barrier, rising zenith strike, unhindered step, stopwatch, rapid strike
Stance: scarlet einhander


@ AVR

Well maybe if I tell you about my character maybe you can help craft a build.

It's a female Dhampir Named Karina Kusatov. She Has a similar Design to Neo but uses a sword cane instead of a umbrella. She Dresses in a Ringmaster's outfit and had a silver pocket watch at her side. She has blonde hair and Gold Eyed

She was Born the Half Breed Daughter of a Politician of the sanguine Senate and a Unknown Human Mother

One day she found our her father was Plotting to over the throw the king so she killed him to prevent unneeded Bloodshed
How ever she had no proof of her father's plan and had to feel. She eventually ended up at the outskirts of the kingdom and found refuge in camp off bandits and outcast . She used her Manipulate charms to convince them to make her their leader . She then Built a type of Traveling Freak Show who use there talents to Entrance Their Audience and "Earn"some Extra Tips.

She had knowledge if Basic sword play and us never with out her Sword cane . Very intelligent and charming but lacking some common sense she some times acts without thinking .

She can Defend herself but she won't be soloing Any Bosses.


It's not like the build above doesn't work...it's just going to be into steel serpent more than scarlet throne or riven hourglass in the long run.

If you want something different to compare it to I guess I can do that. I'm assuming from what you've said that the mechanical criteria are: dhampir, vamp flavour, master of social skills (possible leadership/buff abilities), uses a sword cane, can play a support role in melee with possible debuffs. Sounds like a bard.

Here's my attempt at a bard with vamp flavour.

Spoiler:
Karina Kusatov, female dhampir rubato bard 5
Str 13, Dex 16+2race=18, Con 14-2race=12, Int 12, Wis 8, Cha 15+2race+1@L4=18
Feats: weapon finesse, golden lion style, animus healing
Traits: unorthodox method (scarlet throne replaces elemental flux), agile dancer
Spells
1: dancing darkness, recharge innate magic, saving finale, vanish
2: blood biography, suggestion, urban step
Maneuvers
1: flowing creek, tactical strike, blade of breaking, prince's attitude
2: calm the storm, riptide strike
Stances: reaching blade stance (MC1), pride leader's stance (GL1)

Mithral current works with a sword cane nicely, golden lion helps your allies, scarlet throne fits her heritage. She can trip or disarm her enemies once per combat if she readies the appropriate maneuvers.

Several of her spells imitate vampire abilities and recharge innate magic lets her use those 2 racial SLAs more than once.

Basic bardic inspire courage (+2 atk/dmg at this level), inspire competence and saving finale let her aid and lead her allies outside what the golden lion abilities give.

Animus healing is a bit of healing which doesn't depend on items. It's useful to have some such as a dhampir, believe me.

Dark Archive

I myself have no experience with Investigators or PoW, but I know one thing: If you're playing a Dhampir, you can have a lot of benefit by picking up a little voodoo doll.

Just link it to yourself and voluntary fail the will saves. If you have Sneak Attack (or a friend that has it), all the better.


@AVR

Rubato lose spells but that ok.

Could you help me with feats and Maneuvers up to level 11?

Just so I have s fair idea where I'm taking her


That makes her both worse and less vampire-y. Well, if you're OK with that -

Karina, bard version:
Feats
7: bardic masterpiece (Hymn of Restorative Harmonics) - if there's a decent healer in the party skip this.
9: antagonize
11: extra readied maneuver

Maneuvers
6: iron wave (MT2) replaces tactical strike (GL1)
7: add circling the prey (GL3) and flowing water stance (MT3)
8: dazing attack (ST3) replaces blade of breaking (ST1)
9: add direct the pride (GL4)
10: silver wave (MT4) replaces iron wave (MT2)
11: add sanguine perfection (ST5) and unfettered movement (ST3)


@ AVR

Well how could I make her more vampire-y

Like I'm ok not being a Path of war class.

I want to stick with her for a long while and I want her build to fit her fluff


I thought those spells above did a few abilities from vampire fiction fairly well. Since the rubato loses bard spells I might look at the arcane duelist bard archetype instead. The feats might then run

Spoiler:
1: weapon finesse
Arcane duelist 1: arcane strike
Arcane duelist 2: combat casting
3: deadly agility
5: riving strike
Arcane duelist 6: disruptive
7: antagonize
9: lunge
Arcane duelist 10: spellbreaker
11: masterpiece: requiem of the fallen priest-king

Her spells beyond 5th might include fear, gaseous form and blood song as well as the more usual haste and heroism.


@ AVR

Ya the spells fit very well.

Question would Mesmerist also work

My friend said Karina sounded like one?


It'd probably fit her personality well. If you want to focus on debuffing to the exclusion of buffing mesmerist is your class. They have a tightly focused spell list and miss out on some flavourful spells I'd meant for vampness e.g. Blood biography but not all of them.


Should I consider natural Charmer I mean it looks good but I'm not sure if there something I'm missing.?


Back up one. What's natural charmer - racial ability, spell or what?


avr wrote:
Back up one. What's natural charmer - racial ability, spell or what?

It's a racial feat


Interesting. You can take 20 on social checks with friendly NPCs. Taking 20 still requires 20 times as long and - important - probably can't be done where there's a penalty for failure, so opportunities to use it will be rare. Effective when you can use it though.

Not worth a feat IMO. When the GM will allow you to use this feat the outcome doesn't matter by definition, since either the NPC will be neutral or worse, and/or there's a penalty for failure.


avr wrote:

Interesting. You can take 20 on social checks with friendly NPCs. Taking 20 still requires 20 times as long and - important - probably can't be done where there's a penalty for failure, so opportunities to use it will be rare. Effective when you can use it though.

Not worth a feat IMO. When the GM will allow you to use this feat the outcome doesn't matter by definition, since either the NPC will be neutral or worse, and/or there's a penalty for failure.

Cab you show me a Mesmerist Build for her and should I Dip Swash?


The Unquiet Grave Discipline might be fitting to use for a Dhampir. Solves the need for healing as well.


You can dip swashbuckler. You're not required to do so. It depends on where on the magic-vs-martial spectrum this character falls, and on whether you have a particular use for more feats. If you develop the full martial study I-VI feat line from Path of War to indulge in unquiet grave as a mesmerist, or if you're getting into feinting then you need feats a lot, if you have no particular plans and standing 30' behind the action is fine by you - then maybe not.

There's been enough suggestions in this thread that I'm sure you can make your own mesmerist. Have fun.

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