Simple question: How does "Salve of Antiparalysis" work? I am confused if counteract checks are involved, and if they are, how...
Yeah, that's strange since you're not casting it, yet it almost has to work as if you are, thus using your stats?
"No, let me apply that because I'm more charming than you are smart."
"Not by the way you phrased that you aren't."
There has to be a counteract check due to the spell referenced (as well as to explain why it's Heightened).
It seems like you would just roll a D20 and compare whatever you get to the Counteract DC. That would make it relatively useful for counteracting level 2 or lower effects, which seems appropriate.
It seems like you would just roll a D20 and compare whatever you get to the Counteract DC. That would make it relatively useful for counteracting level 2 or lower effects, which seems appropriate.
I do not concur that a level 6 item that has a 25% failure chance against even the weakest of paralysation effects (Ghoul, level 1, DC15) seems appropriate, especially as at that character level you would anyway be subject to the benefits of the incapacitation trait versus low level effects.
Paralyze as per the level 5 spell is a level 3 effect and I think you should at least have a chance to be able to beat that.
It seems like you would just roll a D20 and compare whatever you get to the Counteract DC. That would make it relatively useful for counteracting level 2 or lower effects, which seems appropriate.I do not concur that a level 6 item that has a 25% failure chance against even the weakest of paralysation effects (Ghoul, level 1, DC15) seems appropriate, especially as at that character level you would anyway be subject to the benefits of the incapacitation trait versus low level effects.
Paralyze as per the level 5 spell is a level 3 effect and I think you should at least have a chance to be able to beat that.
Yeah, that doesn't make any sense. I'd say at bare minimum it should have the same counteract bonus as a caster of that level would-- so at least +12. I'd need to double check, but I think most items have somewhere around there as a benchmark for DCs and modifiers and stuff.
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Items in general that apply a counteract effect have this problem. I recently ran into it when my PCs had fought a clay golem and were trying to use healing potions despite the cursed wound effect.
It seems most coherent to me to use the target's class DC minus 10 as the counteract modifier, but the rules don't actually state that or anything else.
It seems most coherent to me to use the target's class DC minus 10 as the counteract modifier, but the rules don't actually state that or anything else.
I too considered this as a possible way forward, as those items can and will mostly be used by non-casters.
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Technically speaking, you don't need to make a counteract check for potions:Items in general that apply a counteract effect have this problem. I recently ran into it when my PCs had fought a clay golem and were trying to use healing potions despite the cursed wound effect.
It seems most coherent to me to use the target's class DC minus 10 as the counteract modifier, but the rules don't actually state that or anything else.
A creature hit by the clay golem’s fist must succeed at a DC 29 Fortitude save or be cursed until healed to its maximum HP. The cursed creature can’t regain HP except via magic, and anyone casting a spell to heal the creature must succeed at a DC 29 counteract check or the healing has no effect. The golem’s counteract level is equal to its creature level.
Of course, there is some debate on this 'Potions are not spells' reading of the rules...
Comming back to the original discussion on how to apply this specific oil you could also just add one little word to the description and everybody would be fine (I guess).
Applying this filmy salve to a creature helps it overcome magical paralysis. The creature recovers as if it were the target of a successful 3rd-level remove paralysis spell.
This way there will be no need for any rolls and the salve would be able to beat up to 4th level paralyzation effects. Too good for a 40gp one-use item? You decide...
I assumed that's how it worked anyways tbh. It says "the creature recovers" rather than "attempt a counteract check" and, as pointed out, there's no way to really determine what modifiers you're using for the actual roll.
It's also more expensive than a scroll of the same spell, so it'd be weird if it was worse.