Alchemists feel like they should be a skill class?

[Selkor]

I kinda feel like Alchemists are a skill class similar to Bard or Rogue, I understand they are supposed to supplement their skills via the items they make. But I feel like they weren't given enough via their class to compensate for the difference. I readily admit I haven't played PF2 yet, not for a lack of trying, so I'm not sure if it just feels like Alchemists are half a step behind other classes or not. You insights would be greatly appreciated!

Bards start with 6+ skills, have spells, and feats that can all improve the usage of their skills. Not to mention their Muses give them a feat as well.

Rogues start with at least 9+ skills, lots of skill increases (19), lots of skill feats, and versatile feats to give them their needed flexibility that is iconic of the rogue class which I think is inline with how they should be.

Alchemists conversely start with 4+ skills granted INT is their prime stat (one of which is central to their concept), their Research Field has no real impact on their skill usage, they have the typical 9 skill increases. The only class feats that can be viewed as affecting their skills at anything are Glib Mutagen (level 14) and Genius Mutagen (level 16).

I feel like combined with the lack of proficiency bumps they get across the board and the lack of skill increases to go with their typically increasing INT, is somewhat stifling for them. I feel the transition for their Class Feats from Playtest to Release took a diversity hit and they narrowed their usefulness down, and over corrected. Combined with the very lackluster Capstone trait of Master for Light & Unarmored. It just seems to be they just didn't make the effort or care for Alchemists that they did for other classes.

[Zwordsman]

I do typically wish they had a few more skills. or that they got Master/Legendary in bombs. Alternatively I do wish that Rogues had gotten skill boosts. But Alchemist had gotten more Skill Feats. Rogues are diverse. Alchemist specialized. I would've liked that.

but overall I don't find their skill ability lacking too much. but I certainly have moments where I can't focus in as many skills as I had.
(enough so I think 2 feats in Bard for inspire competence to use only performance for Skil Aid isn't a horrible idea for me).

I will agree Alchemists (my favorite class) feel a bit empty at the moment at times and lends itself highly to multiclassing (ranger in my case is my go to).

6+Int would've been nice. no doubt. but I still would've liked more skill feats on the Alch more skill increase on Rogue. That would've made a nice diliniation in their skill utility.

Ultimately Alchemists are my favorite though. My go to class.

[shroudb]

one of the major issues that really hurt is that chirurgeon's ability to substitute Craft for Medicine is practically useless because every single upgrade to Treat wounds from the base skill (increased amount) to the skill feats (more targets and etc) are ALL still tied to Medicine rank.

so, not only you have only 3 skills to upgrade, but as a Chirurgeon, you basically are forced to spend 2 out of the 3 skill increases in medicine and Craft.

I'm pretty sure that the ability should have read "and substitute Craft for all Medicine requirements" in order to actually be useful at all.

secondly:

All alchemists should have (imo) automatic increase in Craft at 3/7/15. Just that one skill would have been ok imo.

[Selkor]

shroudb wrote:

one of the major issues that really hurt is that chirurgeon's ability to substitute Craft for Medicine is practically useless because every single upgrade to Treat wounds from the base skill (increased amount) to the skill feats (more targets and etc) are ALL still tied to Medicine rank.

so, not only you have only 3 skills to upgrade, but as a Chirurgeon, you basically are forced to spend 2 out of the 3 skill increases in medicine and Craft.

I'm pretty sure that the ability should have read "and substitute Craft for all Medicine requirements" in order to actually be useful at all.

secondly:

All alchemists should have (imo) automatic increase in Craft at 3/7/15. Just that one skill would have been ok imo.

I also agree with you the Chirurgeon not just having crafting overwrite the Medicine ability is silly since it doesn't affect any of the other aspects of Medicine the way it was written.

I think I can understand why they don't give the Craft skill the automatic progression. Since it would be tied to all crafting not just Alchemy, which would eventually let them take the Craft Anything feat at 15 without as much of an investment as any of the other classes. Although I am partial to agree with you that I would have liked it as well.

I just think having a total of 9 skill increases and having to use 3 of them to get a single skill to legendary, especially for a class that is focused on crafting and skills is a bit unbalanced.