I have a build that I came up with and wanted to see if it worked.
I have a Medium sized creature wielding a +1 longsword in two hands.
I then attach an effortless lace to the longsword, letting it be used with Weapon Finesse.
The effortless lace longsword is then enchanted with Agile.
Can I wield this longsword in two hands and get both DEX to hit and 1 1/2 DEX to damage, or do I only get DEX to damage?
Agile specifically forbids the extra damage.
Quote: This modifier to damage is not increased for two-handed weapons, but is still reduced for off-hand weapons. If you want a two handed finesse weapon there are already options, like the elven branched spear.
I think the only finesse options that can get 1 and half dex to damage are the unchained rogue and mythic weapon finesse. Everything else has text to prevent it.
Melkiador wrote: Agile specifically forbids it.
Quote: This modifier to damage is not increased for two-handed weapons, but is still reduced for off-hand weapons.
The longsword is a one handed weapon wielded in two hands, and not a two-handed weapon, which should work with Agile, assuming it still counts as a one-handed weapon while wielded in two hands.
DSC00035 wrote: Melkiador wrote: Agile specifically forbids it.
Quote: This modifier to damage is not increased for two-handed weapons, but is still reduced for off-hand weapons.
The longsword is a one handed weapon wielded in two hands, and not a two-handed weapon. When wielded in both hands it’s a weapon that is two handed, so a two-handed weapon.
Quote: Wielding a Weapon Two-Handed: When you deal damage with a weapon that you are wielding two-handed, you add 1-1/2 times your Strength bonus (Strength penalties are not multiplied). You don't get this higher Strength bonus, however, when using a light weapon with two hands. So, the longsword counts as light and also can’t benefit from two-handing.
Melkiador wrote:
When wielded in both hands it’s a weapon that is two handed, so a two-handed weapon.
When I look at Power Attack, it differentiates between two-handed weapons and weapons wielded in two hands, though.
Quote: This bonus to damage is increased by half (+50%) if you are making an attack with a two-handed weapon, a one handed weapon using two hands, or a primary natural weapon that adds 1-1/2 times your Strength modifier on damage rolls. Melkiador wrote:
Quote: Wielding a Weapon Two-Handed: When you deal damage with a weapon that you are wielding two-handed, you add 1-1/2 times your Strength bonus (Strength penalties are not multiplied). You don't get this higher Strength bonus, however, when using a light weapon with two hands. So, the longsword counts as light and also can’t benefit from two-handing.
Effortless lace only makes it light for certain feats and abilities, though.
Quote: the weapon is treated as a light melee weapon when determining whether it can be used with Weapon Finesse, as well as with any feat, spell, or special weapon ability that can be used in conjunction with light weapons.
The intention is obviously no. Splat books have different wording standards than the core line and even that changed over time, so you can’t use power attack as any kind of evidence that a two handed weapon is not two-handed.
And you really don’t need effortless lace if you and your dm think this works. Just use an Aldori dueling sword.
Melkiador is entirely correct. A one handed weapon used in two hands wouldn't provide a bigger bonus than a two handed would. It gives the straight bonus, that is all. Agile is very clear and no wiggle room is there.
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