Socket Bayonets and Two-Weapon Fighting?

[Wheeler the Healer]

Hi, first post so sorry if this is poorly formatted or has been answered before.

So the socket bayonet from Rasputin Must Die!

-Bayonet, Socket: A socket bayonet fits onto a lug mounted on the barrel of some modern firearms. It has the same statistics as a bayonet, but a firearm fitted with a bayonet lug can be fired while the bayonet is in place, albeit with a –2 penalty on attack rolls. Each bayonet is designed for a specific model of firearm.

Can it be used with Two-Weapon Fighting/Sword and Pistol, as it doesn't interfere with making firearm attacks? That's why the standard bayonet doesn't work, I know. I feel that under RAW it doesn't, but Lord am I trying to make this weapon work, and there's a solid logical argument for it.

-Two-Weapon Fighting: If you wield a second weapon in your off hand, you can get one extra attack per round with that weapon. You suffer a –6 penalty with your regular attack or attacks with your primary hand and a –10 penalty to the attack with your off hand when you fight this way. You can reduce these penalties in two ways. First, if your off-hand weapon is light, the penalties are reduced by 2 each. An unarmed strike is always considered light. Second, the Two-Weapon Fighting feat lessens the primary hand penalty by 2, and the off-hand penalty by 6.

The socket bayonet doesn't work because isn't wielded off hand, it's a second two-handed weapon . . . that you wield simultaneous with the firearm? Obviously that seems wrong. The easy answer is to treat it as a double weapon, but that would be by GM fiat, not the rules. Is there something I'm missing, or a trick to get around this?

[Zwordsman]

So.
You mean say the Rifle with a bayonet lug. and a bayonet on said lug. as these two eapons?

As far as I am aware. OFf Hand does not explcitly require you're actual hand. Just an alternate weapon of usage. Armour Spikes for instance mentions it can be used for main hand or off hand weapon. So really off hand is more "the weapon that isn't your primary" Techicnally you are wielding BOTH the firearm and the bayonet. I could I guess see someone requireing you to adjusut your grip between the two attacks. In which case I woudl suggest you get quick draw I guess? Drawing isn't the same as equiping but there is an argument to be had there. I don't remember if pathfinder has a shift your grip action. I believe they put something like that in via na FAQ for some items like weapon cord but I dont' remember right now.
I personally would assume and say that shifting your grip between shooting and stabbin would be a free action. Since the amount of movement is similiar to reloading anyway.

As you mentioned, If this is a home game. You could ask your GM to make the final prodcut weapon have the Double Weapon property.

Double: You can use a double weapon to fight as if fighting with two weapons, but if you do, you incur all the normal attack penalties associated with fighting with two weapons, just as if you were using a one-handed weapon and a light weapon. You can choose to wield one end of a double weapon two-handed, but it cannot be used as a double weapon when wielded in this way—only one end of the weapon can be used in any given round.

[Claxon]

The bayonet, as far as I recall, is its own separate weapon that doesn't gain any real benefit to being attached to the rifle (by which I mean magical enhancements).

The problem you run into is that both the rifle and the bayonet are listed as two handed weapons.

Which means each weapon requires two hands worth of effort to wield.

And if you go dredging through the forums you will learn that every creatures has only two hands of effort they are allowed to use each round.

So in the same way you can't two weapon fight with two great swords, you also can't do it with these.