If an enemy is hit with a Dazing, Tenacious Aqueous Orb, if an enemy caster used dispel magic on it would the orb and the dazing effect on its victims end immediately?
The orb persists for a while as per Tenacious Spell.
Whether or not the orb is made Tenacious, the daze from Dazing Spell doesn't automatically end when the spell ends, so the dispel doesn't end it early.
Note that Tenacious Spell doesn't extend the duration of the daze.
Ok. This is sticky.
Personally, because dazing is very very strong, I enforce rules (some might say loopholes) strenuously.
So, in my book Aqueous Orb is not a candidate for Dazing, just as Touch of Idiocy is not.
Dazing states: When a creature takes damage from this spell, they become dazed for a number of rounds equal to the original level of the spell.
Since Aqueous Orb does not inflict damage, but subdual dmg - no daze.
However, amusingly, you could do quickened dazing, tenacious magic missiles, and then dismiss the dazing effect, thereby causing it to extend to 1d4 rounds.
Fuzzy,
Rules Debate:
I tend to favor that spells must themselves cause damage, in order to be daze eligible.
Ie, you can't have dazing summon monster. The spell didn't cause the damage, the effect created by the spell did, aka: no daze effect.
On the other hand, targeting a dispel magic on a summoned monster (effect) ends the spell (summon monster) that is sustaining the effect.
In like manner targeting a dazed creature could successfully dispel the sustaining the daze effect. Or in the case of tenacious, trigger the 1d4 duration.
Ok. This is sticky.
Personally, because dazing is very very strong, I enforce rules (some might say loopholes) strenuously.
So, in my book Aqueous Orb is not a candidate for Dazing, just as Touch of Idiocy is not.
Dazing states: When a creature takes damage from this spell, they become dazed for a number of rounds equal to the original level of the spell.
Since Aqueous Orb does not inflict damage, but subdual dmg - no daze.
However, amusingly, you could do quickened dazing, tenacious magic missiles, and then dismiss the dazing effect, thereby causing it to extend to 1d4 rounds.
It depends on whether you consider non-lethal damage as damage. There's endless debates on this topic because it's ambiguous wording.
Personally, I consider non-lethal damage as damage. You still get knocked out, and you can still die from excessive non-lethal damage. /shrug
I suppose if you have a GM where non-lethal damage isn't considered damage, you can still do a Dazing Flaming Sphere or a Dazing Sickening Entangle spell. Entangle does cause 1 damage on a failed save.
If an enemy is hit with a Dazing, Tenacious Aqueous Orb, if an enemy caster used dispel magic on it would the orb and the dazing effect on its victims end immediately?
To answer your question Atalius, a Dazing, Tenacious <any spell> would persist as a Dazing <any spell> until the dispel actually happens, then the entire spell is dispelled.
However, amusingly, you could do quickened dazing, tenacious magic missiles, and then dismiss the dazing effect, thereby causing it to extend to 1d4 rounds.
Absolutely not. Magic Missiles are instantaneous and have no duration. But more importantly, Tenacious spell does not extend the duration of a spell, except if it is dispelled or dismissed and only up to the maximum duration of the spell that was dispelled.
If a tenacious spell is dispelled or dismissed, it lasts for 1d4 further rounds (to a maximum of the spell’s normal duration)
So I have no idea where you're getting that information or what rule you might be thinking of, but what you said is impossible.
Also it's not clear if Dazing Spell's daze duration is something Tenacious Spell is capable of affecting. I would say yes, but I can see how other GMs might say no.
I would say no to that. The way that Tenacious Spell is worded, it's clearly meant to affect the original spell, and not the metamagic feats also present on the spell. "It says what it does and it does what it says." If it were the intent of the developers that Tenacious Spell affected other Metamagic Feats present on the spell, it would say so.
Fuzzy,
Rules Debate:I tend to favor that spells must themselves cause damage, in order to be daze eligible.
Ie, you can't have dazing summon monster. The spell didn't cause the damage, the effect created by the spell did, aka: no daze effect.
Sure. But nonlethal damage counts too.
On the other hand, targeting a dispel magic on a summoned monster (effect) ends the spell (summon monster) that is sustaining the effect.
Yup.
In like manner targeting a dazed creature could successfully dispel the sustaining the daze effect. Or in the case of tenacious, trigger the 1d4 duration.
IMO the daze is not being sustained. You're just hit with it. (Unless the spell itself specifies that it causes daze, not just the metamagic.) I realize it's debatable, though.