The following came up today:
Display this card next to your deck. [Good things happen while displayed.]
At the end of your turn, if you do not have the Arcane or Divine skill, banish this card; otherwise, you may succeed at an Arcane or Divine 18 check to recharge or to continue displaying this card; otherwise, discard it.
Do you first decide whether to recharge or continue displaying this card and then make the check, or do you first make the check and decide afterwards? If you do first make the check and decide afterwards, is it a check to recharge a spell even if you decide to continue to display it?
I'm asking because I'm not sure if CD Seltiyel power is applicable when I want to continue to display the card:
You may recharge a weapon ([] or any boon) to succeed at your check to recharge a spell.
There are numerous other cards/powers that care about checks that recharge your spell, so I'd like to know in general if this is the case if I want to continue to display the Winds of Vengeance.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
My gut says decide first, then roll. I don't have anything to back that up other than knowing that it is a check to recharge fixes the problem you present.
I'd agree with choosing* first. In what other scenarios are you rolling dice without knowing what you are rolling them for? If it is a check to defeat or acquire with multiple skills listed then the rules very clearly define that you determine the skill you're using, then determine the difficulty, etc., all before actually rolling the dice.
I think it would follow that in such a case you would pick what you are attempting to do before the "Play cards and use powers that affect your check (optional)" and "Attempt the Roll" steps.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
So it normally doesn't matter, because the result of the roll isn't useful information for making the decision. So there isn't necessarily an existing answer.
It only matters insofar as whether it's a "roll to recharge" or not. Pretending you might recharge, using a power that depends on it, then choosing the other option feels pretty sketchy to me, even if it was technically allowed. I would question whether a "roll to (recharge or display)" qualifies as a "roll to recharge" anyway, they're not exactly the same thing. The whole situation makes a lot more sense if you choose first.
Choose-then-roll seems more consistent with the rest of the game generally, powers that you can use after you roll are not the default and are very explicit about being such.
PS redeux you've written "I'd agree with rolling first" but everything else you wrote suggests you actually meant "I'd agree with choosing first"
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I agree that you need to choose first.
Initially, I was leaning the other way and I didn't see Seltyel's power as particularly overpowered. However, by that token, every Sorcerer would be able able to continuously display WoV at no cost whatsoever, and THAT stroke me as a bit too overpowered to be the intent, so it made me revisit the wording.
On second reading, I think I would parse WoV's instruction as follows:
"you may succeed at an Arcane or Divine 18 check to recharge this card
OR
you may succeed at an Arcane or Divine 18 check to continue displaying this card"
While not feasible for space reasons, the above would probably be the optimal wording, and it leaves no place for different interpretations: you may auto-recharge WoV with Seltyel/Sorcerer OR you may attempt the check to continue displaying WoV.
Also if they wanted you to choose second they could have written it:
"At the end of your turn ... you may make an Arcane or Divine 18 check. If you succeed, you may choose to either recharge or continue displaying this card."
Note that especially with this wording, I'd argue it would not technically be a "check to recharge" regardless of what you choose to do. So possibly be thankful they let you choose first so that it can be a check to recharge at all ;)
My intuition agrees with what seems the consensus here (choose first) and that's how we ruled it, but I'd still like an official ruling.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
For me it's not a matter of intuition. Mike was pretty clear when he added that part to the rules (bold = emphasize mine) :
Choices Matter. Your choices have consequences. Once you choose cards for your character, you can’t trade them for other cards whenever you like. If a location makes you choose between attempting a check or banishing a card before closing it, you can’t attempt the check and then banish the card if you fail. .... Every choice matters—take your choices seriously.
IMHO, even if the case seems a little bit unclear, that major rule applies.