Should I change the bonus to skills from Skill Focus or class abilities to untyped?

[Michael Haneline]

So, as GM, I think it is really silly that the Skill Focus feat does not stack with the class features that give a scaling bonus to a skill, since they are all insight bonuses. A star shaman mystic that takes skill focus Pilot is effectively punished by having a class feature that does nothing until level 11... at which they have feat which does nothing instead, and this same problem applies to many other classes.

So I'm thinking of either changing the scaling skill bonuses from class abilities to untyped or changing the bonus from the Skill Focus feat to untyped. Which do you think would be a more balanced change? I'm leaning toward the class features being untyped?

[GM Rednal]

I'd change the class ability to untyped - that's less likely to have weird interactions with other feats.

[Hiruma Kai]

If I were inclined to modify the game in that direction, I'd just give the classes other than Operative a minimum of +3 insight bonus (effectively giving them the feat for free) in those scaling insight bonuses. Alternatively, once their bonus becomes +3, let them retrain the skill focus feat for free if they take it once their class bonuses become +3.

Since Operatives already get two free Skill Focus feats, and get other benefits from having Skill Focus, I'd leave them as is.

This way skill bonuses stay roughly at the same maximum value as now, and players don't feel as obligated to take a Star Shaman Mystic or Operative to be a pilot. Your suggestion lets them get +1 to +7 more than another classes can get in piloting - right now its +0 (through level 7)to +4 (at level 20) more.

Those are my 2 cents.

[Ciaran Barnes]

Call everything from a feat a “feat” bonus?

[GM Rednal]

@Ciaran: Not recommended. Feats sometimes give different sorts of bonuses, and if that were a general rule, it could lead to some strange interactions, and potentially even hamper certain builds.

[Malk_Content]

I just let my players retrain if something becomes redundant.

[QuidEst]

I wouldn't change it, or I'd allow retrains if you took the feat with a feat slot (rather than had it granted by your class). The retrained feat should be one they qualified for at the level they took Skill Focus. Skill Focus (Fly) is a poor choice if it's going to be made redundant, but if a player wants to spend a feat for something that will only benefit them until a certain level, that's their call. The trouble with any other fix is that skill DCs assume you can't stack Skill Focus with class-granted bonuses, and Operative is actually balanced around not stacking its bonus with Skill Focus.