touch spells discharging after the round they are cast

[Cody Sanderson]

in relation to the held touch spells rule:

Holding the Charge: If you don’t discharge the spell in the round when you cast the spell, you can hold the charge indefinitely. You can continue to make touch attacks round after round. If you touch anything or anyone while holding a charge, even unintentionally, the spell discharges. If you cast another spell, the touch spell dissipates. You can touch one friend as a standard action or up to six friends as a full-round action. Alternatively, you may make a normal unarmed attack (or an attack with a natural weapon) while holding a charge. In this case, you aren’t considered armed and you provoke attacks of opportunity as normal for the attack. If your unarmed attack or natural weapon attack normally doesn’t provoke attacks of opportunity, neither does this attack. If the attack hits, you deal normal damage for your unarmed attack or natural weapon and the spell discharges. If the attack misses, you are still holding the charge.

would a cure light wounds spell be discharged to a glass bottle, with or without effect?

if you are holding a cure light wounds spell, can you free action discharge the spell onto yourself, with the concept you are always touching yourself?

[Mathmuse]

Cody Sanderson wrote:

would a cure light wounds spell be discharged to a glass bottle, with or without effect?

Glass bottles cannot hold charges, so trying to put a held charge into one would waste the charge.

Cody Sanderson wrote:

if you are holding a cure light wounds spell, can you free action discharge the spell onto yourself, with the concept you are always touching yourself?

If you use the reasoning that you are always touching yourself, then by extension, all touch spells you cast will always affect yourself instead of another creature. The held charage is something you control, and the action to use something you control is typically a standard action.

[Cody Sanderson]

Mathmuse wrote:

Cody Sanderson wrote:

would a cure light wounds spell be discharged to a glass bottle, with or without effect?

Glass bottles cannot hold charges, so trying to put a held charge into one would waste the charge.

Cody Sanderson wrote:

if you are holding a cure light wounds spell, can you free action discharge the spell onto yourself, with the concept you are always touching yourself?

If you use the reasoning that you are always touching yourself, then by extension, all touch spells you cast will always affect yourself instead of another creature. The held charge is something you control, and the action to use something you control is typically a standard action.

the glass bottle question is not a can it hold the charge, but would the spell be discharged with or without effect due to "accidental touch" after the turn you cast the spell.

[MrCharisma]

Cody Sanderson wrote:

the glass bottle question is not a can it hold the charge, but would the spell be discharged with or without effect due to "accidental touch" after the turn you cast the spell.

Yes you would waste the charge.

I believe there was a ruling at some point that said a touch spell is attached to a limb, so if you cast it with your left hand, you can pick stuff up with your right hand without discharging the spell. I don't remember where I remember that from though, so I could be wrong =P

I don't know if it will specifically help with this question, but I always recommend reading GRICK'S GUIDE TO TOUCH SPELLS. Mandatory for a Magus, but still really great for anyone wanting to use touch spells.

[Gisher]

MrCharisma wrote:

Cody Sanderson wrote:

the glass bottle question is not a can it hold the charge, but would the spell be discharged with or without effect due to "accidental touch" after the turn you cast the spell.

Yes you would waste the charge.

I believe there was a ruling at some point that said a touch spell is attached to a limb, so if you cast it with your left hand, you can pick stuff up with your right hand without discharging the spell. I don't remember where I remember that from though, so I could be wrong =P
...

You might be thinking of this FAQ.

FAQ wrote:

]Magus: Can a magus use spellstrike (page 10) to cast a touch spell, move, and make a melee attack with a weapon to deliver the touch spell, all in the same round?

Yes. Other than deploying the spell with a melee weapon attack instead of a melee touch attack, the magus spellstrike ability doesn’t change the normal rules for using touch spells in combat (Core Rulebook page 185). So, just like casting a touch spell, a magus could use spellstrike to cast a touch spell, take a move toward an enemy, then (as a free action) make a melee attack with his weapon to deliver the spell.

On a related topic, the magus touching his held weapon doesn’t count as “touching anything or anyone” when determining if he discharges the spell. A magus could even use the spellstrike ability, miss with his melee attack to deliver the spell, be disarmed by an opponent (or drop the weapon voluntarily, for whatever reason), and still be holding the charge in his hand, just like a normal spellcaster. Furthermore, the weaponless magus could pick up a weapon (even that same weapon) with that hand without automatically discharging the spell, and then attempt to use the weapon to deliver the spell. However, if the magus touches anything other than a weapon with that hand (such as retrieving a potion), that discharges the spell as normal.

Basically, the spellstrike gives the magus more options when it comes to delivering touch spells; it’s not supposed to make it more difficult for the magus to use touch spells.

It specifically says that the charge is held in a hand.

[MrCharisma]

Thanks Gisher, that might be it. I thought there was something that spelled it out a little more obviously than that. I might be thinking of a post by a Developer or something (which would mean it's not necessarily RAW), or even something from a different edition.
If you're not sure, consult with your GM, having the spell in 1 hand doesn't seem unreasonable, but as long as you're on the same page before you cast the spell you won't have any big surprises.
I don't play PFS, does anyone have any experience with how they handle it? (that would probably give us a good guide)

[Cevah]

The problem with the automatic discharge when you touch something is walking, standing, wearing clothes. Since there is no defined location for where the charge is stored, any part of you touching anything would discharge.
[The faq is indicating the charge could be sill in hand, not that it must be in hand. It could be delivered by kick, head-but, or other touch.]

If I walked 5', I would touch the ground. Spell discharged. If I touch a weapon to grab it and attack, the spell discharges.

Since this was deemed to be to Gygaxian and thus make it almost impossible to hold a charge, I believe they went to requiring an intentional touch for the discharge.

Check out this FAQ:
Touch Spells: Does wearing a gauntlet, cestus, or similar glove-like weapon count as "touching anything" for the purpose of accidentally discharging a held touch spell?
No.

Also, I believe their was a ruling that a monk hitting someone with a held spell did not cause a discharge, since the discharge requires an active intent by the holder.

As to the bottle, yes, you can discharge into the bottle, but since it is not a valid target, no effect happens.

As to touching yourself, you can always do that.

/cevah