Custom rod pricing

[Bashamo]

I want to create a rod that contains two +2 metamagic feats (not to be used simultaneously), counts as a weapon (sword cane), and gives two stats a +5 competence bonus, but I'm having trouble estimating the cost.
The base price for a mid-strength +2 metamagic rod is 73000
The base price for competence bonuses are Bonus^2*100
I haven't seen guidelines for making a rod count as a weapon, although many of them double as maces, clubs, etc.
Being slotless doubles the price (does this even apply to weapons and rods?)
The biggest issue is the order of operations using the following formula from Magic Item Creation. Metamagic is similar to metamagic, and skill bonuses are similar to skill bonuses, so do I do some funky formula nesting to get the final cost, or just use the Multiple Different Abilities formula since they aren't all similar to one another?

Multiple Similar Abilities:

For items with multiple similar abilities that don't take up space on a character's body, use the following formula: Calculate the price of the single most costly ability, then add 75% of the value of the next most costly ability, plus 1/2 the value of any other abilities.

Multiple Different Abilities:

Abilities such as an attack roll bonus or saving throw bonus and a spell-like function are not similar, and their values are simply added together to determine the cost. For items that take up a space on a character's body, each additional power not only has no discount but instead has a 50% increase in price.

[Wheldrake]

A single rod that can do two different metamagic feats is a huge boon, since it saves on action economy to switch out held items.

The weapon part isn't really a problem.

Stat bonuses are currently limited to headbands and belts. Allowing them to be had through other types of items is a huge advantage. It's also strange that you want them to be an odd-numbered bonus. Definitely not typical of PF.

The formula you give for competence bonuses applies to skill checks on specific skills, not bonuses to stats. Unless you simply misspoke and meant skill bonuses instead of stat bonuses.

IMHO, none of this should be allowed by any sane DM. YMMV.

[_Ozy_]

Competence bonus to skills are bonus^2*100. Enhancement bonus to stats are bonus^2*1000. Typically you can't get competence bonus to stats. You've indicated both stats and skills in your post, so presumably you mean skills.

I wouldn't really worry too much about fluffing the rod as a sword cane, but generally when you add abilities to things like weapons and armor, boost the cost by x1.5. For example, putting energy resistance on armor is 1.5x more expensive than getting it in a ring.

The most conservative pricing would be to make everything 1.5x more expensive, since you are adding everything to an effective weapon.

If the weapon is more for show then it would probably be ok to pay normal for one of the two metamagics, and 1.5x for the rest. However, if people get to enchant their primary weapons with metamagics for no additional cost, that's probably too much of an advantage to just give away for free. There's an actual spell that lets you temporarily embed a rod into a weapon for a limited period of time.

[Dastis]

Cost of 1 +2 metamagic rod 32500

Add another rod 32500 + 1.75*32500 = 89375

Addtional costs for adding +5 competence bonus to 2 skills 89375 + 2*1.5*2500 = 96875

Weapon so extra 50% cost to everything 1.5 * 96875 = 145312.5gp

Not going to go into cost if you meant competence bonus to actual ability scores. Don't think I've met a dm that would allow that. Also the price.....

Personally as dm I would lower it down to 120000 tops. Probably closer towards 100000 depending on how min max my players are. After all there are a ton of ways to use it being a weapon to your advantage

[_Ozy_]

Why did you use 1.75 for the extra rod ability? Should be 1.5x like other additional abilities.

Once you've used 1.5 for extra abilities, you don't boost it by another 50% because you're adding it to a weapon, you only apply that to the first unmodified metamagic cost. Otherwise all of those extra abilities would be 1.5*1.5 = 2.25x, and you would be better off just getting slotless items.

So: (32500*2 + 2500*2) * 1.5 = 105k gp.

[Dastis]

Multiple similiar abilities
"Calculate the price of the single most costly ability, then add 75% of the value of the next most costly ability, plus 1/2 the value of any other abilities." from Core rule book
Notice the phrase directly following the first comma

Firstly we agree about the 1.5 multiplier for being on a weapon. I did the 1.5 for being on a weapon afterwards and in addition due to the benefit of it being on a weapon. It can be quick drawn, spellsworded, etc. I'm fairly certain there are no direct rules for this so I went with the heuristic rule of when in doubt about balance, go for the more expensive option. After seeing the price, I then gave my opinion that it should be less expensive.

[_Ozy_]

Multiple similar abilities is supposed to provide a discount, not be more expensive. It's usually for adding abilities to staves. Notice that the phrase after the comma says add 75% of the value, not 175% of the value.

So, it would be like this:

Ability 1 (100% price) + Ability 2 (75% price) + Ability 3 (50% price).

If you end up with an ability costing 2x or more to add, once again you're better off getting it slotless.

[Bashamo]

Sorry for the confusion, I did mean two skills.
The two metamagics in question are Coaxing and Threnodic (I'm obviously playing an enchanter), and would probably never be using them in a single encounter, so having both on a single rod isn't as economy-breaking as you would think.
It's mostly for my own sake, I was originally going to buy the two metamagic rods and a Rod of Beguiling separately. I want to craft a custom one so I don't have track what I'm holding all the time or fumble around to get the right rod for the situation. Plus I love the idea of a rod that lets me mind-control everything I see! (Shame there's not a "Reprogramming Spell" for constructs)

So it's somewhere in the ballpark of 100k-150k. The weapon component adds quite a bit, huh? How much would it cost with just the skill bonuses and metamagics? I can get my weapon separately. Are the prices given are the crafting cost or the street value?

[grudgekeyper]

Assuming you are okay with the metamagics sharing the same pool of 3/day you could get the cost down to

32500 (+2 metamagic rod) + 32500 * 0.75 (Second similar ability same charge pool) + 1.5 * 2500 (+5 to skill) + 1.5 * 2500 (+5 to second skill) = 57625

on a weapon it would be 86062.5 (or 73875 if the second similar didn't need to be multipled by 1.5)

PS There is a Control Construct spell but it's not particularly good

[Wheldrake]

Bashamo wrote:

The two metamagics in question are Coaxing and Threnodic (I'm obviously playing an enchanter), and would probably never be using them in a single encounter, so having both on a single rod isn't as economy-breaking as you would think.

It's mostly for my own sake, I was originally going to buy the two metamagic rods and a Rod of Beguiling separately. I want to craft a custom one so I don't have track what I'm holding all the time or fumble around to get the right rod for the situation.

Well, that's just the point. One of the main limitations of rods is that you *do* have to "fumble around to get the right rod for the situation." You'll need a move action to put away the one in your hand and another move action to get the second one out of you handy haversack.

Anyway, all that is beside the point. You've gotten advice above on pricing. But the real question is different:

Will your DM allow this action-economy-abusing item?

If I were your DM, I'd allow everything you suggested *except* having two different metamagics in one rod. And even the skill bonuses would have to be something conceivably involving a rod.

Your DM may be more permissive. Good luck with that.

[_Ozy_]

If the two metamagics truly share a 'charge pool', that more than compensates for the improved action economy, IMO.