I am getting an animal companion, via the Sorcerer bloodline “Sylvan.” I am level 7, but effective level for this is 6 (did a 1 level dip).
#1 - Is a Dire Ape a legal animal companion? I don’t believe it is, but I think the DM will allow it anyway (this is a completely homebrew campaign, with lots of rules adjustments). If not, I’m looking at the Ape or Chimpanzee (prefer the larger ones, because I expect it to be a grappler).
#2 - Are my planned roles appropriate/prudent choices for an animal companion?
Primary role: stop enemy casters via grapple
Secondary role: support casting via magic wands (now, before some of you lose your ever-lovin minds, the DM has already said that he will allow it. So sayeth the DM, so be it ... now get over it)
There are enough melee damage dealers in the party that I don’t think the Ape needs to be yet another one. I can summon meat shields if need be. We have a fantastic thief for locks, traps, etc. The biggest weakness I think our party has right now is enemy casters. Am I going about that problem in an effective manner? Besides, grappling is at least moderately effective against non-casters if there are no casters about, right?
#3 - Is a Dire Ape the best choice for that role? Aside from the Dire Ape/Ape/Chimpanzee family tree, is there another animal that might serve better for the roles I have chosen?
I’m not concerned about flying (I can cast fly on him in a pinch) or swim, but I do want him to be able to go anywhere I am going (so elephant, T-rex, rhinoceros, etc, are not an option - gotta be able to climb up and down dungeons with me). I went with the Dire Ape because he is size Large (bonus to grapple) and also the strongest (bonus to grapple).
#4 - I’m assuming I need to take the Boon Companion feat to eliminate his -4 level penalty (-3 for being a Sylvan animal companion, and -1 for a 1 level dip I took). Are there any other feats that are ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL to make this animal companion work? (keeping in mind that a Sorcerer is a feat-starved build)
#5 - How do I build a Dire Ape animal companion? I’ve never built one before, but my best guess so far is: start with Dire Ape stats, and then apply the info on line 6 (because my Sorcerer level is 6) of the Animal Companion table: 6d8 hit dice + CON, +4 BAB, + saves, 6 skill points, 3 feats, +4 natural armor bonus, +2 STR/DEX bonus, 3 bonus tricks. Plus, he will have acquired Link, Share Spells, Evasion, one ability score increase, and Devotion.
Ability score increase: INT (to make INT 3) so that he can learn any feat or skill.
Skills: 2 points in Language (Common, Drow sign language) <yes, I am a Drow Sorcerer>
Bonus tricks (starts with 3):
-----Heel DC 15
-----Attack DC 20
-----Maneuver (Grapple) DC 20
Feats (start with 3):
-----Improved Unarmed Strike (pre-req for Improved Grapple)
-----Improved Grapple (+2 to grapple, no AoO when grapple, +2 CMD vs grapples)
-----Scorpion’s Grasp (hit with an unarmed strike, can attempt a grapple as a free action)
The Dire Ape will only get 8 feats total, so I’m thinking (in order):
Improved Unarmed Strike
Improved Grapple
Scorpion’s Grasp
Chokehold (grapple check at -5; if successful, target can breath, speak, or cast spells with V component)
Greater Grapple (+2 to grapples <stacks>, make 2 grapple actions per round)
Body Shield (use grappled creature to block an attack at him)
???
???
And .... that’s about what I’ve figured out so far. As I said, I’ve never built/played an animal companion before, so which are the parts I’ve messed up? What can I do better?
Thanks for helping!
If you are using the ape for Anti-spellcasting, why not give it Arcane Vendetta and Dispel focus, then toss it a wand of Dispel?
1) dire isn't an option, but there is a Ape option. Now if your GM allows for the dire, it'll either have the same stats as the a normal Ape, or he's needing to create a custom animal companion.
2) Grappling works against casters okay, the issue is getting close enough to grapple them. And good luck getting wands to work, your UMD is going to be really low with the -2 cha start and no class skill bonus.
3) Croc makes for a good grappler, large tiger is one of the best combat ones and it has grab on it's attacks to deal damage and get free grapple attempts. But ape is a fine choice.
4) Boon companion should be the only feat the sorcerer needs to take.
5) you don't use the monster stats at all. You look at the ape companion for your base, and then use the table similar to a class for a normal character. There are people that will explain this better and probably show examples.
Loremaster Howlin wrote: If you are using the ape for Anti-spellcasting, why not give it Arcane Vendetta and Dispel focus, then toss it a wand of Dispel? I had not discovered those in my searching, but it sounds like what I'm looking for.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but if the Ape is using a wand of Dispel Magic, Dispel Focus would not help him because the magic comes from the wand, not the Ape's spellcasting ability (which he doesn't have)?
Chess Pwn wrote: good luck getting wands to work, your UMD is going to be really low with the -2 cha start and no class skill bonus. As I was researching for this, I read somewhere on the forums (but don't have it at hand), that a familiar using a wand use the characters UMD (mine is amazing). The DM already said that the mechanics for my animal companion using a wand would be the same as for a familiar using a wand, so I believe I am going to be okay there?
Chess Pwn wrote: you don't use the monster stats at all. You look at the ape companion for your base, and then use the table similar to a class for a normal character. There are people that will explain this better and probably show examples. I believe you are referring to the "Animal Companion" table that I pulled info from for my original post, correct?
Good to know on not starting with the monster's stats. I'll look at customizing an Ape into a Dire Ape.
Pantastic wrote: Loremaster Howlin wrote: If you are using the ape for Anti-spellcasting, why not give it Arcane Vendetta and Dispel focus, then toss it a wand of Dispel? I had not discovered those in my searching, but it sounds like what I'm looking for.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but if the Ape is using a wand of Dispel Magic, Dispel Focus would not help him because the magic comes from the wand, not the Ape's spellcasting ability (which he doesn't have)? Ah, My mistake, I had forgotten that, and that you need to be able to CAST dispel to get Dispel focus.
Arcane Vendetta should work find though. Why not have your Animal companion be your meatshield while having the character pick-up all the dispel feats and the like?
of course the best option would be getting an Amulet of Anti-magic Field and handing that to the mini-tarzan :P
Loremaster Howlin wrote: Why not have your Animal companion be your meatshield while having the character pick-up all the dispel feats and the like?
of course the best option would be getting an Amulet of Anti-magic Field and handing that to the mini-tarzan :P
We've only run 4 sessions, but I've only been hit by a single AoE spell - no melee has gotten close to me, and no ranged. My companions do a pretty good job of meatshielding.
Funny you should mention that ... when you said wand of Dispel, it gave me the idea to strap a rod of anti-magic to his back, and just let him grapple casters. Or better yet, use the rod of antimagic to choke the life out of them after he has achieved grapple! Great thematically, but unfortunately, I'm going to bet that, for game mechanics, using an amulet is a lot easier in the game rules.
After some more research, I think I have it:
With "Share Spell," I can cast Antimagic Field on my Ape (once I can cast level 6 spells), and I suspect that will be the most reliable / most cost effective way to counter enemy casters (albeit, one at a time).
Anybody see any issues with that plan?
So a familiar just has the skill ranks it's master has, so if the master has max ranks so does the familiar. Some improved familiars have UMD as class skills and a good CHA, or are actual sorcerer to not need to make a check at all.
Your gorilla with max ranks at lv7 is looking at a +5 to UMD.
EDITED to fix the mistake Wheldrake mentioned.
Pathfinder Maps Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Chess Pwn wrote: So a familiar just has the class skills it's master has, ... The rest of your post suggests you simply misspoke. The familiar gets its master's *ranks* in a skill, but uses its own stat bonuses or penalties, and has its own set of class skills. IIRC.
Ah, dang it. Of course, being a Sorcerer, my CHA is thru the roof, and I have enhancements .... so I'm assuming King Kong wouldn't get any of those?
What about the +3 for it being a class skill?
It's not a class skill for the animal, animal class skills are listed in the animal companion section.
At lv7 with your max ranks so higher max ranks than it should have it's at a +5. So unless your GM changes that up too, your gorilla will have a hard time using a wand.
I'm assuming that you are arriving at the +5 as follows:
-2 CHA mod (Ape)
+7 UMD ranks (me)
So then, no, the +3 for a class skill does not count.
I may look at different animals, though I was really liking the image of a mini King Kong like Caesar from Rise of the Planet of the Apes.
Since I will be able to cast Antimagic Field on him, the ability to use wands is probably the main concern for this concept.
Back to the drawing board:
I'm looking for an animal that starts with INT 2, has good CHA, can hold/point a wand, and hopefully be able to stick to an enemy caster after having Antimagic Field cast on him (I was envisioning grapple).
Any suggestions?
if antimagic field is on the animal then it can't use any wands
and good luck, very few animals have a positive cha, let alone a good one. You'd be much better off working with an improved familiar if you're wanting to use wands.
Thanks for the advice.
I understand that an animal companion with Antimagic Field cast on it can't use a wand. Those are the two separate roles I have in mind for this guy: s*%# down enemy casters, or use wands as a support caster - but not at the same time.
This is a home brew campaign, with some rules changes. He's going to let me have an animal companion that can use wands (for example), but magic item creation has been house-ruled so difficult that we might as well not even try. In the end, it all kind of evens out.
However, with wands being so expensive, I don't see him using wands very much, either, soooo....... I guess he'll be mostly an attacker.
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