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The Zealot Vigilante can select several options as Vigilante Talents that are tied to negative or positive energy or affecting good/evil creatures. Channel Energy, Empower Symbol, and Zealot Smite. A Neutral Zealot of a Neutral Deity gets to choose whether to channel positive or negative energy, whether to create a consecrate or desecrate effect, or whether to smite evil, good, law, or chaos. Each ability states that the Zealot must make the choice when taking the ability, and that it can never be changed.
Normally, when a class has an option like this, they are making the choice once when they first take a level in that class (cleric, oracle, warpriest).
Can a N Zealot of a N Deity have Channel Negative Energy AND Smite Evil? Since they could select Smite Law or Smite Chaos, and neither of those have a counterpart in their Channel Energy talent, it would seem that the answer is yes, because the choice for each talent is independent of the other talents. I just want to make sure I'm reading it right.
I'm potentially working on a Dhampir Vigilante, and I'm wondering if I went Zealot if I could do this, so that I can heal myself channeling negative energy (or channel it to harm), but still pick up Smite Evil for battling evil enemies.
Thanks.
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That's pretty neat. It reads to me like they are independent choices. As long as the vigilante and deity are both true neutral, you could have that combination.
That was the next question. Could a LN or CN character of a N Deity select to Smite Evil? Or could a N character of a LN or CN Deity?
I've already done one Pharasma worshipping N Oracle/Warpriest with Negative Energy Affinity, so I'm looking for Deity options. Anubis might fit, but is LN.
Nothing in the rules say you'd need them to be the same.
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Well, there's the rule about Cleric Domains when you multi-class Inquisitor/Cleric (one of them must match the Inquisition). I'm just not sure if it applies here.
So in theory, I could take Conversion Inquisiton for Zealot and Anger for Inquisitor?
Can a Zealot take a Domain instead of an Inquisiton? (Travel Domain and Anger Inquisition, for example?)
Yes, the rule is if you have levels in cleric one of it's choices must be the same as yours. But zealot isn't a cleric.
but your inquisition levels are only tied to the class that grants it. so a zealot 2 with anger and inquisitor 4 is still only lv2 for his anger inquisition.
Zealots can only take inquisitions.
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And if I do take the same Inquisition, they would stack, correct? Zealot has an effective Inquisitor level of Zealot level -2 (minimum 1). So if I chose Anger for both, would a Zealot 2/Inqusitor 4 be at effective level 6 or 4?
If I split to different Inquisitions, it wouldn't be an issue. That's why I'd be looking at something like Conversion, which grants its best benefit at level 1. So I'd have Wisdom instead of Charisma to Bluff, Diplomacy, and Intimidate at 1st level, rage at 8th level (effective level for rage of 3, but I don't even know what that applies to, anyway).
I probably can't tank Charisma anyway, since my channeling would still be based on it, so I might not ultimately take Conversion.
Which brings up another question. A Zealot's effective Cleric level for Channeling is Zealot level -4 (minimum 1). Channeling Scourge lets you add your Inquisitor level to your Cleric level for Channel Energy. First, and most important, this works, right? Wasn't there an FAQ or post about Life Oracles basically clarify that as long as the ability is called Channel Energy, it qualifies for the prereq for Channeling feats?
Also, would a Zealot 2/Inquisitor 4 with Channeling Scourge have an effective cleric level of 5 (3d6 channel negative) or 2(1d6 channel negative)? You'd figure your effective Cleric level for Zealot levels separately from your effective level from Inquisitor levels, right? So I think it would be 5.
No, if you take the same inquisition then they level up separately and would probably lead to redundant features. Nothing says they stack so they don't.
Yes zealots channel qualifies you for channeling scourge, a zealot 2/inq 4 would be a level 5 for it's channel.
Why are you wanting to mix these two classes?
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Thanks for the help so far.
I'm looking for something that has synergy with Dhampir. Basically, something that will let me take advantage of the Negative Energy Affinity. Zealot, while it give Channel Energy, feels like a less powerful Inquisitor. Same spellcasting, but no Bane, Judgements, Monster Lore, etc. It also give up 3 of the 5 Vigilante Talents that I'd get in normal PFS play just to get the same spell casting as an Inquisitor. And it gives up Specialization to get the Inquisition. So I decided Zealot doesn't work on its own.
Inquisitor has the same flavor, but doesn't get Channel Energy. However, it can get Channeling Scourge. I could dip Cleric, which would probably be easier and only require a 1 level dip. Vigilante has the Social Talent: Guise of Life, which admittedly for PFS doesn't really do anything practical. But it's a neat fluff/roleplaying aspect for the character. Human Social Identity (probably an Ustalavic or Taldan noble), Dhampir Vigilante Identity. I'd give up a little bit of overall effectiveness for that. I only get one Dhampir boon, so having a fun, flavorful use for it is a priority.
So right now I'm leaning either towards a Moroi-born (+2 STR, +2 CHA, -2 CON) born of Vampire and human nobility) or Nosferatu-born (+2 STR, +2 WIS, -2 CON) born of human nobility and an ancient vampire monster.
One more rules question... If I channel negative energy to heal myself, then it does not damage living creatures, correct? Is there a way to be able to channel both to heal and harm at the same time (even if for a reduced effect)?
Nothing in the rules say you'd need them to be the same.
The Inquisitor's Domain class feature says this:
If the inquisitor has cleric levels, one of her two domain selections must be the same domain selected as an inquisitor. Levels of cleric and inquisitor stack for the purpose of determining domain powers and abilities, but not for bonus spells.
rule question first.
Correct, no healing and hurting in the same channel. There's a magic armor that is expensive that does it and I think maybe 1 domain's lv8 ability, death?
If I were making a zealot I'd go Moroi-born 16+2/12/12-2/8/13/14+2
Just enough wis to cast your spells and focus on CHA
Your big booster, your bane, is your smite. Cha to attack and level to damage is nice, the the CHA to attacks takes some time to scale up. But at lv5 you're looking at 2 smites a day for +2 to attack and +5 damage. Bane is +2 attack and + ~9 damage, so it's better, but it stays that way while smite scales up to eventually at lv9 it's possible for +4 attack and +9 damage to bane's 2 attack and 9 damage.
Harsh Judgment (Su): A vigilante with this talent can
pronounce judgment upon his foes as per the inquisitor
class feature (see page 38 of the Pathfinder RPG Advanced
Player’s Guide). He can choose from among the following
inquisitor judgments: destruction, piercing, purity, and
smiting. For the purpose of determining the bonuses
provided by this ability, the vigilante’s level stacks with
levels in any other classes that grant judgment or harsh
judgment. The vigilante can use this ability once per
day plus an additional time per day at 4th level and
every 3 levels thereafter (up to a maximum of seven
times per day at 19th level). Only a vigilante with the
zealot archetype (Pathfinder RPG Ultimate Intrigue 62) can
select this talent.
Is a decent talent to look at too.
Personally I'd avoid channeling. First, channeling scourge only works for offensive channels, so wont help you heal yourself. Second, you'll need feats, either channeling smite or selective channel with good CHA to use it in combat, but even then it's a fairly weak option.
Or just go inquisitor with Nosferatu-born. The channeling just doesn't seem like a feature worth getting to me.
Nothing in the rules say you'd need them to be the same.The Inquisitor's Domain class feature says this:
If the inquisitor has cleric levels, one of her two domain selections must be the same domain selected as an inquisitor. Levels of cleric and inquisitor stack for the purpose of determining domain powers and abilities, but not for bonus spells.
And zealot isn't a cleric, as I said above when I already addressed that concern.
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Personally I'd avoid channeling. First, channeling scourge only works for offensive channels, so wont help you heal yourself. Second, you'll need feats, either channeling smite or selective channel with good CHA to use it in combat, but even then it's a fairly weak option.
Ah... this part probably kills the build. I always forget that Channeling Scourge works that way. Although Siphon Channel is one that I was thinking of (heal half the damage+1 per creature damaged by channel negative, 2 per creature that fails its save), and it would still work. It requires worshipping Ghlaunder, though.
Back to the drawing board.
There are lots of good Vigilante talents. The issue is that Zealot trades away so many of them for Spellcasting. For PFS, I'd basically get a talent at 2nd and a talent at 6th within the scope of normal play. If I took Channel Energy at 2nd and Smite at 6th, that would be it. Or I could take Harsh Judgement and Smite. But harsh Judgement doesn't give access to the Justice Judgement (+to-hit), which is probably the one I'd want since Zealot doesn't get a Specialization and can't go Avenger for full-bab.
Ok, I'll rethink things...
Another option I was looking at is doing something with the Hangman Vigilante Archetype and Dhampir's Fangs Alternate Racial trait. Lurk in the shadows with a noose. I don't know what I'd do in combats with things that don't breathe, though. And I'm not quite sure how Chokehold works. It says make a check at -5 to pin. Normally you can make a check with no penalty to pin. Is it just that Choke Hold is also suffocating them, and that's why the penalty? Anyway, pinned denies dex, so Hidden Strike would apply whenever I can finally get around to dealing damage. Either in round 3, or in round 2 once I have Greater Grapple at 8th level. Maybe combine it all with Brutal Maneuver (take -5 on the maneuver, but deal weapon damage if successful) and Lethal Grace (use a whip fashioned into a noose).
I don't know... I'll keep thinking.
If you want to be negative energy focus there is 1 class that does it besides cleric. Medium. If you go medium with the heirophant spirit you get to channel negative energy on a charisma caster, would probably go spirit teller archetype or something. You don't get channeling till lv6, but when you get it it's at full power.
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Hmm... I glanced over Medium. Hierophant gets me channeling, but I'm not sure the rest of the spirit is the direction I want to go. I have to admit, I don't fully understand all of the occult classes yet. Occultist, I think I've got a handle on. And I'm getting there with Kineticist. But Medium is still a little confusing to me. More so when I look at the Archetyoes. I don't quite get how Spirit Dancer works. Do you choose a different spirit every time you start a dance? Or do you pick and choose abilities from multiple spirits at once? If it's the latter, maybe I can see it working out. If I could have aspects of the Champion Spirit, but the Channeling of the Hierophant, for example.
I did think about Void Caller Kineticist thematically, but with most of the Dhampir types taking a CON penalty, that didn't come together.