Magus Multitouch Spells TWF

[Kifaru]

I'm looking at rebuilding a magus and am pondering some tactics.

Start with an 8th level magus with a spiked gauntlet and a rapier. First round use spell combat and spell strike to cast frostbite. Hit with the free attack the spell allows, then with the regular attack and the iterative. That's three attacks and each is firing off a charge of frostbite.

Second round, use a free action to switch hands with the sword so one hand wields the sword and the other wields the spiked gauntlet. Then use TWF and ITWF to take four attacks with each of those attacks firing off a charge of frostbite.

Third round, rinse and repeat.

Is this legal.

[Brevick Axeflail]

Spellstrike doesn't affect your whole body. You select one weapon. If you're a Monk/Magus, this would work, but as you're doing it now you'd get Rapier/Gauntlet/Rapier/Gauntlet, and only either the Rapier OR the Gauntlet would get to administer the remaining charges of Frostbite.

Plus, you're a 3/4 BAB class. Your to-hit is likely going to be terrible, since you're not targeting Touch AC.

[Ferious Thune]

I'm not sure that's correct.

Spellstrike wrote:

At 2nd level, whenever a magus casts a spell with a range of “touch” from the magus spell list, he can deliver the spell through any weapon he is wielding as part of a melee attack.

It doesn't say choose one weapon. It says any weapon he is wielding. I think it's fine to alternate.

Also, the penalty for two-weapon fighting is the same as the penalty for spell combat, so he's not really taking a hit in accuracy over a round when he'd normally be casting shocking grasp and attacking. The iteratives might have trouble, but I managed to get my TWF ninja to a point where I can hit with my iteratives, and ninja has less ability to boost attacks than magus.

The major drawbacks I see to this are that your arcane pool only affects one weapon, and feats like weapon focus won't help as much using two different types of weapons. Well, also, it won't work against things that are immune to nonlethal damage. I mean twf will, but frostbite won't.

EDIT: Hmm... Actually, I'm not sure that arcane pool can't affect two different weapons at once. It says the bonuses don't stack with themselves, but on different weapons they aren't stacking. I'd do some research on that one to be sure. At the least, you'd be spending double arcane pool points.

[.seth]

from spellstrike
"At 2nd level, whenever a magus casts a spell with a range of “touch” from the magus spell list, he can deliver the spell through any weapon he is wielding as part of a melee attack."

it specifically says any weapon, makes no mention of choosing only one.

from the spellstrike faq
"For example, if you are an 8th-level magus (BAB +6/+1) and you cast chill touch, you have up to 8 uses of that spell touch attack. If you make two weapon attacks in a round, you can deliver two spell touch attacks per round (one for each successful weapon attack)."

[Diego Rossi]

As touch spells are discharged if you touch anything, regardless of the arm used to touch the item, I would say it work.

There is some wording in FAQs that seem to hint at the idea that you keep the charge in a specific limb, but that go against the standard rules.

How would you rule the same situation if the guy using the touch spell was a wild shaped druid with multiple natural attacks?

[Gisher]

Ferious Thune wrote:

...

EDIT: Hmm... Actually, I'm not sure that arcane pool can't affect two different weapons at once. It says the bonuses don't stack with themselves, but on different weapons they aren't stacking. I'd do some research on that one to be sure. At the least, you'd be spending double arcane pool points.

You can't affect two different weapons because...

UM wrote:

Arcane Pool (Su):...

A magus can only enhance one weapon in this way at one time. If he uses this ability again, the first use immediately ends.

[Ferious Thune]

Ah, ok. It was late. I didn't catch that part. So my first thought was correct. I know with Bane for Inquisitors there's the Double Bane feat. Anything like that for Magus? It seems less likely, given how centered the class is around keeping one hand open.

So yeah, that's an issue, because one of the main accuracy boosters for Magus is the Arcane Pool. There are Arcana that can help make up for 3/4 BAB for short term situations.

[Brevick Axeflail]

Ferious Thune wrote:

I'm not sure that's correct.

Spellstrike wrote:

At 2nd level, whenever a magus casts a spell with a range of “touch” from the magus spell list, he can deliver the spell through any weapon he is wielding as part of a melee attack.

It doesn't say choose one weapon. It says any weapon he is wielding. I think it's fine to alternate.

I read that differently.

"Any weapon", singular, and "a melee attack", singular.

If you were wearing a Boulder Helmet, Blade Boot and Spiked Gauntlet, you could Spellstrike with ANY one of them.

I read the FAQ as confirming that as well.

[Torbyne]

As far as the original question goes, yes, you can spell strike TWF in the manner you are thinking of.

My advice would be to do this with a Mindblade Magus since you can spell combat and spell strike with two free magic weapons at level 8 already.

I would also suggest using kukri's over rapier/gauntlets. for a non mindblade you would need quick draw to pull it off but still preferable to me over mixed weapon types. another option is the plain ol' dagger.

what do your feats look like? overall it sounds like a fun concept.

[Kifaru]

Well, it's a rebuild of a character that was beat with the fencing grace nerf bat. I unfortunately played him once before realizing how bad the nerf was. So now I'm trying to rebuild on the cheap.

He has quick draw and TWF already for reasons that involved metamagic rods. He has fencing grace. I plan to retrain out of that. He also has a level of inspired blade that I aquired just so I could qualify for fencing grace at first level. I'll be retraining out of that too and going pure magus. He has no magus archetype, a STR of 7 and a DEX of 20 with no enhancements. Usually buffs with cats grace to get a 24 DEX.

I purchased a +1 Keen rapier just before the nurf. I've been debating selling it off to help pay for an agile weapon, but I lose half the value of the rapier doing that. I just realized I have exactly enough fame and enough gold to upgrade to a +1 Keen Agile Rapier. It's a lot of gold to sink into a single item at this level, but I think I will go that route.

[CBDunkerson]

...OR get the Two-Weapon Grace feat from Villain Codex (possibly as a Training +1 enchantment on a weapon) and be able to use dex to damage with two weapons.

[Kifaru]

Wait? What? Is that PFS legal?

[KingOfAnything]

Not yet.

[CBDunkerson]

Ah, didn't know it was PFS.

The Training special ability (from Inner Sea Intrigue) is NOT legal for PFS. Two-Weapon Grace and the rest of the new Villain Codex options have not been classified yet.