Let's say that a kobold named... Jack... has been stuffed into the King's dungeon by the Royal Captain of the Guard. If it's an oubliette with a very solid trapdoor on the overhead opening, he doesn't have LoE to any squares outside of his cell, plain and simple.
But no, this dungeon features brick walls 4 inches thick (drawn by the GM on the grid lines), and a barred, iron door 30 inches wide and 5 feet high. The cells are 15 feet wide & 15 feet deep, and the door is smack in the middle of the middle square of the wall facing the corridor. Said corridor is ten feet wide. Jack regains consciousness to find that he has been stripped down to his undies, gagged, and has his hands tied behind his back. But he grins, because he is a kobold, and has an inherent 15-foot fire cone breath weapon. OK, so much for set-up...
First scenario: The bars in the door are strictly vertical and 8 inches apart. Jack is standing in the exact center of his cell, and breathes fire as the guard approaches the door, but is still in the corridor. If Jack had been hoping to cover 6 squares of corridor, he'll be disappointed; the cell's brick walls protect most of those squares. However, seeing as the vertical bars leave holes in the door measuring 2/3 x 5 feet, or over 3 square feet apiece, his breath shoots out the door and fully envelops the two corridor squares beyond it, crisping the guard at the door (assuming 2d6 can crisp him).
Second scenario: The door has the same vertical bars, but in addition, horizontal strips of iron have been forged onto them 9 inches apart. (Note that now the openings are 8" x 9" = half a square foot.) Again, Jack breathes fire from the center square as the guard approaches the door, and again, fails to penetrate the brick walls on each side of the central square. What about the center one now? Which of the following should a GM say?
(A) "The door isn't a solid barrier, your fire breath shoots into the two corridor squares beyond it."
(B) "The door doesn't have any openings at least a square foot in size, so your breath doesn't have line of effect past the wall of your cell."
I'll admit, I know what I think the answer ought to be, but I'd genuinely like to know if I'm picking (A) as a house rule or as RAW. Put it another way, I'm trying to understand Line of Effect better. Please help!
BIIG EDIT: I want to pick A -- changed now in the text -- not B! OOOPS
Gee, I wish I had a breath weapon just from being a Kobold! I'd have to use feats if I wanted to get one of those!
Is Jack a bighead? Because if his head can fit between the bars, he can use an Escape Artist check to squeeze through, as long as he made sure no guards were coming that way. Don't need to worry if the bars stop his breath weapon, then! Any Kobold should know that!
... Jack is a weird name. He should think about getting a more respectable one.
Nhirik, yes, apparently Jack is actually half-kobold, half-big-folk like halfling! Sadly, he can't fit through the bars. His name is his biggest shame... LOL
PS: Yes, I skipped that Jack took TWO feats. He's a big man among kobolds, donja know?
Well, if Nhirik's solution won't work (I need to roll his stats up; I'm hopefully going to play my first session with him on Monday!), then the RAI is a little unclear in regards to barriers in these situations, as evidenced by Ravingdork's recent Fireball thread.
You could reason that since the breath weapon is a cone and fills all the involved squares that the bars don't matter; it's not like it's a projectile that could deflect off them, and the space they obstruct is negligible (in the first scenario). On the other hand, it is a wall that obstructs creatures and other objects, so you could argue that it's not possible to pass through even if it logically should be.
Maybe add up the square footage of all the gaps and then compare to the 1-sq-ft threshold?
EDIT: This method only makes sense because the breath weapon is AoE. If instead he could spit out a tooth at arrow speeds, not so good.
Maybe add up the square footage of all the gaps and then compare to the 1-sq-ft threshold?
That's kind of what I was getting at when I said the space they obstruct is negligible to the breath weapon's efficacy, though I wasn't quite sure how we should calculate that.
If i shot a thousand spitballs at something, gathered the spitballs together, spread them out, then would i have 1 square foot of spitballs ?
Depends how big the spitballs are...?
Whether it goes through the window or not, I'd say the guard definitely has improved cover--that means a +4 to Reflex and improved evasion for the guard, making 2d6 pretty unlikely to crisp him.
1. Cover: To determine whether your target has cover from your ranged attack, choose a corner of your square. If any line from this corner to any corner of the target's square passes through a square or border that blocks line of effect or provides cover, or through a square occupied by a creature, the target has cover(+4 to AC). (...)
2. Cover and Reflex Saves: Cover grants you a +2 bonus on Reflex saves against attacks that originate or burst out from a point on the other side of the cover from you. Note that spread effects can extend around corners and thus negate this cover bonus.
3. Cover and Stealth Checks:You can use cover to make a Stealth check. Without cover, you usually need concealment (see below) to make a Stealth check. (...)
4. Partial Cover: If a creature has cover, but more than half the creature is visible, its cover bonus is reduced to a +2 to AC and a +1 bonus on Reflex saving throws. This partial cover is subject to the GM's discretion.
5. Total Cover: If you don't have line of effect to your target (that is, you cannot draw any line from your square to your target's square without crossing a solid barrier), he is considered to have total cover from you. You can't make an attack against a target that has total cover.
6. Improved Cover: In some cases, such as attacking a target hiding behind an arrowslit, cover may provide a greater bonus to AC and Reflex saves. In such situations, the normal cover bonuses to AC and Reflex saves can be doubled (to +8 and +4, respectively). A creature with this improved cover effectively gains improved evasion against any attack to which the Reflex save bonus applies. Furthermore, improved cover provides a +10 bonus on Stealth checks.
1. The whole question here is does Jack have line of effect to the two squares on the other side of the cell door? This paragraph is of no help until we solve that problem. IF the door provides cover, should Jack wriggle free of his gag & turn a bit of lint from it into a spitball, he might easily hit the bars of the door with it and miss the guard solely on that account -- due to the guard's surprising (to me) +4 to AC.
2. IF there is cover, the guard would get +2 Reflex against Jack's burst effect. Again, I'm surprised.
3. Very interesting. If we grant that the door provides cover, it goes both ways. Jack can go into stealth right in the center of his cell, with the guard smack on the outside of the cell door. I feel certain that Jack has a high stealth bonus...
4. Partial Cover, if there is to be any cover at all, seems the most applicable to me, since more than half of the guard is visible. This reduces the guard's protection from spitballs & fiery breath, but presumably grant both line of effect. I'm not clear on whether Partial Cover permits going into stealth, but I shouldn't think so. Hmmm. Or is the guard that exposed?
5. Total Cover is what I was concerned about when I posed my question. It would stop all of even 1,000 spitballs, plus Jack's breath weapon, cold. I don't believe it. But it IS true that there's no one opening at least 1 square foot in size... OTOH, the corridor squares other than the two behind the door, that is, those behind a wall of bricks drawn on the border of the cell squares, clearly have Total Cover. No line of effect for fiery breath or spitballs alike.
6. Improved Cover is what Benchak suggested. I can't see how it applies. Again, that means that even an inept prisoner can likely go into stealth standing right in the middle of the cell! 10 square feet of openings does not an arrow slit make, IMO.
What say you all? Cover, Partial Cover, Total Cover, or Improved Cover? {Add: OR NO COVER.)
My husband has pointed out LOL that the first breath Jack makes has to burn the gag off, reducing the damage to the guard!
I say that in Pathfinder it is impossible to construct such a door. :-P
You see questions about firing a spell through such a small hole when the wizard is adjacent to it and can physically poke his hand/fingers through (and also assumes that the spell comes from said hand/digit).
That last part at least is not in question for RD's fireball discussion.
You point your finger and determine the range (distance and height) at which the fireball is to burst. A glowing, pea-sized bead streaks from the pointing digit and, unless it impacts upon a material body or solid barrier prior to attaining the prescribed range, blossoms into the fireball at that point.
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Fire breath can't melt iron barsThat was right, if the fire breath do 2d6 of damage.
Against non vulnerable object energy damage is first halved and the you apply the hardness.Even rolling a 12 the damage is halved to 6, then you apply a hardness of 10. The iron bars will never melt.
... It was a referential joke. "Jet fuel can't melt steel beams."
Sorry, I misread the OP, I was thinking classic solid door with barred window (which seems appropriately arrow slit-like to me grant improved cover).
I see now it's talking about a cage-style door (all bars).
Thank you all the same for directing my attention towards the rules for cover; I've learned something.
The key question may be: How easy do I think it is for a character to go into stealth here?
- Impossible (complete visibility) = No Cover = LoE w/ no bonuses to AC or Reflex; eg, entire cage-wall of openwork iron bars
- Impossible (>50% visibility) = Partial Cover = LoE at +2 AC & +1 Reflex; eg, my door of openwork iron bars in solid wall
- Possible (skill check) = Cover = LoE at +4 AC & +2 Reflex; eg, solid door w/ 1 sq. ft. barred window
- Easy (skill check +10) = Improved Cover = LoE at +8 AC & +4 Reflex; eg, solid door w/ small, barred window
- Automatic = Total Cover = no LoE; eg, solid door
And thanks to the jokesters in the crowd (seriously, my thanks!), I can see that this does apply to ranged attacks as well as to AoE's. This was great!