create demiplane and dispelling

[wabbitking]

since it the spell says you can make create demiplane permanent using permanency does that mean it can be dispelled?

[Gisher]

Yes.

[Bob Bob Bob]

Create Demiplane? No. "The plane cannot be dispelled, " is very specific.

Permanency? Yes. And since it's not on the list of things that need a higher CL than you, it works as normal.

Now, this may end the Create Demiplane spell (because it expires) but it's not the same thing.

[wabbitking]

Bob Bob Bob wrote:

Create Demiplane? No. "The plane cannot be dispelled, " is very specific.

Permanency? Yes. And since it's not on the list of things that need a higher CL than you, it works as normal.

Now, this may end the Create Demiplane spell (because it expires) but it's not the same thing.

welp gonna have to find a way to make it undispellable,thank you for the quick reply.

[Gisher]

Bob Bob Bob wrote:

Create Demiplane? No. "The plane cannot be dispelled, " is very specific.

Permanency? Yes. And since it's not on the list of things that need a higher CL than you, it works as normal.

Now, this may end the Create Demiplane spell (because it expires) but it's not the same thing.

Oh, yes. I thought 'it' referred to Permanency.

[Create Mr. Pitt]

Permanency is the duration and and it is the actual spell which is dispelled. Demiplanes can't be dispelled. If they could, then you have to determine whether the duration of the underlying spell "occurred" whilst it was permanent. Unless someone has text that suggests otherwise, I think dispelling a spell under permanency, for instance see invisibility, the dispel is just removing the see invisibility which, in the case had a duration of permanent.

[Bob Bob Bob]

What level of demiplane do you have? A personal favorite (and somewhat cheesy) requires Greater and choosing Time: Timeless. "If a plane is timeless with respect to magic, any spell cast with a noninstantaneous duration is permanent until dispelled." So cast all future Create Demiplane on that plane and they're permanent. You will need to make that plane permanent or reup the spell every few days, but it's much better than every demiplane you make being vulnerable to dispel (or having to cast a @#$%ton of spells to keep them all up).

Permanency wrote:

School universal; Level sorcerer/wizard 5

Casting Time 2 rounds

Components V, S, M (see tables below)

Range see text

Target see text

Duration permanent; see text

Saving Throw none; Spell Resistance no

So Permanency also has a duration of permanent, thus making it a valid target for dispel. If it just said "see text" I'd agree with you, but it's very clearly an ongoing spell effect.

[Create Mr. Pitt]

So if you're dispelling a permanent spell made permanent by permanency do you have to dispel both the permanence and the spell? It makes no sense for permanency to be dispellable independent of the spell it is the created duration of.

[Bob Bob Bob]

This is the rules forum, common sense has no place here! More specifically, Permanency is definitely an "ongoing spell" and has a duration other than instantaneous, making it a valid target for dispel. It's entirely possible it's not meant to be that way, but right now it is.

[Vatras]

I have another question about demiplanes created by the spells, maybe someone can answer them:

1) Why the small limit on the size of the demiplane? It is more of a demidungeon. Is there a real reason why the size is kept so small?

2) What would happen to items within the plane when it collapses, the spell covers only creatures? I suppose the same as creatures, or was there a ruling somewhere saying otherwise? And when it comes to ejected creatures - where would they appear? At the point the spell was originally cast? Randomly on the plane?