
Artifix |

So I was working on figuring out how to get permanent tongues and so I thought I would check out permanency. However the problem is, well was that it could only be made permanent with range of self. This got me thinking though, could I have a wizard cast magic jar so that he can move his soul into my body, then cast tongues and permanency on my body while he is init, then move back. Allowing me to now have permanent tongues without having to have known either spell.

Bart Humphries |
Isn't that what every wizard dreams about, the opportunity to find a willing fool who lets himself get magic jarred by the wizard, giving the wizard a more physically capable body? Magic jar, teleport, you're stuck with Str/Dex/Con 7, someone else is in your body now.
Magic jar says, "You keep your Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma, level, class, base attack bonus, base save bonuses, alignment, and mental abilities. The body retains its Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, hit points, natural abilities, and automatic abilities." So is a permanancied tongues a mental ability, or a natural/automatic ability? It seems like a mental ability to me -- I don't think it would work.

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Isn't that what every wizard dreams about, the opportunity to find a willing fool who lets himself get magic jarred by the wizard, giving the wizard a more physically capable body? Magic jar, teleport, you're stuck with Str/Dex/Con 7, someone else is in your body now.
Magic jar only last 1 hour/level and don't put the target mind in the caster body.
Magic jar says, "You keep your Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma, level, class, base attack bonus, base save bonuses, alignment, and mental abilities. The body retains its Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, hit points, natural abilities, and automatic abilities." So is a permanancied tongues a mental ability, or a natural/automatic ability? It seems like a mental ability to me -- I don't think it would work.
I agree with Bart in this. What spells you bring with you when you possess a body with magic jar and what stay with the body is a big, unanswered, question.

MichaelCullen |
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I am an avid user of Magic Jar, I default to the general rule that spells that affect the mind or soul stay with the caster. Spells that affect the body stay with the body. I would put tongues in the former category. Now if you cast enlarge person on the body, I would rule it stays with the body.
I extrapolate this general rule from this paragraph in the spell:
If you are successful, your life force occupies the host body, and the host's life force is imprisoned in the magic jar. You keep your Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma, level, class, base attack bonus, base save bonuses, alignment, and mental abilities. The body retains its Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, hit points, natural abilities, and automatic abilities. A body with extra limbs does not allow you to make more attacks (or more advantageous two-weapon attacks) than normal. You can't choose to activate the body's extraordinary or supernatural abilities. The creature's spells and spell-like abilities do not stay with the body.