This is more of a simple question than anything regarding one of the new Occult classes, but am I horribly wrong in assuming that Burn can theoretically stick with you for an entire day as long as you're willing to suffer the nonlethal damage cap on your health for the duration?
I don't really understand it that well, unfortunately, but I *am* interested in playing a flame based kineticist. I just want to understand the rules behind it before I begin.
Burn does, in fact, last all day. It's basically your choke point. Your Burn pool and how much non-lethal damage you are willing to take serves as your upper limit per day, much like spells per day.
It's important to note though that elemental overflow can pull your Con up higher, thus saying you from a suicide pact with burn.
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When you take a point of burn, you gain an amount of nonlethal damage equal to your character level. This damage cannot be healed by any means except an 8 hour rest.
So yes, if you take a point of burn it will stick with you all day.
The best advice is to make sure you understand how non-lethal damage really works. It is not subtracted from your hitpoints like normal damage, instead it is a separate pool of damage that starts at 0 and goes up.
If your non-lethal damage equals your current HP, you are staggered, and if it greater than your current HP you fall unconscious. However, if your current HP is still above 0 you do not start bleeding out and need to worry about death.
For example, 7th level Yoon has a 20 CON and 87 hitpoints. Let's say she has taken 4 points of burn for 28 points of non-lethal damage. Yoon is still at full HP wit 87 hitpoints. She will act normally until she is damaged down to 28 HP. She has 59 HP to play with before anything happens (which is the same amount of the total HP of the 7th level mesmerist has BTW). At 28 HP she is staggered, and at 27 HP she falls unconscious. She still has that 27 HP as a buffer before she hits negative HP and needs to worry about bleeding out and dying.
EDIT: I forgot to apply the +2 to CON for Elemental Overflow, bumping her HP total by +7. So she actually has 66 HP before falling unconscious.
In practice, Burn will keep you alive because you fall out of the fight with positive HP and will not bleed out.
It's important to note though that elemental overflow can pull your Con up higher, thus saying you from a suicide pact with burn.
Well, the limit on burn means you never get far enough for suicide... but yes, the boost from elemental overflow does help boost how much you can use in a day. If more slows the bleed out.
There is no difference in your effective health between 2 burn adn 3 burn due to overflow- the +2 con counteracts the 3rd point of burn. So if you have 2 burn, there is little penalty (other than using a bit more of your effective max burn per day). If fact- it is pure benefit, since you get a extra total of +2 attack (due to +2 dex and overflow), +3 damage (+2 con and overflow), and +1 on DCs.
But yes, it stick around all day... so don't be too scared to grab a minimal amount of burn (your attacks are balanced around the idea that overflow covers both the basic boosting mechanic and enhancement bonuses that you would get if you used a normal weapon). I typically advise 3 burn for the overflow benefits mentioned above. Your defense ability is usually a good way to spend it-earth, water, aether, and air have benefits that make up for the loss of effective HP (DR to reduce damage, AC to avoid hits, temp hp that basically halfs the effects of burn, and defense against arrows for mr. "I have the easiest time grabbing flight")
So, for example, if I took 1 point of burn I could just use my burning infusion (Which I have to take 1 point of burn for) constantly without having to accept yet another burn?
It's important to note though that elemental overflow can pull your Con up higher, thus saying you from a suicide pact with burn.Well, the limit on burn means you never get far enough for suicide... but yes, the boost from elemental overflow does help boost how much you can use in a day. If more slows the bleed out.
I was being a bit figurative. Though, I believe it is possible, just unlikely, to have rolled low enough to pass out.
So, for example, if I took 1 point of burn I could just use my burning infusion (Which I have to take 1 point of burn for) constantly without having to accept yet another burn?
No, you have to take burn every time the class asks for you to take burn.
So, for example, if I took 1 point of burn I could just use my burning infusion (Which I have to take 1 point of burn for) constantly without having to accept yet another burn?
Not at all. You accept Burn everytime there is a cost that isn't reduced by another ability.
So, for example, if I took 1 point of burn I could just use my burning infusion (Which I have to take 1 point of burn for) constantly without having to accept yet another burn?
Nope. For blasts, it is per use. That is why there are so many mechanics that reduce the cost of blasts- 1-2 from move action gather power, 1-6 from infusion specialization, 1 for composites, and 1 for a metamagic. All of that can reduce a 10 burn blast down to 0 at later levels.
Heck- internal buffer (which basically lets you burn today so you can save the cost and use it tomorrow) for another 1 to make that 11.
A lot of the other talents are all day though. The extra bonuses on defense talents are all day. A lot of the utility talents too.
Does spending all of that time avoiding burn make Kineticist a bad class for being a pure blaster? I mean, move action empower seems pretty nice, but maximizing a burn every 2 rounds is a bit odd isn't it?
That's why that isn't the common thing.
level 1-4 your full attack is move action gather and blast with infusion. at lv5 you start getting a free infusion. and empower blast.
so lv5-10 your full attack is move action gather and blast with empowered blast plus any free infusions you can add.
at lv11 your move action gather goes to 2, so your full attack is now gather energy and your composite blast. But as you level you keep being able to add more and more infusions for free.
All of this is without taking any burn.
Burn is for when you want to do really big blasts.
Does spending all of that time avoiding burn make Kineticist a bad class for being a pure blaster? I mean, move action empower seems pretty nice, but maximizing a burn every 2 rounds is a bit odd isn't it?
You actually don't use maximize at all because empower is better in 99% of situations while also being cheaper.
Well, that's interesting. Alright, looks like I'll be making a Kineticist! Thanks for the help. Burn was all I was really having trouble with.
Does spending all of that time avoiding burn make Kineticist a bad class for being a pure blaster? I mean, move action empower seems pretty nice, but maximizing a burn every 2 rounds is a bit odd isn't it?You actually don't use maximize at all because empower is better in 99% of situations while also being cheaper.
The only advantage of maximize is that it stacks with empower- thus, you can go nova and just accept the extra burn.
Anyway- you should generally never try to gather power for more than a move aciton. Leaves you completely open. So your usual option is to do whatever you can with the 1 reduction (2 burn at level 11).
Basically, the combo of move empower and blast is like your full attack:
levels 1-4- simple blast; standard action unless you put an infusion on (probably blade or extended range). Basically the same as bows and blades as far as your damage goes.
level 5-10- empowered blast, when you are going for damage; basic use infusions are free; drop empower if you want a fancier infusion
levels 11-15- Composite blasts are your 'full attack' when you aim for damage. Can be dropped to empowered simple or just raw simple if you need if for infusions.
Levels 16-20- composites are cheaper, allowing you to do an empowered composite blast with your gathered power. You can still drop it down as needed for infusions. But that only comes up with high power combos (like deadly earth+grappling for pseudo black tentacles). You can do most things for free while still doing empowered composites.
levels 11-15- Composite blasts are your 'full attack' when you aim for damage. Can be dropped to empowered simple or just raw simple if you need if for infusions.
Empowered simple and plain composite blasts are almost identical in damage. It isn't until you get composite specialization where composites actually outshine basic blasts because you can then empower a composite as a move action. This is for a physical blast:
lvl 11 empowered simple: 1.5*(6d6+6+3[overflow]+8[CON, assumed mod])=57 avg
lvl 11 basic composite: 11d6+11+3+8=60.5 avg