Maybe not a specific modification but a category of modification: transforming.
2- Is there any iconic weapon from any game, show or other media that you feel should be possible to emulate using this system, but can't currently do so?
Stuff like the Switch Axe and Charge Blade from Monster Hunter, the various trick weapons from Bloodborne.
3- How do you picture a ranged weapon that deals purely (or at least, mainly) slashing damage? Can you point us to any example from fantasy or real life?
Can't really imagine what one would look like, but an example of ammunition that can do slashing damage comes from Monster Hunter. Now for a little background MonHun has three main damage types being cutting, impact, and shot. The three ranged or "gunner" weapons deal shot damage with certain exceptions those being their single melee attacks (impact for both bowguns and cutting for bow) and different types of ammunition for the bowguns. One of these is the slicing shot which deals cutting damage. The description reads as follows. "Special ammo that ejects sharp blades on impact."
4- Do you see any problem with our base weapon templates? How do you suggest we fix it?
No comment.
Hello, everyone! Sorry I've been absent. I really appreciate all your feedback.
This homebrew is very fun to work on, and I love seeing so many people interested in it. There are a few things I'd like to add, but I basically have no free time these days, so other than a few minor adjustments and the occasional addition to weapon modifications, I can't do much for now... I thought I'd have more free time this week, but things didn't go as expected...
Still, I'd like to once more thank you all for your interest and feedback. So... Thank you. :)
1- What kind of non-magical modifications would you like to add to the list?
Maybe not a specific modification but a category of modification: transforming.2- Is there any iconic weapon from any game, show or other media that you feel should be possible to emulate using this system, but can't currently do so?
Stuff like the Switch Axe and Charge Blade from Monster Hunter, the various trick weapons from Bloodborne.
I never played Monster Hunter, so I don't know anything about its weapons. I finished Bloodborne, but I think many of those weapons could potentially be represented via modifications such as Double, Alternate Damage Type and/or Extendable. Double is particularly useful for that kind of thing.
Could you point out examples of weapons you are finding difficult to recreate in this system? I'm not doubting or dismissing your criticism. I only ask because specific examples would be really helpful, since they can show me exactly what I'm missing. :)
Well for examples from Bloodborne, there's the kirkhammer which is a one-handed sword which slides into this big stone slab to make a massive hammer. Then there's Ludwig's Holy Blade which is another one-handed sword that when sheathed is equivalent to a greatsword.
The charge blade is a sword and shield set that can combine into a massive axe with the shield acting as the axe-head, it also has some features in the videogame that can't really be modeled well in Pathfinder. The switch axe is, at it's most basic, a big two-handed axe that can have the front half of the axe slide down the haft of the weapon while the other half flips up and over to form the top portion of a two-handed sword.
Going for a third series there's Sun's dual gun-chucks/bo staff from RWBY. While the gun-chucks or bo staff parts separately are easy enough to design how do you make it able to mechanically transform from a pair of gun-chucks to a single bo staff?
Some of those can be done via Double, Alternate Damage Type and/or Extendable modifications and a little bit of flavoring... But there are some cool ideas there.
Some things are difficult to make because they don't work very well with Pathfinder rules (e.g.: Weapons from Bloodborne that transform to lose range and power, but boost attack speed don't make much sense from a mechanical perspective because there is no weapon attack speed in PF).
One thing I currently have in mind is a "Twin Weapons" modification, where two weapons can combine to act like a single one... Kinda like an reverse Double weapon... I'm not sure how to implement it yet, though. Any suggestions?
Well, prior to the release of the Weapon Master's Handbook's appreciated, if a little too bare bones for my liking, weapon design system I made an attempt to model the Switch Axe from Monster Hunter basing its mechanic off of the two modes that the official meteor hammer has. Here is what I made just going off of my own sense of fairness.
As for that "Twin Weapons" mod, as you're currently calling it, I don't really have a good answer because there simply hasn't been something like that done before in a D20 based system as far as I'm aware of. Which makes judging such a thing a real pain. Sorry I couldn't help more.
Well... Probably. It isn't much of a difference. But it's unnecessary, IMO. Also, I like having the 90 ft range option. And I don't want weapon range to grow too fast. Ranged combat is already pretty good.
Would it be balanced to make the ranged weapon table:
10 - 20 - 30 - 60 - +60 per increase?
Why not 10 - 20 - 30 - 60 - 100 - 150 - etc. ?
Hear, hear, beloved customers!
We are proud to announce that Lemmy's Custom Weapon Generation System now includes unique feats for your characters to benefit even more from their unique weapons!
For now, we only have one... But more will soon be added. Including some that allow Fighters to make extra use of their Weapon Training class feature.
Hail, fellow weaponsmiths!
We at Lemmy Homebrew Corp are proud to announce that you can now use Lemmy's Custom Weapon Generation System to craft weapons that deal elemental damage! This ranges from things as simple as torches to as fantastical as lightsabers!
Also included is a brand new (and functional) way for you to craft your own magical weapons instead of begging the local wizard!
I hope you all enjoy it!
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
So how cool and easy to make are Earth breakers in this homebrew?
Cooler than you deserve. Easy enough that even you can do it, Scavion. ;)
So a Martial Bludgeoning Earthbreaker could have the Extendable propety attached to it. Does Extendable bypass the one handed weapon requirement for Whip-like weapon? Perhaps you should adjust the requirement on extendable based on that. Does Extendable have you choose upon creating the item or can you always choose to activate Reach or Whip-like?
...As cool as it would be to have the top of an earthbreaker shoot off and hit someone 15 ft away on a chain and retract would be.
Apologies, I thought I had already replied to these questions... ><'
Does Extendable bypass the one handed weapon requirement for Whip-like weapon?Perhaps you should adjust the requirement on extendable based on that.
That requirement no longer exists... Whip-like weapons can be light, one-handed or even two-handed weapons now, but they don't give you +0.5 Strength modifier to damage even if wielded two-handed .
Does Extendable have you choose upon creating the item or can you always choose to activate Reach or Whip-like?
Like all weapon modifications, the type of extension is selected at moment of crafting, but it's possible to select the Extendable modification twice, allowing you to alternate between both types of weapon extension. However, it’s not possible to use both types of extensions at the same time, and it’s necessary to return the weapon to its “neutral” state before changing it to another type of extension.
Would Extendable work on a Double weapon? Also unless I'm understanding it wrong the act of extending or compacting a weapon would be a free action with Quick Draw because it is considered as "drawing a weapon" right?
Yes (although it would only work on whichever weapon end has the modification) and yes (it also means you can do it as part of a move action if you have BAB +1 or higher).
I might change it so that compacting a weapon takes a move action, but right now, a character using free actions to do it doesn't really bother me.
Lemmy,
I adopted Lemmy's Custom Weapon Generation System for my Iron Gods campaign. The Fighter/Student of War wanted to design his own weapons and having a system to give him was wonderfully convenient.
He downloaded a copy of the document a month ago, and says the online document recently changed. Are you still actively updating it?
He took your Warrior Smith feat recently at 7th level.
Warrior Smith (Combat)
You master your weapons as a warrior, scholar and blacksmith.
Prerequisites: BAB +1.
Benefit: Your BAB counts as ranks in the following Craft skills: (weapons), (firearms) and (siege engines). If your Intelligence score is equal or greater than 10, your BAB also counts as ranks in Spellcraft and as your caster level for the purposes of identifying, modifying and crafting magical weapons and armor, as well as for qualifying for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor feat. This ability does not stack with actual skill ranks and caster levels.
I had not seen that last sentence when I previously looked at it, through I made the same decision that his ranks in any Craft skill cannot exceed his level. On the other hand, I would have allowed partial stacking if his character had 3/4 BAB or 1/2 BAB progression rather than full BAB progression.
Lemmy,
I adopted Lemmy's Custom Weapon Generation System for my Iron Gods campaign. The Fighter/Student of War wanted to design his own weapons and having a system to give him was wonderfully convenient.
First of all, thank you for using the system and sharing your feedback! I really appreciate it.
I'm glad you and your friends are enjoying it. I hope more people like it. :)
He downloaded a copy of the document a month ago, and says the online document recently changed. Are you still actively updating it?
Always. I usually almost exclusively add stuff, though. I avoid making changes to pre-existing rules, unless I see a flaw that I hadn't noticed before (or a flaw that exists because of a new rule addition). I actually have a draft for three whole new chapters!
He took your Warrior Smith feat recently at 7th level.
Warrior Smith (Combat)
You master your weapons as a warrior, scholar and blacksmith.
Prerequisites: BAB +1.
Benefit: Your BAB counts as ranks in the following Craft skills: (weapons), (firearms) and (siege engines). If your Intelligence score is equal or greater than 10, your BAB also counts as ranks in Spellcraft and as your caster level for the purposes of identifying, modifying and crafting magical weapons and armor, as well as for qualifying for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor feat. This ability does not stack with actual skill ranks and caster levels.I had not seen that last sentence when I previously looked at it, through I made the same decision that his ranks in any Craft skill cannot exceed his level. On the other hand, I would have allowed partial stacking if his character had 3/4 BAB or 1/2 BAB progression rather than full BAB progression.
Well... Except for a couple exceptions, those 3/4 and 1/2 BAB classes have caster levels anyway. And/or enough skill points to invest in Spellcraft. But you make a good point... I'll take it in consideration and might change it so it does stack with actual skill ranks/caster level but cannot surpass total character level.
Once again, thank for the feedback. Keep it coming! :)
For more feedback, the player using the weapon generation system is a newbie player who has seen how different weapons perform against different Damage Reduction types. He wants to design a weapon for all purposes, which is counterproductive. Having a balanced weapon design system lets him see the trade-offs and is giving him better perspective.
Our campaign has developed a strong Crafting and Knowledge(engineering) theme. We adopted the Making Craft Work rules, too. The party is far below recommended Wealth by Level, because they would rather roleplay being ordinary townsfolk with extraordinary skills than treasure-seeking adventurers, but crafting and item creation let them equip themselves as they want.
Hmmm... Someone asked me via PM the reason for the pricing of the Monk weapon property. But for some reason I can't find that particular message... Could I have accidentally deleted it?
Anyway, I apologize for that, and will answer that question here:
The reason Monk weapons are priced this way are two:
1- The lesser reason: Monk weapons are generally not as good as other similar weapons. I believe this is to balance the extra attack they give to Monks and other classes... This doesn't bother me much, but it does seem to be part of Pathfinder weapon's design.
2- The main reason: There are a couple classes/archetypes who gain proficiency with all Monk weapons. It's also a rather common house-rule, AFAICT. I don't think it'd be balanced for characters to get free proficiency with super-badass exotic weapons for the low, low price of a 0 cp weapon modification. No flurrying with falcatas! ;)
Okay, Lemmy, I've read through your system, and I have a few suggestions to make. Use them as you will.
Foreward: Several of these changes interlock with each other, so please at least skim all 5 of them to understand how each one would affect the whole idea.
1) Redo the damage die table, and unify it for Light, 1h, and 2h. After rummaging through the Bestiary, Core Rulebook, and looking at dice averages, here's my suggestion for all weapons/attacks of all sizes, with notes as to the maximum damage of weapons for a Medium-sized character:
N/A (Attack deals no damage)
0 (No weapon damage, only other damage)
1
1d2
1d3
1d4 (Simple Light)
1d6 (Simple 1h and Martial Light)
1d8 (Martial 1h and Exotic Light)
1d10 (Simple 2h and Exotic 1h)
1d12 (Martial 2h)
2d8 (Exotic 2h)
2d10
4d6
5d6
6d6
8d6
10d6
Fine: -4
Diminutive: -3
Tiny: -2
Small: -1
Medium: 0
Large: 1
Huge: 3
Gargantuan: 4
Colossal: 6
So a Colossal 2h Exotic weapon maxes out at 10d6 for weapon damage.
2) Make only one 0-CP be a freebie, then 1 point for the 2nd one and afterwards.
Reasoning: Two 0-CP's seems a little excessive, given how many features are 0-CP. If nothing else, that means I can put all three damage types as (or) on a weapon practically for free.
3) Improved Damage Die can only be taken twice; it costs 1CP the first time and 2CP the second time, for a total of 3CP for +2 damage die steps.
Reasoning: Damage dice aren't everything, especially at higher levels, so I don't think Improved Damage Die should be valued so highly.
4) The Bludgeoning template for melee weapons is be 2 die steps higher on damage, not just one. However, it cannot take Improved Damage Die at all.
Reasoning: With the above change, this gives Bludgeoning 3CP in free upgrades, which balances it with Slashing and Piercing. However, it would wind up at max damage already, so it cannot improve damage dice further with Improved Damage Die.
5) With the damage die progression and the limit on Improved Damage Die, redo the Slashing/Piercing Template damage. Here's my suggestion:
Simple
Light: 1d2
1h: 1d3
2h: 1d6
Martial
Light: 1d3
1h: 1d4
2h: 1d8
Exotic
Light: 1d4
1h: 1d6
2h: 1d10
As mentioned above, the Bludgeoning Template is 2 steps higher than the above templates.
EDIT: The above changes focus on the melee weapons; I've only just started to look into the ranged weapons. If one of the above changes would unbalance some aspect of ranged weapons, I wouldn't know yet.
I know that's a lot to read, but what do you think?
I had added Lemmy's Custom Weapon Generation System to my Iron Gods game because the fighter character wanted to create an all-purpose weapon. Recently, another player in the game used the system, too, for a tightly focused reason.
The skald strix character took Leadership because she wanted a spell warrior skald as an apprentice. The player, Kelinmiriel, decided that the spell warrior would be a lyrakien. This led to some design difficulties. While the main job of the spell warrior lyrakien would be an Enhance Weapon ragesong, Kelinmiriel hoped that he would also flank. A reach of 0 feet, the norm for a lyrakien, cannot flank. However, I allow the interpretation that a tiny reach weapon lets a tiny creature attack 5 feet away. On the other hand, a lyrakien has Str 5 and Dex 19, so Weapon Finesse is the best way for him to hit. And for extra complication, a thematic feat, Butterfly’s Sting, depends on critical hits.
Thus, Kelinmiriel wanted a weapon that:
1) was martial,
2) had reach,
3) was finesseable,
4) had a 18-20 critical hit range.
A two-handed martial slashing weapon starts at 1d8 damage with 19-20/x2 crit range and offers 4 craft points: Finesse 1 point, Improved Critical Threat 3 points, Reach 0 points, Trip 0 points. At tiny size, the damage shrinks to 1d4. The weapon was visually based on the double-chain kama, an eastern weapon, but with only one blade. It ended up named kamaette, spelled "comet" to honor Desna, the goddess of stars and lyrakien.
Why... hello, everyone!
I actually missed the last two posts before Mathmuse's. My apologies... I'm not home right now, so I can't give you a proper reply, but I'll do as soon as I get some free time in front my PC.
Thank you all very much for giving a chance to my humble homebrew! I hope you all enjoy it as much as I do. :)
Okay, Lemmy, I've read through your system, and I have a few suggestions to make. Use them as you will.
I'm always happy to hear players' suggestions and criticism... Let's go!
Foreward: Several of these changes interlock with each other, so please at least skim all 5 of them to understand how each one would affect the whole idea.
Don't worry. I always do. :)
1) Redo the damage die table, and unify it for Light, 1h, and 2h. After rummaging through the Bestiary, Core Rulebook, and looking at dice averages, here's my suggestion for all weapons/attacks of all sizes, with notes as to the maximum damage of weapons for a Medium-sized character:
I actually thought about unifying the tables and simply using the "official" die scaling progression (I think we actually have one now). The reason there are two tables in my homebrew is so that 2-handed weapons would have better minimum damage and faster damage progression at d6 progression (Also, I really, really hate fractional dice, such as d2 and d3. It's annoying to do that little calculation every time you roll a die) :P.
I'll consider unifying the tables... Gotta check the ripple effects, though.
2) Make only one 0-CP be a freebie, then 1 point for the 2nd one and afterwards.
Reasoning: Two 0-CP's seems a little excessive, given how many features are 0-CP. If nothing else, that means I can put all three damage types as (or) on a weapon practically for free.
That's intended, though. Most 0 cp modifications are pretty minor.... There are a few good ones, but they are hardly worth the same as, say, getting a +2 bonus to a maneuver. Also, modifications that are meant to change how the weapon is wielded, such as [Handle] and [Propulsion] ones should have an extra cost, but not a significant one, IMO, since they already have inherent downsides.
Besides, if I have to choose between making things slightly too restrictive or slightly too permissive, I'll nearly always go with the latter. XD
That said... I may very well raise the price of [Alternate Damage Type] to 1 cp for the second time it's taken. And the price of [Additional Damage Type] to 2 cp for the second time it's taken.
3) Improved Damage Die can only be taken twice; it costs 1CP the first time and 2CP the second time, for a total of 3CP for +2 damage die steps.
Reasoning: Damage dice aren't everything, especially at higher levels, so I don't think Improved Damage Die should be valued so highly.4) The Bludgeoning template for melee weapons is be 2 die steps higher on damage, not just one. However, it cannot take Improved Damage Die at all.
Reasoning: With the above change, this gives Bludgeoning 3CP in free upgrades, which balances it with Slashing and Piercing. However, it would wind up at max damage already, so it cannot improve damage dice further with Improved Damage Die.
Bludgeoning does have the slight advantage of being the "more useful" type of damage... Which isn't worth a whole 1 cp, I admit.
That said, I'm somewhat inclined to increase the base damage dice of bludgeoning templates... But I don't think it'd be necessary or fair to limit it, even then. After all, slashing and piercing weapons can take Improved Critical Threat Range and Improved Critical Multiplier to further benefit from their natural advantages.
Alternatively/additionally... I might add a special clause to Improved Damage Die saying it's cheaper for blundgeoning weapons the first time it's taken. Hmmm...
5) With the damage die progression and the limit on Improved Damage Die, redo the Slashing/Piercing Template damage. Here's my suggestion:
Like I said... I really, really want to avoid using 1d2 and 1d3 if possible. ><'
I know that's a lot to read, but what do you think?
Those are all good suggestions, even the ones I disagree with for a reason or another. You did make me consider quite a few possible changes to the homebrew, specially regarding bludgeoning weapons.
Thank you very much for your suggestions and feedback. I always appreciate it. :)
I like the system presented here.
I'm glad you like it. :)
Also the mods the poster above me proposes look pretty solid.
Indeed they are. Arbalester did give me a few things to think about.
Stay tuned for future updates!
Lemmy, the newbie player of the Fighter/Student of War character I mentioned on May 18, 2016, is happy with his custom polearm with extendible handle, reach, and alternative damage types. I, in contrast, have an irritation that ought to be addressed in the system: naming the weapon. The fighter calls his custom weapon a glaive. The fighter carries both a real glaive and his custom weapon, and the player's language left me confused which one he was using, unless he sounded downright contradictory, "I deal 20 bludgeoning damage with my glaive."
But in the last game session, that player left his character sheet at home, so we worked together to reconstruct his attack bonus and I discovered that he was adding his Weapon Focus(glaive) to his custom weapon's attack bonus, "Because it's a glaive." Okay, this player makes absent-minded mistakes often. That game session I also told him, for the third time, that his Belt of Giant Strength +2 does not stack with the Bull's Strength spell.
However, another issue related to names came up in the reconstruction of the attack bonus: the new weapon is a polearm, so it benefited from the fighter's weapon training in polearms. Polearms are easily identifiable by their reach. Other fighter weapon groups are less obvious. Do you have any general principles for identifying the fighter weapon group of a custom weapon?