I'm worried the character has to be very MAD, and I only have 15 points to use, as it's for an AP.
He will dual wield kukri, and I was really wanting to get Double Slice, so DEX would need to be 15, on top of the usual decent CON and STR front liners need. WIS is obviously important for Fervour and spells. As a warpriest of Cayden Cailean I also wanted him to be quite charismatic, a guy who's popular at taverns and knows how to have a good time. My GM is a strong believer in roleplaying your actual ability score, so that will cause problems with how I want to play if CHA is too low.
So yeah, a bit stuck, not sure how to make the points spread to fit everything I seem to need. Any help really appreciated!!
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With a 15 point buy you have to decide what your going to be bad at! You can do 15 point buy on hybrid class easy. You just can't do extra stuff on top of the hybrid class as you want. That means you have to first look at what class fist best to your theam. Then build the character don't pick a class and try to make it work. With a higher point buy you can make this happen. However with a lower point buy you will end up disappointed.
My first suggestion if you want to play a priest of Cayden Cailean. Play a bard in the first book of gods. It list bards counting for 10% of his followers. This reduces the need for spending points where you can't afford to. With weapon finesses and bard performance even with out a high str score you can still do a respectable job at damage.
My second suggestion if you want to play a warpriest. Drop the two weapon fighting and go with two handed weapon, or weapon and shield. The 15 point buy makes getting two weapon fighting hard. With out buypassing the ability requirements. Ranger is a good option if you want to stick with two weapon fighting and still have divine spells.
My last suggestion. This comes from playing with a 15 point buy over the last 3, or 4 years. Play a pet class. With the lower point buy it makes animal companions much stronger option then most players are use to. That and you can replace the animal companion if needed. NOT That you should treat it as expendable. But better the animal companion then a player.
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Going to have to bite the bullet and ask the GM if you can use the (suggested, and should be out shortly) errata for Slashing Grace to make a dex to damage build. It is expected to apply to light as well as one handed weapons in the errata.
Still will not be able to duel weald wild them. As you can only have one weapon in your hand with that feet. Even if it works with light weapons. The only current way to get dex to damage for two weapon fighting for both weapons is 3 levels of Unchained Rogue.
There's a gap between 'strong believer in roleplaying your actual ability score' and 'forcing players to roleplay their ability score and treating their skills as irrelevant to their behaviour'
Someone with a charisma of 10, appropriate 'face' skill ranks, and perhaps a trait to get Bluff as a class skill would be an average guy with no hangups who has a bit of life experience backing up his confidence and people skills.
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You are correct TGMax. I was thinking for some reason it worked like Dervish Dance and could only be used with a single weapon.
That dose not change much with a 15 point buy. You still have to spend ability points carefully. Two weapon fighting is expensive in ability scores, and feet's needed to make it work.
Does it have to be kukris? Can you go strength based and use a rapier? It's not completely optimal but you still get a lot of benefits out of it.
Thanks, everyone!
I'll go with TGMax's idea, I don't see any reason why my GM would say no. I think I'll pick an Aasimar for the multiple bonuses which will really come in handy, maybe Musetouched for Dex and Cha?
Without being human my feats would look something like:
1: Two Weapon Fighting, [bonus] Weapon Focus (kukri)
2:
3: Improved Initiative, [bonus] Double Slice
4;
5: Dual Enhancement
Any thought on those? :)
Well, if you want slashing grace for dex to damage you'll want it and its prereqs. I.e:
1: weapon finesse, weapon focus (bonus)
3: slashing grace, twf (bonus)
5: dual enhancement
Double slice may be worth it at some point, but not before these.
Well, if you want slashing grace for dex to damage you'll want it and its prereqs. I.e:
1: weapon finesse, weapon focus (bonus)
3: slashing grace, twf (bonus)
5: dual enhancementDouble slice may be worth it at some point, but not before these.
Oh wow that was stupid, sorry. xD
That's great, thank you very much! Looks like I'll be relying on my buddy for the first couple of levels to do the damage, but that actually works wonderfully with the backstory we have planned.
I suppose for an Adventure Path, I don't have to be completely optimised, right?
Str 10 Dex 17 Con 14 Int 10 Wis 14 Cha 12 would be easy with human/h-orc/h-elf. With other races you might even get better if you have better stats. (Garuda Blooded Aasimar are dex/wis, and also get See Invis as an SLA so great for this build)
Actually, sorry, am I adding this up wrong?
10 -0
15- 7
14- 5
10- 0
14- 5
12- 2
7 + 5 + 5 + 2 = 19?
You're right on both counts.
I'd go with 14 dex, 13 wis before racials and strongly consider the dex/wis garuda aasimar to get them both back up again. Otherwise, are you OK with being a tavern brawler who's been punched in the head once too often? 7 intelligence is horrible but could also balance the point buy back again.
If you want to keep the concept of dual kukri, you will need to abandon slashing grace and stick to the Agile enchant for dex to damage.
Dual Enhancement isn't worth a feat with its current text. You won't find yourself using Sacred Weapon that often anyway. Fervor will be your goto swift action for most rounds that matter.
I would use this array before racials, but I really hate to dump scores:
STR:11
Dex:15
Con:12
Int:10
Wis:15
Cha:8
But again, don't forget that this is without any racial modifiers applied.
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As to everyone assuming that an errata will make Slashing Grace work with light weapons... I certainly hope not. It'd be OP as all-get-out, and quickly make STR builds fall by the wayside for all optimizers. Ugh. (I don't like the vibe of it as written. Dex to damage makes no freakin' sense.)
One of the Occult Adv pregens is using it on starknives, and that has been confirmed not to be an error.
As for the OP, if you stick with Strength-based, you can do dual-talented human and get these scores: Str 14 (+2 racial), Dex 13 (+2 racial), Con 12, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 10 and start with WF: kukri and TWF, no extra feats needed. Putting your FCB into hit points (and maybe grabbing Toughness at some point) should cover you nicely.
Going to have to bite the bullet and ask the GM if you can use the (suggested, and should be out shortly) errata for Slashing Grace to make a dex to damage build. It is expected to apply to light as well as one handed weapons in the errata.
That cuts you down to 3 real scores, so long as you don't dump Str you should be fine in medium armor and upgrade to mithral later.
Str 10 Dex 17 Con 14 Int 10 Wis 14 Cha 12 would be easy with human/h-orc/h-elf. With other races you might even get better if you have better stats. (Garuda Blooded Aasimar are dex/wis, and also get See Invis as an SLA so great for this build)
with only 10 strength though it'll be hard to hit.
As to everyone assuming that an errata will make Slashing Grace work with light weapons... I certainly hope not. It'd be OP as all-get-out, and quickly make STR builds fall by the wayside for all optimizers. Ugh. (I don't like the vibe of it as written. Dex to damage makes no freakin' sense.)
I imagine the people that say this both have neither experience with Dex to Damage builds in play, and haven't run the math.
Neither support the claim that Dex builds are "OP as all get out" and "make Str builds fall by the wayside".
Str builds deal more damage.
Str builds have more Feats to play with.
Str builds are fine.
As to everyone assuming that an errata will make Slashing Grace work with light weapons... I certainly hope not. It'd be OP as all-get-out, and quickly make STR builds fall by the wayside for all optimizers. Ugh. (I don't like the vibe of it as written. Dex to damage makes no freakin' sense.)
Don't forget Piranha strike works for light weapons of all kinds. Also dex to damage makes sense when you slash a dude with full plate with a sword, you would never do damage but some who could maneuver their dagger or rapier into a grove could puncture well into a vital or muscle. Pounding armor harder only goes so far so punching something with 28 str wont be nearly as effective as being quick and hitting a long gash across arteries in real life. Keep in mind everything is an abstraction so the only reason something doesn't make sense is because you aren't thinking with your GM cap.
They have errata'd slashing grace now. It does work with light weapons - but not with TWF. Sorry Toxic, with a 15 point buy needing a little wisdom as well (and wanting not to dump cha), you aren't going to make a TWF warpriest
They have errata'd slashing grace now. It does work with light weapons - but not with TWF. Sorry Toxic, with a 15 point buy needing a little wisdom as well (and wanting not to dump cha), you aren't going to make a TWF warpriest
Sure you can. You just now have to put agile on your kukri instead of invest in a feat. The errata only broke some builds using a few outlier weapons like sawtooth sabers.
They have errata'd slashing grace now. It does work with light weapons - but not with TWF. Sorry Toxic, with a 15 point buy needing a little wisdom as well (and wanting not to dump cha), you aren't going to make a TWF warpriestSure you can. You just now have to put agile on your kukri instead of invest in a feat. The errata only broke some builds using a few outlier weapons like sawtooth sabers.
Uh ... an adventure path, so they start play at level 1. A couple of +1 agile kukris cost 16.6K and so won't be affordable until at least level 6, more likely a couple of levels later given they'd need more than just weapons on their equipment list. A couple of attacks doing ~1d6+1 damage (scaling very slightly), with no special effects on a hit and the so-so attack bonus that a 3/4 BAB character using TWF displays, will be a poor offensive strength for most of this period. APs don't need high op but I'd hate feeling like dead weight that long.
Its not like two weapon fighting builds get off the ground until later, not like any build does.