Level 5 for Pumpkin and me (Sylvan Sorceress with Tiger)


Advice

Grand Lodge

This is my PFS character, Zahra, who has just reached Level 5. She's a human sylvan sorceress with a tiger, Pumpkin, that loves to grapple. Grappling bad guys and capturing them is his schtick. Throwing around battle field control spells is Zahra's. Zahra already has her first charisma item. Yay! She has 3K more to spend! Yay! While she is thinking of saving up that cash to get herself a Circlet of Persuasion, she is also thinking that poor Pumpkin has been sadly neglected.

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'Ve have not bought him anything since that masterwork studded leather armor," Zahra beams at her tiger, "and he's been such a good boy!"

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Let me say this right out. I'm reluctant to get him his mithril armor because he has a growth spurt coming at level 7, and reselling it can get expensive. But he has a feat coming. We could give him extra item slot feat for oddball magic items. Or we can just put stuff on his neck and head. Here are some of the things I am considering purchasing to help Pumpkin out:

  • Dire collar -- Enlarge person once a day to help him grapple. I don't have Enlarge Person spell, and don't particularly want it because it causes math issues that slow down PFS game play when I cast it on melee types. A steal at 1K.
  • Page of spell known, Shield -- Yeah, I don't have shield spell, and I can't cast it on Pumpkin unless I know it. No wands allowed for poor Pumpkin. :( Also, 1K.
  • Amulet of mighty fists -- help all of Pumpkin's damage! 2K. Alas, same slot as dire collar.
  • Something I haven't considered yet? Make suggestions!

I'm also looking for suggestions for another feat for Pumpkin. Alas, he doesn't qualify for Dragon Style because I did not know about that feat before I started taking his skills. I'd need two more ranks in acrobatics on him to get it, and there are no retraining rules for animal companions. :(

I'm considering Dodge for the bonus to AC. Are there other suggestions? On level 6, he will be flying because I'll have Fly spell!

Pumpkin's Stats:

Male tiger
N Medium animal
Init +4; Senses low-light vision, scent; Perception +7

Defense
AC 20, touch 14, flat-footed 16 (+3 armor, +4 Dex, +3 natural)
hp 27 (+5)
Fort +5, Ref +8, Will +4
Defensive Abilities evasion

Offense
Speed 40 ft.
Melee unarmed strike +5 (1d3+2) or
bite +5 (1d6+2), 2 claws +5 (1d4+2)
Special Attacks rake (2 claws +5, 1d4+2)

Statistics
Str 14, Dex 18, Con 13, Int 4, Wis 16, Cha 10
Base Atk +3; CMB +5 (+7 grapple); CMD 19 (21 vs. grapple, 23 vs. trip)

Feats Improved Grapple, Improved Unarmed Strike, NEED ONE MORE

Tricks Attack, Attack Any Target, Come, Defend, Down, Entertain, Exclusive, Fetch, Flank, Guard, Heel, Maneuver (Grapple), Seek, Serve

Skills Acrobatics +8 (+12 to jump), Climb +6, Linguistics -2, Perception +7, Swim +6

Languages Kelish

SQ attack any target, come, defend, down, entertain, exclusive, fetch, flank, guard, heel, maneuver, seek, serve

Other Gear mwk studded leather, bedroll, blanket, blanket, block and tackle, dandy brush, grappling hook, powder (8), saddlebags, silk rope (50 ft.), training harness, waterskin, whet bone

Special Abilities
Attack Any Target [Trick] The animal will attack any creature on command.
Come [Trick] The animal will come to you on command.
Defend [Trick] The animal will defend you.
Down [Trick] The animal will break off combat on command.
Entertain [Trick] Performs tricks and entertains.
Evasion (Ex) No damage on successful reflex save.
Exclusive [Trick] Takes orders only from its trainer.
Fetch [Trick] The animal will get a specific object.
Flank [Trick] Attempts to attack and flank indicated enemy.
Guard [Trick] The animal stays in place and prevents others from approaching.
Heel [Trick] The animal will follow you.
Improved Grapple You don't provoke attacks of opportunity when grappling a foe.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Low-Light Vision See twice as far as a human in low light, distinguishing color and detail.
Maneuver [Trick, Grapple] Attempts specified maneuver against target.
Scent (Ex) Detect opponents within 15+ feet by sense of smell.
Seek [Trick] The animal moves into an area and looks around for anything that is obviously alive or animate.
Serve [Trick, Omar Senay] Takes orders from designated creature.

Grand Lodge

So this is Hmm, Zahra's player. I'm curious what others might recommend for tiger buffing.

I'm also trying to figure out Zahra's next feat. I use both grease, snowball and glitterdust a lot, so I am considering spell focus conjuration to get my DCs up a bit. I'm also considering just going with Flag Bearer feat to help buff parties in battle. Another possibility is Rime Spell, to make my snowballs entangling, but I'm not sure. That seems a heavy feat investment for just one spell, however often I use it.

Zahra's previous feats have been: Boon Companion, Eye for Talent, Improved Initiative.

Grand Lodge

My tiger companion, Sparky, honestly doesn't have a lot of gear on him. Other than armor, once we had the gold he got an Amulet of Mighty Fists - Menacing (I send him in to flank with the fighter types, who always appreciate the bonus). Eventually I added +3 to the amulet, so that his attacks could count as cold iron and silver (though he didn't get that upgrade until our levels were in the double digits). I also recently got him the Extra Item Slot - Shoulders, so that he could have a Cloak (Blanket) of Resistance, to help out his saves. Another fun feat he has is Spell Sponge (In the Animal Archive), which helps when I buff him, which I do all the time. He's my first and only companion (I'm a druid), and we're now level 16, thanks to Warden's of the Reborn Forge.

Grand Lodge

Oh yeah, as far as tiger buffing goes, depending on the circumstances, he can get (in no particular order) Echolocation (UM), Air Walk (CRB), Resinous Skin (UC), Spider Climb (CRB), Longstrider (CRB), Negate Aroma (APG), Barkskin (CRB), Featherstep (CRB), Strong Jaw (APG), Animal Growth (CRB), Life Bubble (APG), Endure Elements (CRB), and Resist Energy (CRB [I'm a fire Druid, so he needs this]).


Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

The menacing enchantment looks nice, especially since Pumpkin has been taught to flank. Unfortunately that will have to be a long term goal.

Other than the Dire Collar, some armor, or an Ioun Torch are there any relatively cheap items for an animal companion?

Dark Archive

You could get him a Swarmbane clasp, you won't regret it.

EDIT: On a side note, this spell has saved my life, my tiger's life and subsequently my party's life multiple times. A confused kitty is a bad kitty.

Grand Lodge

Bret --

Curt suggested this item: Armbands of the brawler

It's plenty cheap, but I'm not sure its worth a feat. Still, interesting for a critter that likes to grapple.

Asmodan --

Nice spell!

Hmm


I would definitely look at the Brawling Enchantment for the armor over the Armbands. Pumpkin will miss out on the extra damage, unfortunately, but will benefit from the extra bonus to grapple checks!

The Swarmbane clasp is always a good thing to have, but situational. Doesn't hurt to have one on hand when you need it, but I would say the Amulet of Mighty Fists with Menacing on it would be the way to go. The frontliners in your group will really appreciate that extra +2 to hit! I plan on picking one up for my hunter's wolf as soon as I can afford it; that will grant both of us +6 to hit anytime we are adjacent with Outflank and Pack Flanking!

Grand Lodge

Bret --

Here's another Curt suggestion:

Dusty Rose Prism with Wayfinder for Pumpkin. It looks like the cracked version still grants the resonance... At 750, and slotless, that +2 to CMB and grapple looks tempting.

Faelyn --

Ooh... Brawling enchantment! That will have to wait until 7th, but it stacks with the Dusty Rose Prism!

Ooh, thank you!

Hmm


Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Hmm wrote:

Bret --

Here's another Curt suggestion:

Dusty Rose Prism with Wayfinder for Pumpkin. It looks like the cracked version still grants the resonance... At 750, and slotless, that +2 to CMB and grapple looks tempting.

Cracked might be good for now, but no resonance bonus.

Additional Resources wrote:

Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Seekers of Secrets

Everything in this book is legal for play with the following notes. Equipment: ioun stones use method 1 for resonance and never use method 2. Additionally, only normal ioun stones have resonance—inferior ioun stones never do. Advanced ioun stones are not legal for play. Prestige Class: Pathfinder Savants replace the item creation feat prerequisite with Spell Focus.

I think our characters should probably get our own way finders before we get one for Pumpkin....

Grand Lodge

Dang it! Additional resources was too clever for me!


Bret, I'm glad you posted that information, because I never knew that about Ioun stone resonances... Boooooo!


Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

On the subject of feats, perhaps having Zahra and Pumpkin share the Lookout teamwork feat is worth consideration.

Grand Lodge

Huh. That does have possibilities. Does Omar want to join us on this?


Linji wrote:
Oh yeah, as far as tiger buffing goes, depending on the circumstances, he can get (in no particular order) Echolocation (UM), Air Walk (CRB), Resinous Skin (UC), Spider Climb (CRB), Longstrider (CRB), Negate Aroma (APG), Barkskin (CRB), Featherstep (CRB), Strong Jaw (APG), Animal Growth (CRB), Life Bubble (APG), Endure Elements (CRB), and Resist Energy (CRB [I'm a fire Druid, so he needs this]).

Using some of those things as I imagine you would is a lot to ask of the Handle Animal skill, even if you get a big bonus.

Trying to imagine training an animal to use Air Bubble to operate underwater, or walk through the air.

Grand Lodge

In PFS, some GMs make you roll Handle Animal with your own companion all the time. I've got Handle Animal up to a +14 on Zahra. Add in the +4 for the bond, and I rarely miss a check.

The way I figure it, the animal companions of spell casters are used to doing all sorts of weird stuff. Like 007, they can't wait to see what goodies Q Branch has for them next.

Since Zahra is a sorceress rather than a druid, I'm looking at Fly, Shield and Mirror Image, Endure Elements (wand) for Pumpkin Spells. I also make use of Carry Companion spell from Knights of the Inner Sea. And eventually, Enlarge Person so that he can grapple things larger than him.

Silver Crusade

Overall, a Str bonus would be very effective. Bonus to CMD, CMB, to hit, and damage. I don't know if he climbs, but it'll help that- and tigers IRL love to swim.

"Please allow me to watch the tiger fight for a while- I may be able to learn something."

The Exchange

*pops over and scratches pumpkin behind the ears*

"It looks to me that pumpkin is about to undergo a growth spurt. She might need special training to learn to squeeze into narrow spaces that pathfinders are often caught exploring."

Next animal companion feat comes at 8, which is after pumpkin becomes large at 7. Think you need to take narrow frame at 5. Else there will be 1 level of squeezing, unless you intend to spend 10k on that belt of the weasel before 7, then you should spend that feat on extra item slot (belt), as in animal archive quadpeds can only use saddles.


Is Narrow Frame almost a must have feat for animal companions in PFS? I haven't played at any higher levels and my hunter is likely to be my first higher level character. I initially had not planned on taking it, but I also don't want my wolf to be constantly in the dumps when he gets large.

The Exchange

If reduce animal is on your spell list (prepared caster) or spells known(spontaneous casters like hunters), then no. Otherwise for bipeds, you can get them to use belt of the weasel straight, for quadpeds, like wolfie down there.....

*stops to belly rub wolfie*

You need either narrow frame or extra item slot (belt) so you can use belt of the weasel. Else a 10 h dungeon crawl could mean a lot of scrolls of reduce animal used.


Thanks, Mort! In your experience, which is a better investment? Extra Slot feat + Belt? Or Narrow Frame feat?


get the tiger toughness for survival.
greater grapple at level 10.

you also should learn carry companion.


666bender wrote:

get the tiger toughness for survival.

greater grapple at level 10.

you also should learn carry companion.

To be honest, I would just spend 2 PP to pick up a Scroll w/ 5 copies of Carry Companion as opposed to selecting it at one of my limited spells known as a sorcerer. It's definitely a situational spell that I feel would work better as a scroll.


+1 enchant to armor is worth it, even if you sell it in two levels. Essentially 500gp for 6 scenarios of +1 AC.

The Exchange

If you don't mind doing the scenario without your animal companion that's fine, but frankly the frontlines always seem to be clogged up here, and usually I get dirty looks just for my animal companion occupying that 2x1 space from narrow frame. I shudder to think what would happen if I were to occupy 2x2. Would think reduce animal scrolls instead of carry companion would be better, each scroll lasts 3h.

I don't see the point of buying a splat book just for carry companion, but that's not a discussion for this thread. I did old fashioned hostelling platemail.

I did narrow frame as 10k for belt is expensive. Though belt lets you charge pounce, narrow frame you still have dt issues. With a wolf you don't need to charge, so narrow frame should be fine.


Thanks for all the excellent advice, Mort!

The thing I like about Carry Companion is you can smuggle them into places that might not normally allow a wild animal in lol. Picking up some scrolls of Reduce Animal is a great idea as well.

One last question, does Narrow Frame actually allow you to reduce your square usage, or were you simply referring to situations where you've squeeze your wolf and people were still angry?


Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Reduce Animal has a nice duration, but is Druid/Ranger. A sylvan sorcerer would have to UMD it and that isn't so easy with scrolls. A wand may be workable and would be easier to UMD. The wand would be cheaper than the Belt of the Weasel but the belt does more than just allow compression.

Carry Companion doesn't allow the animal to operate (they are little figurines) but does make it much easier to get an animal past a single barrier.

Reduce Person only lasts 1 minute / level but a Sylvan Sorcerer can cast it. It would sometimes allow the creature to get past a barrier and allow the creature to operate while smaller.

Lots of trade-offs.

The Exchange

Narrow frame lets you take 2x1 (long) instead of 2x2. If you don't have Narrow frame, bring several copies of reduce animal around. Problem is if you need reduce person, usually the whole dungeon is human sized and not tiger sized. Unless you want to start each encounter by casting reduce person (1 round casting).

Even after I squeezed my lion, people are still angry. I suppose they could make their ride check to fight with a combat trained mount at dc 10, but they would rather complain about it, since they have no skill in ride. Guide with knees, at dc 5 would let them attack fine with both hands, and I could probably order their mount (my animal companion) to attack on my turn as a free action.

Grappling is actually a good schtick, as later levels, animal companions do not reliably land hits, even with buffs on (Believe me, I've tried). Truestrike will ensure the grapple will land. Unfortunately my vc thinks that lions cannot learn kung fu - improved unarmed strike (he used to practice kung fu), despite kung fu panda, and the snow leopard tai lung, so the grapple chain is out for me.

The Exchange

Faelyn, if its on your spells known list, actually all you need is to fork out 4k for page of spell knowledge (reduce animal). Matter settled. You dont need narrow frame or Belt of the weasel.

Grand Lodge

Mort --

Thanks for all your feedback here. Reception for Pumpkin has been decidedly positive in my area because I have worked hard on being a team player. Other than mage armor, up to now I've almost never buffed Pumpkin. Instead, Zahra has controlled the battlefield and Pumpkin has captured foes alive or flanked to help with melee. He's also saved the party numerous times with his scent ability.

I already have a 5 pack of carry companion on hand. (It's a 4 pack now -- used the spell last adventure.)

I do not have Reduce Animal on either Zahra's sorcerer spell list, or Omar's clerical one. We don't have any druids that we've played with locally, but there are plenty of rangers and hunters. Clearly, I will have to pick up some scrolls, and hope one of them may be along. Or grab a wand and start upping my investment in UMD. Zahra has a great charisma -- maybe I should plan on getting that circlet and start pumping the points.

Reduce Person's limited duration and full round cast are annoying, but I could grab it as a spell known at 7th, just to have a backup option.

True strike was a spell I never even considered for Zahra, but you're right that it would be great for Pumpkin's grapples. Huh. I think I'd better start up a document to start planning her purchases and spell choices.

I really wish there was a way to get pounce on tigers without making them large, because I'd love to bypass Pumpkin's upcoming growthspurt.


Just a Mort wrote:
Faelyn, if its on your spells known list, actually all you need is to fork out 4k for page of spell knowledge (reduce animal). Matter settled. You dont need narrow frame or Belt of the weasel.

That is pretty awesome. I do like Narrow Frame, as I have also noticed much of PFS is in tight enclosures. I really like the Page of Spell Knowledge, very cool.

Grand Lodge

Majuba wrote:
+1 enchant to armor is worth it, even if you sell it in two levels. Essentially 500gp for 6 scenarios of +1 AC.

I've got a wand of mage armor with many charges left. Between that and shield spell (which I am taking at this level) I think Pumpkin's AC can be much improved.

Regarding the feat... I think I want Lookout now since Zahra's perception is crap. Pumpkin usually senses things that she doesn't. I'll brazen out one level of squeezing with the spells I have. If it gets unbearable, I'll take Narrow frame for Pumpkin at 8th.


Hi.

I'm going to make a few suggestions, in no particular order.

1) how's your UMD? Given that you have an animal companion, I'd make it better. That opens up all kinds of Druid goodness for your tiger.

2) a circlet of persuasion would also help your UMD, btw.

3) why bother with studded leather barding? Just use the Mage armor wand on the tiger until it's big.

4) it's ok if you don't have Pumpkin at 100% effectiveness, 100% of the time. Sometimes it's someone else' s turn to shine.

5) reduce animal is a scroll. 5 uses for 2 prestige.

6) save up for +1 bracers of armor, then add the hosteling enchantment. Great for places that are anti-tiger.

7) you're getting close to the point where dr/magic is common. Be able to cast magic fang, this is a good wand to UMD. Or make friends with a Druid. Or make this the next magic item for the tiger.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/magic-armor/magic-armor-and-shield-spec ial-abilities/hosteling

The Exchange

The problem with hostelling is you need medium full plate or medium tower shield in order to store a large sized Pumpkin. Its the way hostelling works, bracers of armor will not cut it. To be honest, you can initiate grapple simply by using the grapple trick(pumpkin will just use grapple combat maneuver), so to grapple, Pumpkin does not really need to be large.

However, I will strongly urge you to let Pumpkin get large, because the grab ability gained at large gives +4 to grapple, not to mention all those cmb bonuses from strength boosts.

For pounce to work, Pumpkin cannot be squeezing (thus either needs reduce animal or belt of the weasel - narrow frame won't work). Or Pumpkin can take Dragon style at 8, which lets her ignore difficult terrain when charging.

And, at the last resort, you can always get a new animal companion at beginning or end of the scenario with different set of feats, though people may call me callous for doing so.

I do not see a problem with Zahra using UMD herself(sorcs and all), with 5 scrolls, 1 should work. However, it's more of an expense issue especially for say a 3 day trip underground. You may want to pack a potion of reduce animal for emergencies when you really need it to work, NOW!

I wouldn't worry too much about Pumpkins AC to be honest, as I feel that the GM needs to have some fun hitting something(GM point of view), or there will be another forum thread opened up saying Animal Companions are OP, one of my players has an Animal Companion with 28 ac at lv 5.

As for lookout, I do not know how much you can pump Pumpkin's perception as they have very few skill points, even though its their class skill. But that's just my 2 cents.

For DR/magic, I used eldritch claws, but having an amulet of mighty fists will suffice. Fork up 1k gp for a page of spell knowledge (burning hands) and you dont need a swarmbane clasp. Carry a couple of oils of magic fang before you get access to that amof incase you run into incorpreals.

Grand Lodge

The reason for the studded leather barding is that its cheap and always there. I don't always have time to activate wands before battle hits.

Most of the time, Pumpkin has gone into battle entirely unbuffed. And I do let fighters shine. Pumpkin's main job is to sense and capture. He flanks with rogues, finds invisible, and grapples things. My UMD is currently only a +10. A circlet will help, and I have a few more levels to pump skill points into it.

Grand Lodge

As for pumping Pumpkin's perception, I was thinking of getting an 800g magenta cracked prism ioun stone and setting it to Perception for a +2 bonus.

Grand Lodge

Faelyn wrote:

Thanks for all the excellent advice, Mort!

The thing I like about Carry Companion is you can smuggle them into places that might not normally allow a wild animal in lol.

Or avoid those embarrassing situations like trying to stuff your axebeak through a sewer pipe.


LazarX wrote:
Faelyn wrote:

Thanks for all the excellent advice, Mort!

The thing I like about Carry Companion is you can smuggle them into places that might not normally allow a wild animal in lol.

Or avoid those embarrassing situations like trying to stuff your axebeak through a sewer pipe.

LOL! That too, LazarX. I've been dating whether or not to do the whole riding my wolf schtick... Mechanically it's awesome as I can take full advantage of his speed while wearing medium armor on my hunter and not have to invest the 4K gold for Mithral... I just have a hard time imagining my character tossing a saddle of his buddy.

The big question... Does a wolf require exotic saddle?

Grand Lodge

It's a standard mount for small characters, so no.

The Exchange

To play things safe, PFS and its table variation, I would get an exotic military saddle if I were you. I did so for all my animal companions. Granted, I prefer my animal companions more exotic, like rocs and lions. I wonder which animal companion I may get next. Might be an anklyosaurus. Sadly my druid will never get to ride her owlbear :(

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