
Twoswords |
It finally happened; a wild plummet into an acid bath. Down a vertical shaft trap. With a monster at the bottom. Who also dished out acid damage.
What does all this mean? And why are you reading this?
Simply put, my 10th level paladin is partaking in the Kingmaker campaign. She had gear equivalent of the GP per level. After the acid bath she now has the following gear remaining:
+2 Frost enchant Greatsword
Headband of alluring charisma +2
Ring of feather fall
Regular full plate
Her role is the party tank and she is used to soaking up a lot of damage. As I am starting the process of rebuilding my gear (mainly looking towards the magical side), I am wondering what direction to take. Do I work at getting magical armor, wondrous items, rings, etc?
What are your suggestions towards gear that will help her in the long-run?

Peasant |
How does she go about soaking up that damage? Is she taunting and provoking enemies to keep their attention? If so, build on the headband and maybe acquire a widget that gives a boost to Intimidate. is she positioning herself to be the human shield? If so, perhaps its time to pick up a reach weapon and stop a few of those attacks from actually getting to her. Is she literally soaking it up with damage reduction? I don't see any gear catering to that role, so it would obviously want to be a high priority replacement. Is she reliant on a high AC to turn blows aside while the action economy of the party turns the tide? If so, I'd guess you previously had magical armor and should be looking to get back into some. In the short term you might consider going sword and shield for a while.
Either way, were I in that situation, avoiding similar eventualities would be high on my list and I'd be snagging a Cloak of Resistance right quick. Maybe something with acid resistance would be warranted, especially if I expected to return to the lair with the trap. And just in general, I'd be dabbling in utility scrolls at this point to add versatility.

Claxon |
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Ummm...I'd be asking for you gear back.
Gear doesn't automatically get damaged, even by an acid pit.
Damaging Magic Items
A magic item doesn't need to make a saving throw unless it is unattended, it is specifically targeted by the effect, or its wielder rolls a natural 1 on his save. Magic items should always get a saving throw against spells that might deal damage to them—even against attacks from which a nonmagical item would normally get no chance to save. Magic items use the same saving throw bonus for all saves, no matter what the type (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will). A magic item's saving throw bonus equals 2 + 1/2 its caster level (rounded down). The only exceptions to this are intelligent magic items, which make Will saves based on their own Wisdom scores.
Magic items, unless otherwise noted, take damage as nonmagical items of the same sort. A damaged magic item continues to function, but if it is destroyed, all its magical power is lost. Magic items that take damage in excess of half their total hit points, but not more than their total hit points, gain the broken condition, and might not function properly.
Only if your items were unattended (they weren't), specifically targeted (possible, but without knowing exactly what affected I can't say), or if you rolled a 1 (this is a chart to determine what single piece of gear is affected and this is still a slim chance).
Go ask for your gear back because you probably didn't lose it.

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Claxon makes a valid point regarding the rules. Although it does somewhat strain the suspension of disbelief.
In situations like this, I think it can be good if the party has an Understanding about how party wealth is going to be distributed. Basically, some people are at higher risk of injury and equipment damage, because they're on the front line, blocking monsters from reaching the squishy people.
Now, everyone's doing their part of course, but it's kinda fair that if the frontliner loses a lot of gear because he's protecting the clothies in the back, that everyone chip in to make things better again.
So for the people in the back, WBL may a somewhat smooth line, going up with occasional plateaus; and for the people in the front, it's a line with peaks and valleys, slowly zigzagging upwards.

Claxon |

While it definitely strains suspension of disbelief, the devs also recognize that Wealth = Power in this game. Your character losing a significant portion of the magical items due to falling in an acid pit is basically a stealth nerf. Worse than even hitting a character with permanent negative levels.
Hell, given the choice between having my character die and rolling a new one with WBL or having my character survive and losing 3/4s of my wealth...I'm choosing death every time. Because I don't want to play an unplayable and weak character compared to everyone else.
Does it break immersion? Sure. But is the other option actually better for game play? Hell no.

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While it definitely strains suspension of disbelief, the devs also recognize that Wealth = Power in this game. Your character losing a significant portion of the magical items due to falling in an acid pit is basically a stealth nerf. Worse than even hitting a character with permanent negative levels.
I think another reason for that rule is simple expediency. If you have to roll item saving throws for every one of the 200 things you carry with you, every time someone throws a fireball, the game would be unplayable.
Hell, given the choice between having my character die and rolling a new one with WBL or having my character survive and losing 3/4s of my wealth...I'm choosing death every time. Because I don't want to play an unplayable and weak character compared to everyone else.
I think though this is a sad side-effect of WBL. In a non-RPG story, you sometimes lose gear and then find new gear. And I think this could work just as well in PF; you lose gear, but that gives the GM leeway to give more treasure than appropriate for your level. Like, you defeat a dragon, but normally a dragon hoard would put you at like 2x WBL. But if he just cooked a lot of your gear, then it's about even.

Claxon |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |

Absolutely Ascalaphus. It's terrible.
It's a great story to read about when someone loses their prized weapon or armor. But in Pathfinder, it just means you're a chump until you can get a replacement. And it sucks to play second fiddle at the table because of things beyond your control.
I think the main thing is that the big 6 all need to be baked into character progression instead of being individual items you need to wear. You would need to compensate by reducing wealth by level, but this would get rid of the complete dependency on gear and instead promote the use of unique and interesting magical items instead of just the necessary for competency.

Anonymous Visitor 163 576 |

Yeah, i got crushed that way too. *fist bump*
As for the posters above, it's a problem if and only if it's permanent. Otherwise, it's just something bad that happened to your character, and frankly, the game needs risk.
Step one: talk to the other players: what is your agreement about what to do if someone dies? Is there a party fund, does everyone pitch in, something else? (Ideally, you had this conversation already)
Step two: losing 5450 gp of gear is like dying. Costs just as much to fix, for example. Ask if the next heap of treasure can go toward replacing your equipment.
Step three: your first 'equipment' should be spells from the other players. Ask them to adjust: shield of faith instead of bless, for example.
Step four: i'd grab a ranged weapon, like a javelin or throwing axe, a cold iron morningstar, and a lance, warhorse, and heavy shield as fast as possible. The shield will be good when you're getting shot at, or lancing, and you can drop it if you need the greatsword, it wasn't expensive.
Step five. Potions. You'll need a full set of things to deal with situations, like silversheen, potion of lesser restoration, etc. luckily your saves and immunities should still be pretty good.
After that, specific recommendations include a sihedron medallion, a wand of enlarge person (to be used on you) and something to help your mobility (the horse will help a lot). Cape of the mountebank would be fantastic. Sure, a ring of protection wouldn't hurt, nor would a belt of giant strength. Then, i'd grab a few pearls of power, to hand to your nearby casters again, for spells on you).

justaworm |

Ummm...I'd be asking for you gear back.
Go ask for your gear back because you probably didn't lose it.
If the GM says it is gone, then it is gone. The OP isn't complaining and so you aren't really answering the question. I am a little shocked that this much gear is gone too, but it can also be fun. Our group has had one or two "gear resets" in our playing days and they were pretty memorable.
As for the direction to take, it depends on your bond. My Paladin is weapon bonded, and so I haven't concentrated too much on weapon upgrades, mostly relying on my ability to buff the weapon.
You need to get some serious magical plate (and shield if so inclined).
My general list would be something like:
Magical Full Plate
Magical Shield
Bracers of the Merciful Knight
Boots of Striding and Springing
Belt of Giant Strength
Other knick-knacks
Some suggestions:

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I think the main thing is that the big 6 all need to be baked into character progression instead of being individual items you need to wear.
The class defense system was one of the best things about d20 modern. (Not that it didn't have its own issues.) But since magic defense weren't assumed (not possible in most games) they gave class defense bonuses to balance BAB.

Claxon |

The GM can say the gear is gone sure. But what I'm asking the OP to do, is ask his GM if he realized that the rules state that this doesn't actually happen? Because the GM may not have been aware of the rules.
Not if the GM persists, well that's one thing.
Also, group wide gear resets are different because they affect everyone relatively equally.*
As for recommendations as what to purchase if your GM insist upon his house rule, the big six:
1) Magical weapon
2) Magical armor
3) Ring of Protection
4) Amulet of nautral Armor
5) Cloak of Resistance
6) Headband or Belt boosting appropriate stat. As a paladin and without information strength is probably what you need to boost.
*Yes casters can buff themselves into a better position, but it's still far more equal if everyone loses gear as opposed to a single individual.

Peasant |
Though the distinction is largely academic, I'd like to offer that I don't see anything in the rules Claxon quoted that would strictly prevent this from happening. Some effects still have a partial effect on save and acid in general is probably the most likely energy type to be ruled as damaging to an inanimate object. If the immersion was prolonged (she had to wait while someone threw her a rope), this kind of result seems well within RAW. It wouldn't surprise me at all to hear that the Paladin was in up to her neck, kept head and hands mostly dry and lost only her least durable gear.
It could have course have been effect by fiat, but even then we don't know that it was intended to be punitive. It could just as easily be a contrivance orchestrated to provide Twoswords with the chance to respec.
Back to the original question. Pick up some Tree tokens to provide yourself with impromptu battlefield cover (and to climb out of pits).

Ipslore the Red |

There is a spell named Acid Pit. It specifically targets gear, so Claxon et al are incorrect on that front- while they're correct that gear usually isn't destroyed, acid pit is an exception to that rule.
Of course, that does assume that spell was the one specifically used, and I don't have the book in front of me, so I may be completely wrong.

Claxon |

My first post included exceptions for spells that specifically target gear. Reposting it again:
Damaging Magic Items
A magic item doesn't need to make a saving throw unless it is unattended, it is specifically targeted by the effect, or its wielder rolls a natural 1 on his save. Magic items should always get a saving throw against spells that might deal damage to them—even against attacks from which a nonmagical item would normally get no chance to save. Magic items use the same saving throw bonus for all saves, no matter what the type (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will). A magic item's saving throw bonus equals 2 + 1/2 its caster level (rounded down). The only exceptions to this are intelligent magic items, which make Will saves based on their own Wisdom scores.
Magic items, unless otherwise noted, take damage as nonmagical items of the same sort. A damaged magic item continues to function, but if it is destroyed, all its magical power is lost. Magic items that take damage in excess of half their total hit points, but not more than their total hit points, gain the broken condition, and might not function properly.
But the OP didn't state they were subject to the Acid Pit spell. That is an assumption that cannot be made on current informaiton.