Hello Everyone,
Intro:
First about myself (in relation to Pathfinder). I have been interested in DnD since AD&D 2nd edition but I have not been able to play other than PC games. Now that I am done with school I am starting to get some more free time and I would like to spend some of it with my family telling amazing stores (no, not the TV series).
Wow is Pathfinder a deep (and I mean DEEP) game. It can be a bit daunting. I guess I could just roll up core class toons and run with it but I can't quite get myself to do that. I have done a good bit of research and would like some of your thoughts on some issues I am having. I want them to shine, so there will be some crunch, but I am not going for the max of the max build for each character. They will get a few extra perks, but I figure their lack of strategy and tactics will even the playing field out a bit. =)
Story:
On a side note, we have ran though the Basic Box 5 or so times to get them (and me) familiar with many of the rules. Right now I will be running my 2nd grader, 3rd grader, and wife (2 toons) though Crypt of the Everflame, then Masks of the Living God, and then City of Golden Death for their first real foray into Pathfinder. They will only get to level 6, 7, or 8 and then retire. (The kids want to play a Druid and Summoner in Dragon's Demand next. I thought I would keep things simple for their first big adventure.) No multiclassing this time.
Relevant House Rules:
Wand of Many Mini Things
1hp heal unlimited charges (keep action up, camping down)
As they level the item will grow with little (mini) magic abilities
Players:
Oracle (2nd grader)
--Battle, STR, Bardiche, Reach, Enlarge
Rogue (3rd grader)
--Brute, STR, TWF, Orc Double Axe, Bite
Pally (wife main)
--TWF, CHA, Scimitar/Spiked Shield, Smite/day (Normal + CHA)
Sorcerer (wife alt)
--Background buffing build (wow they are intimidating to build)
Character Needing Help (please)
1/2 Elf Oracle
Role:
Reach battle oracle that uses enlarge to be BIG and awesome and also has many AoO. Smart 2nd grader, but still a 2nd grader so I want to keep things simple(ish). Wand of Many Mini Things will help her to be able to focus on battle.
Build:
Mystery = Battle
Curse = Haunted (she thought it sounded fun. I can't wait until the 1st disarm) =)
Abilities:
STR: 18 +4
DEX: 14 +2
CON: 14 +2
INT: 9 -1
WIS: 7 -2
CHA: 16 +3
Traits:
Reactionary
???????????
Feet Plan:
1: Extra Revelation --> Weapon Mastery (Bardiche)
2: -na-
3: Power Attack
4: -na-
5: Combat Reflexes
6: -na-
7: Lunge
8: -na-
Oracle Plan:
1: Skill At Arms
2: Enlarge Person (spell)
3: War Sight
4: Fog Cloud (spell)
5: -na-
6: Wall of Fire (spell)
7: Resiliency
8: Righteous Might (spell)
Spells:
All Cure spells
Buffing spells (no idea)
Gear:
Armour: Scale Mail +5AC
Weapon: Bardiche (10' reach) 1d10+6
Weapon: ENLARGED Bardiche (15' reach) 2d8+7
HP: 10
AC: 17
Questions:
Suggestions please for traits
I have _no_ idea what spells to get so she can be 1st battle herself, 2nd buff
Thanks for any and all input!
Braxon
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http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fn#v5748eaic9qhd
Drawing a spare weapon from her belt is still a move action. Wouldnt slow her down any. Just as long as she's savy enough to keep a spare weapon attached to her belt. ( Who doesn't anyway?)
First level feat should be combat reflexes to fish for aoos. Weapon mastery can come later. Armor spikes let her threaten at both 5 and 10 ft. I personally don't like dump stats, so would run the following stat array : Str 16, dex 14, con 14, int 10, wis 10, cha 14. Having a low will save at high levels is just asking for trouble.
Would actually choose maneuver mastery trip at lv 7 over resilency and weapon mastery, then use superior reach to create a trip barrier against all who threaten the party in melee.
I would strongly suggest that she also uses a Spiked Gauntlet. It can't be disarmed, doesn't need to be equipped and will help her hit things that are too close to hit with the Bardiche.
edit: Oh, then I reread Just a Mort's post. Armor Spikes accomplish the same thing.
Yep. You are right. Use Armor Spikes instead.
Out of curiosity... have Armor Spikes ever dropped for anyone as treasure? ...like... ever? I mean, I am guessing that one always has to have their armor spikes enchanted separately from their armor. One might find armor that is enchanted but rarely spiked armor with the armor spikes already enchanted. ...and never armor spikes separately. On the other hand, I would think the odds of finding an enchanted spiked gauntlet are far higher (though likely low in comparison to most other weapons).
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With the group make up its hard to buy a 3rd level petal of power and have your arcane use greater magic weapon. Divine use it as a 4th level spell which is way behind. Typically my group runs a wizard and all the weapon users get pearls of power 3rd to let 1 prepared greater magic weapon last the entire adventuring day.
My suggestion would be buy adamantine weapon or armor spikes and for the other grab cold iron. You can break DR that way.
Also its kind of funny our group has been known to pick up a adamantine morning star to cast silence on and use as a master key. They dont even hear the door breaking in on them as the frontliner tears into the room kool-aid man style.
Silenced Adamantine Morningstar "Master Key". I like it. *yoink*
Here is a great combo. Divine Favour Spell, with Fate's Favored trait. You just doubled the effectiveness at Divine Favor at low levels, and turned it from a +3 buff to a +4 buff at higher levels.
Skyler Malik,
That sounds like a good combo. I imagine that would help her make up for not being a full BAB class (I think I said that right).
Thanks!
Braxon
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Here is a great combo. Divine Favour Spell, with Fate's Favored trait. You just doubled the effectiveness at Divine Favor at low levels, and turned it from a +3 buff to a +4 buff at higher levels.Skyler Malik,
That sounds like a good combo. I imagine that would help her make up for not being a full BAB class (I think I said that right).
Thanks!
Braxon
Sir it is a great combo as fate favored works on items she can get later. Jingasa of the Fortunate Soldier for Luck bonus to AC, and Stone of Good Luck (probably the best use of the trait)
Armor spikes> spiked gauntlet
mostly because armor spikes add defense/offense to a grapple on top of not being disarmed.
I just looked up Armor Spikes. They seem quite cool. I like that she will be able to threaten at 5' too.
How do they add defense to a grapple? I might be missing something.
Thanks,
Braxon
http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fn#v5748eaic9qhd
Drawing a spare weapon from her belt is still a move action. Wouldnt slow her down any. Just as long as she's savy enough to keep a spare weapon attached to her belt. ( Who doesn't anyway?)
The funny thing will be when she gets disarmed and fly's 10' away. I don't think she has thought about what that will be like in combat.
When we gear up she will have a spare weapons, but I bet it will be put in her pack for the first time. They (and me too) are very, very green. They attacked with their weapons but forgot to pull them out while walking to the big bad cave. The next time we played they did it again (same cave). haHA! =)
First level feat should be combat reflexes to fish for aoos. Weapon mastery can come later. Armor spikes let her threaten at both 5 and 10 ft. I personally don't like dump stats, so would run the following stat array : Str 16, dex 14, con 14, int 10, wis 10, cha 14. Having a low will save at high levels is just asking for trouble.
I like the idea of Combat Reflexes 1st to get more AoO and Armor Spikes. In many ways I don't like dump stats so I will take a look at your Attribute values. If she is just buffing, then she may not need as high as a CHA bonus (someone said something like that).
Would actually choose maneuver mastery trip at lv 7 over resilency and weapon mastery, then use superior reach to create a trip barrier against all who threaten the party in melee.
Again, thanks. I didn't really know what Revelations to pick. She may like to be able to trip. I think it could work well a Combat Reflexive Rogue and a Combat Reflexive Pally.
Thanks,
Braxon
Silenced Adamantine Morningstar "Master Key"
THAT is amazing! haHA! The kids will love it...
Braxon
PS. I hope to foster them thinking outside the box via the parenting tool, "Pathfinder for Parents". =)
Put post it notes under the figures, so that threatened areas are visible. It'll help a lot when teaching about AO's
The defense is more offense. Bring grappled with armor spikes is just auto damage. Punish them for trying and perhaps make them think about letting go.
Ah, I see. I am learning quite a bit tonight. =)
Thanks for clearing that up,
Braxon
Put post it notes under the figures, so that threatened areas are visible. It'll help a lot when teaching about AO's
Wow, another great idea. I was trying to thing about how to show how things change when they use Enlarge Person for their size. I was thinking of putting a 10'x10' card under them.
I like the threatened area cards too! I had not thought about that. Hmm, maybe a balsa wood outlines like these spell templates would work too. (I enjoy doing crafts with the kids too) We also go to the living room to act out actions and the kids love it. However, as of yet we don't have 5' squares on the floor. =)
Thanks,
Braxon
It is definitely a more pricey option but for ideas you may want to take a look into Alea Tools. If you are a handy person you could make them yourself.
It is definitely a more pricey option but for ideas you may want to take a look into Alea Tools. If you are a handy person you could make them yourself.
Very cool Lune.
Thanks,
Braxon
Question for the dad, how you compelled your lil kid to play pathfinder? I have 2 liltle sisters and im planning to teach them pathfinder in a couple of years but I cant yet figure out a way to lead them to the game
Hmm, interesting question ElementalXX. I have been blessed by being able to go to school to become an Electrical Engineer. Problem solving, thinking outside the box, and imagining new solutions to old problems are tools that help me in my chosen career and in my home life. I have many jobs as a dad and a very important one is to teach my kids to have an active imagination.
They read 20 or more minutes every day. Every night they ask us what to dream about. We tell them things like, puppy dog island, being the captain of the Jolly Roger, design a 4WD go-kart, or you are going on an adventure with a gold golem. I make a big deal out of Pathfinder being family time and I try to be a good storyteller. They eat it up. I get to spend time with them. I eat it up. Good times.
All kids are different, but my kids are really getting Pathfinder starting with 2nd grade (3rd grade math and 4th grade reading). They are able to quickly add and subtract and they have a feeling for how numbers compare to each other. (Bigbrainz rocks!) Before then help them imagine fantastical things. Find out what _they_ like and tell stores about it. Make sure they know it is all pretend, but once they do not even the sky is the limit. Many of our drives into town are in a lava submarine trying to avoid various colors of dragons.
My preschooler wants to play but she is too young to play a character, however she is a very good DM's assistant and can roll a mean d20. =) In a few more years she will be ready to go.
A fertile imagination coupled with solid math and reading skills is an amazing gift to give a child. I feel Pathfinder is a great tool to achieve that and at the same time a blast to play. If you have any further questions feel free to ask.
Regards,
Braxon,
PS. I know I talked a lot about imagination but I also use props to spark their interest. Anytime they get treasure they get to open a treasure chest and see that they got. Maybe I will create a new post about some of the props I use to get them excited about Pathfinder. /ponder
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Thanks Braxon i just checked big brains and it rocks as a game ill make sure to show it to my sisters :).
In my case im the, really, big/old brother and sometimes my parents do not really like my "educational ideas" but hopefully they will see my point when they see my sis having fun and learning. One of my sis is first grade and the other is prescholar. I do not want to teach the older one yet because the little one may get upset which could create problems for the atmosphere of the game. They dont really have problems with reading nor math, my older sis learned to read alone, but Im not sure how to help them with documentation, concentration, and standing still.
Anyway, thanks for the advice in case a have other question ill let you know. Regards.
In my case im the, really, big/old brother and sometimes my parents do not really like my "educational ideas" but hopefully they will see my point when they see my sis having fun and learning.
It is good being Dad. =)
Good Luck,
Braxon
All,
We actually played!
Crystalfire the 1st level Oracle was a blast for my daughter to play! The Sorcerer enlarged her and her reach weapon along with Combat Reflexes for AoE when fighting mindless skeletons was a hoot! I was also neat watching her forgo battle to heal an unconscious teammate. Good stuff.
I want to thank everyone for all your help! We have a good plan until level 8 or so. Now we can just play.
Regards,
Braxon