Help with Cleric

[Constantine]

Hello! I'm going to be running my friends through Rise of the Runelords in a bit, and its going to be a small group. Only 3 of us, two players and a gm(me). They are going with an elven witch with the elements patron and a barbarian, leaving my pc/npc to be the healer of some sort. Any good suggestions for a cleric-y type? I was thinking about going Warpriest, but I don't know about no access to 7th+ level spells, and also the sacred weapon thing seems kinda useless until 8th level or so, unless I want to make a warpriest monk. Any suggestions/thoughts welcome!!! It will probably have to fall in the chaotic side of things, and changing for healing spells is a must!!

[Westphalian_Musketeer]

Have you talked to your GM about allowing Gestalt Build Rules? Only three party members can be grueling, even if one of them is the GM.

[Constantine]

I am the GM, so I'll talk to myself about it! :-) Thanks, though. I don't know if I want to go full gestalt, but maybe a class and a half or something could work. Or maybe I'll let the pc's do the full gestalt, and the pc/npc just a normal char...

[blahpers]

Keep in mind that you really don't need to be "the healer", as a party can get away with not having a dedicated healer. Also, the witch has a lot of healing spells on her spell list, so you could pick up a wand for healing and scrolls for dealing with curses or drain and do just fine.

If you do want to be the healer, clerics are certainly good at it, as are life oracles. From the sound of it, the party could use a good face, so oracle (or possibly paladin) would be a good fit. Even bard could do.

[Emmanuel Nouvellon-Pugh]

blahpers wrote:

Keep in mind that you really don't need to be "the healer", as a party can get away with not having a dedicated healer. Also, the witch has a lot of healing spells on her spell list, so you could pick up a wand for healing and scrolls for dealing with curses or drain and do just fine.

If you do want to be the healer, clerics are certainly good at it, as are life oracles. From the sound of it, the party could use a good face, so oracle (or possibly paladin) would be a good fit. Even bard could do.

I find that trying to mold a combat class to one dedicated to healing ruins their action economy in comparison to a dedicated healer with feats meant to make in-combat healing great. Feats rule the channel energy class feature, and any cure x require touch, including those that remove negative conditions.

[storyengine]

Depends. Assuming your witch is buff/debuff role and the barbarian is dps, it seems like you should be high AC + healer.

So you might try a plate wearing halfling bash and board cleric with any of:

Healing domain
Fire domain
Helpful (halfling trait)
Selective channel
Saving shield
Combat reflexes
Bodyguard
Channeled shield wall

Why?
Domains - heal and burn
Helpful - Aid Another AT/AC @ +4 (untyped)
Saving shield - +2 AC (shield type, immediate)
Bodyguard - AA as AoO!
Channel shield - +2 AC (deflection)

You can attack/cast AND potentially grant a +4 to hit and +6 to AC for free to an adjacent ally multiple times per round. Given party composition this grants you the healing and support function to keep your witch from getting mauled and your barbarian from going neg CON when his rage ends.

Just an idea.

[Renegadeshepherd]

I second fire domain but don't min max the heck out of it or it could come across as blowin your own horn.

[Constantine]

Renegadeshepherd wrote:

I second fire domain but don't min max the heck out of it or it could come across as blowin your own horn.

I was thinking the same thing. I definitely don't want to be the star of the party as the pc/npc. Will probably have to avoid the fire domain, though, as the witch is going have elements as patron.

[Constantine]

storyengine wrote:

Depends. Assuming your witch is buff/debuff role and the barbarian is dps, it seems like you should be high AC + healer.

So you might try a plate wearing halfling bash and board cleric with any of:

Healing domain
Fire domain
Helpful (halfling trait)
Selective channel
Saving shield
Combat reflexes
Bodyguard
Channeled shield wall

Why?
Domains - heal and burn
Helpful - Aid Another AT/AC @ +4 (untyped)
Saving shield - +2 AC (shield type, immediate)
Bodyguard - AA as AoO!
Channel shield - +2 AC (deflection)

You can attack/cast AND potentially grant a +4 to hit and +6 to AC for free to an adjacent ally multiple times per round. Given party composition this grants you the healing and support function to keep your witch from getting mauled and your barbarian from going neg CON when his rage ends.

Just an idea.

Thanks, this gives me some good ideas.

[storyengine]

Glad to help.

The protection or defense sub domain have merit for a "silent" support role. Travel is also good to keep up with a barb. I like the aid another route because it is instance based. You'd only do it to pull em out of tight spots. A trip build paladin (good saves, casting ability at 4th) might be a good crowd controller option and pair with the witch to make a full healer.

[Chillsabre]

If you want to ensure not to outshine any players, you could always use the NPC classes as they are significantly less powerful than a normal cleric.

You could also create a cleric but reduce him to a single domain, cut down his spells and delays his Channels so he wont be the forefront and outshine everyone.

This is especially true if you feel like you need to create something you will play. However, some adventures paths can be harder if you use unoptimized party set ups.

[Constantine]

I don't think I need to go that far, but thanks.

[DocShock]

You can play an evangelist cleric too. It gives you a bard's buffing abilities for the cost of a domain, which will help all of your party members.

[Magda Luckbender]

Make sure this cleric is un-optimized and stays firmly in the 'healbot' role. An optimized, properly-built (e.g. non-healbot) cleric would be a major character, and that's not what you want for a DMPC. The healbot role isn't strictly required, and is a waste of the cleric's abilities. Which is why you should create a healbot, because you want this character to slide into the background, be ineffective, and be mostly ignored.

Ideally, like people said above, you don't want a DMPC. With such a small party, perhaps consider the gestalt option.

Sounds like what you really need is 1-2 more players.

[Fruian Thistlefoot]

Have you thought about 2 characters to a player?

My home group does this from time to time and it turns out fine.

[Constantine]

My group will not go for the multiple character thing. We do need 1 or 2 more players. Convincing the others of that, though, is sometimes difficult.

[Magda Luckbender]

How about you don't provide a healbot DMPC, let them attempt to get somewhere with 2 PCs, and watch them flail? Be gentle, but they'll fail anyway. Once they realize they will fail with too small a team, perhaps they'll open up to getting 1-2 more.

[Renegadeshepherd]

Magda Luckbender wrote:

How about you don't provide a healbot DMPC, let them attempt to get somewhere with 2 PCs, and watch them flail? Be gentle, but they'll fail anyway. Once they realize they will fail with too small a team, perhaps they'll open up to getting 1-2 more.

Agree completely. You ever played mass effect 2 arrival DLC? Remember how Shephard fought off the projects personnel until the artifact stunned him? I like this style where the PCs can feel badass for doing so well but still fail enough, in story, that try realize they are going to need some help.

[blahpers]

Emmanuel Nouvellon-Pugh wrote:

blahpers wrote:

Keep in mind that you really don't need to be "the healer", as a party can get away with not having a dedicated healer. Also, the witch has a lot of healing spells on her spell list, so you could pick up a wand for healing and scrolls for dealing with curses or drain and do just fine.

If you do want to be the healer, clerics are certainly good at it, as are life oracles. From the sound of it, the party could use a good face, so oracle (or possibly paladin) would be a good fit. Even bard could do.

I find that trying to mold a combat class to one dedicated to healing ruins their action economy in comparison to a dedicated healer with feats meant to make in-combat healing great. Feats rule the channel energy class feature, and any cure x require touch, including those that remove negative conditions.

The suggestion was not intended to, er, suggest . . . molding a combat class into a dedicated healer. It was intended to provide some measure of healing while still maintaining the primary ability to do other things.