| Idramuk |
I could use some advice on ways i can combine tripping with an iron skin monk.
The game is 20 point buy. I am lvl 4 and my DM is letting me rebuild as I go.
Str 14
Dex 18
Con 14
Int 10
Wiz 14(+1) 4th lvl =15
Cha 8
List of altered/lost abilities:
1) AC bonus ability and the ability to add his Wisdom bonus to his AC.
2) Bonus Feat list.
3) Evasion.
4) High jump.
5) Fast Movement.
6) Slow Fall.
7) Improved Evasion.
8) Tongue of the Sun and Moon.
9) Perfect Self
I have looked at the Flowing monk and Maneuver master and I know they are not compatible.
So far the only archetypes I have found to be compatible are
Hungry Ghost Monk or Monk of the Healing Hand. Again I would like options to add tripping to this build.
| Secret Wizard |
Heya!
I'm a big hobgoblin/goblin fan so I was always interested in this kind of Monk.
The archetype does have a few problems:
1. You get extra bonus armor that you keep while wearing armor! Yey! But you don't get any way to Flurry with armor... boo...
2. Free Staggering Strike! Yey! But it only triggers off Unarmed criticals (which have the most unreliable crit score 20/2x) and it has a Fortitude saving throw (okay...) based on Wisdom (which you don't need, since you already have a good Will save and you don't get any AC from it!). So no synergy within the archetype there.
3. Hungry Ghost Monk can be added, but it really doesn't give you anything to stack Wisdom for to have your Punishing Kick do anything. Monk of the Empty Hand is another option, but it doesn't have any particular synergy.
With that said, the Ironskin Monk does have some cool stuff that can be used to get what you want, you just have to be smart about it:
1. You have access to Power Attack without qualifying for it! That means you can pump your Dex to make up for the lost AC from WIS. One option would be going full Dex, with Fury's Fall and Agile Maneuvers to get DEX x2 to your trip CMB, and then taking Wolf Style to improve your tripping. Another option would be taking advantage of this bonus feat for go Dragon Style for maximum damage, but I don't see how it helps you trip dudes.
2. Hungry Ghost really wants you to crit, and so does the Ironskin Monk, so you could try and make that the focus of your build at later levels. Hungry Ghost does give you some more benefits for Wisdom, but it's still not as important for this build. It's a pretty good choice to go Hungry Ghost if you go for the Strength build, but if you go for the Dexterity build, I think it's still a good choice because of Wolf Savage having such a great bonus against prone opponents (which Punishing Kick creates), with a few points in Wisdom, this could be a really nice Mage Killer build.
3. Another option would be going Ironskin Monk/Kata Master Monk. If you do that, you can get high DEX with some CHA, use your free Power Attack to qualify for Cornugon Smash, pile on that from your Hobgoblin intimidation abilities and the Menacing Swordplay deed, and trip enemies with the Targeted Strike deed that you get from Kata Master instead of having to recur to the trip combat maneuver.
Here's a level 6 build for each:
Here's the Hungry Ghost/Dragon Style build.
Male Hobgoblin monk 6 Archetypes Hungry Ghost Monk, Ironskin Monk,
LG Medium humanoid (goblinoid)
Init +6, Senses Perception +9
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DEFENSE
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AC 18, touch 15, flat-footed 13 (+4 Dex, +1 dodge, +3 natural, )
hp 49 ((6d8)+18)
Fort +8, Ref +9, Will +6, +2 vs. enchantment spells and effects
Defensive Abilities still mind,
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OFFENSE
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Speed 30 ft.
Melee flurry of blows +7/+7/+2 (1d8+3)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows,
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STATISTICS
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Str 16, Dex 18, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 8,
Base Atk +4; CMB +9 (+11 trip); CMD 22 (24 vs trip)
Feats Combat Reflexes, Dodge, Dragon Ferocity, Dragon Style, Improved Trip, Improved Unarmed Strike, Power Attack
Skills Acrobatics +13, Perception +9, Sense Motive +9, Stealth +17,
Traits Indomitable Faith, Reactionary,
Languages Common, Goblin
SQ bonus feat, bonus monk grapple or trip cmb (6x), iron skin, ki pool, maneuver training, punishing kick, resilience, scarred, sneaky, staggering blow, steal ki, tough as nails, weapon and armor proficiency, , , , , ,
Combat Gear
Other Gear flurry of blows, 0.0 gp
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SPECIAL ABILITIES
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Bonus Feat An ironskin monk adds Power Attack to his list of bonus feats. At 6th level, he adds Improved Sunder to the list. At 10th level, he adds Greater Sunder to the list. These bonus feat choices replace Dodge, Mobility, and Spring Attack on his bonus feat list.
Bonus Monk Grapple or Trip CMB (6x) Monk: Add a +1/4 bonus on combat maneuver checks made to grapple or trip.
Flurry of Blows (Ex) You can make a flurry of blows as a full-attack action. When doing so, you may make one additional attack, taking a -2 penalty on all of your attacks, as if using the Two-Weapon Fighting feat. These attacks can be any combination of unarmed strikes and attacks with a monk speciak weapon (you do not need to use two weapons to utlilize this ability). For the purpose of these attacks, your base attack bonus is equal to your monk level. For all other purposes, such as qualifying for a feat or a prestige class, you use your normal base attack bonus.
Indomitable Faith You were born in a region where your faith was not popular, yet you never abandoned it. You gain a +1 trait bonus on Will saves as a result.
Iron Skin (Ex) The ironskin monk gains a +2 bonus to his natural armor. This bonus stacks with any existing natural armor the ironskin monk already has. At 4th level, and every 4 levels thereafter, this bonus increases by +1. This ability replaces the monk's AC bonus ability and the ability to add his Wisdom bonus to his AC.
Ki Pool (Su) An ironskin monk can spend 1 point from his ki pool to gain a damage bonus equal to 3 against objects and constructs for 1 round.
Maneuver Training (Ex) A monk uses his monk level in place of his base attack bonus when calculating his combat maneuver bonus. Base attack bonuses granted from other classes are unaffected and are added normally.
Monk Bonus Feat
Punishing Kick (Ex) At 1st level, a hungry ghost monk gains Punishing Kick as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites. At 10th level, and every five levels thereafter, the monk can push the target of his Punishing Kick an additional 5 feet (10 feet at 10th level, 15 feet at 15th level, and 20 feet at 20th level). At 15th level, he can instead choose to push the target 5 feet and knock the target prone with the same attack. The target still gets a saving throw to avoid being knocked prone. This ability replaces Stunning Fist.
Reactionary You were bullied often as a child, but never quite developed an offensive response. Instead, you became adept at anticipating sudden attacks and reacting to danger quickly. You gain a +2 trait bonus on Initiative checks.
Resilience (Ex) An ironskin monk can shake off the physical effects of certain attacks. If he makes a Fortitude saving throw against an attack that has a reduced effect on a successful save, he instead avoids the effect entirely. This ability can be used only if the monk is wearing light armor or no armor. A helpless monk does not gain the benefits of resilience.
Scarred (Ex) You gain a +1 natural armor bonus.
Sneaky (Ex) Hobgoblins gain a +4 racial bonus on Stealth checks.
Staggering Blow (Ex) An ironskin monk attacking with an unarmed strike can spend 1 point from his ki pool as a free action after a successful critical hit to stagger the creature struck for 1 round (Fort DC 13 negates).
Steal Ki (Ex) At 5th level, a hungry ghost monk can steal ki from other creatures, though this ability is controversial in some circles of monks, who see it as nothing less than a form of vampirism. If the monk scores a confirmed critical hit against a living enemy or reduces a living enemy to 0 or fewer hit points, he can steal some of that creature's ki. This ability replenishes 1 spent ki point to the monk's ki pool, as long as the monk has at least 1 ki point in his pool. He cannot exceed his ki pool's maximum. At 11th level, each time the monk successfully steals ki, he can make an immediate saving throw against one disease he is suffering from. There is no penalty for failing this saving throw. The monk gains a bonus equal to his Wisdom modifier on the saving throw. This ability replaces purity of body.
Still Mind (Ex) You gain a +2 bonus on saving throws against enchantment spells and effects.
Tough as Nails (Ex) An ironskin monk gains DR 1/-. Damage reduction can reduce damage to 0 but not below 0. This ability replaces fast movement and slow fall.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency Monks are proficient with club, crossbow (light or heavy), dagger, handaxe, javelin, kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shuriken, siangham, and sling. Monks are not proficient with any armor or shields When wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, a monk loses her AC bonus, as well as her fast movement and flurry of blows abilities.
The next thing that build wants is critical hits. It needs also to get a ton of armor.
Here's Wolf Style DEX-based tripper:
Male Hobgoblin monk 6 Archetypes Hungry Ghost Monk, Ironskin Monk, Vows,
LE Medium humanoid (goblinoid)
Init +6, Senses Perception +12
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DEFENSE
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AC 17, touch 14, flat-footed 13 (+4 Dex, +3 natural, )
hp 50 ((6d8)+18)
Fort +8, Ref +9, Will +8
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OFFENSE
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Speed 30 ft.
Melee flurry of blows +8/+8/+3 (1d8)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows,
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STATISTICS
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Str 10, Dex 18, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8,
Base Atk +4; CMB +10 (+17 trip); CMD 18 (20 vs trip)
Feats Agile Maneuvers, Combat Reflexes, Fury's Fall, Improved Trip, Improved Unarmed Strike, Power Attack, Weapon Finesse
Skills Knowledge (Nature) +6, Perception +12, Sense Motive +12, Stealth +17,
Languages Common, Goblin
SQ bonus feat, bonus monk grapple or trip cmb (6x), iron skin, ki pool, maneuver training, punishing kick, resilience, scarred, sneaky, staggering blow, steal ki, tough as nails, weapon and armor proficiency,
Combat Gear
Other Gear flurry of blows, 0.0 gp
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SPECIAL ABILITIES
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Bonus Feat An ironskin monk adds Power Attack to his list of bonus feats. At 6th level, he adds Improved Sunder to the list. At 10th level, he adds Greater Sunder to the list. These bonus feat choices replace Dodge, Mobility, and Spring Attack on his bonus feat list.
Bonus Monk Grapple or Trip CMB (6x) Monk: Add a +1/4 bonus on combat maneuver checks made to grapple or trip.
Flurry of Blows (Ex) You can make a flurry of blows as a full-attack action. When doing so, you may make one additional attack, taking a -2 penalty on all of your attacks, as if using the Two-Weapon Fighting feat. These attacks can be any combination of unarmed strikes and attacks with a monk speciak weapon (you do not need to use two weapons to utlilize this ability). For the purpose of these attacks, your base attack bonus is equal to your monk level. For all other purposes, such as qualifying for a feat or a prestige class, you use your normal base attack bonus.
Iron Skin (Ex) The ironskin monk gains a +2 bonus to his natural armor. This bonus stacks with any existing natural armor the ironskin monk already has. At 4th level, and every 4 levels thereafter, this bonus increases by +1. This ability replaces the monk's AC bonus ability and the ability to add his Wisdom bonus to his AC.
Ki Pool (Su) An ironskin monk can spend 1 point from his ki pool to gain a damage bonus equal to 3 against objects and constructs for 1 round.
Maneuver Training (Ex) A monk uses his monk level in place of his base attack bonus when calculating his combat maneuver bonus. Base attack bonuses granted from other classes are unaffected and are added normally.
Monk Bonus Feat
Punishing Kick (Ex) At 1st level, a hungry ghost monk gains Punishing Kick as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites. At 10th level, and every five levels thereafter, the monk can push the target of his Punishing Kick an additional 5 feet (10 feet at 10th level, 15 feet at 15th level, and 20 feet at 20th level). At 15th level, he can instead choose to push the target 5 feet and knock the target prone with the same attack. The target still gets a saving throw to avoid being knocked prone. This ability replaces Stunning Fist.
Resilience (Ex) An ironskin monk can shake off the physical effects of certain attacks. If he makes a Fortitude saving throw against an attack that has a reduced effect on a successful save, he instead avoids the effect entirely. This ability can be used only if the monk is wearing light armor or no armor. A helpless monk does not gain the benefits of resilience.
Scarred (Ex) You gain a +1 natural armor bonus.
Sneaky (Ex) Hobgoblins gain a +4 racial bonus on Stealth checks.
Staggering Blow (Ex) An ironskin monk attacking with an unarmed strike can spend 1 point from his ki pool as a free action after a successful critical hit to stagger the creature struck for 1 round (Fort DC 16 negates).
Steal Ki (Ex) At 5th level, a hungry ghost monk can steal ki from other creatures, though this ability is controversial in some circles of monks, who see it as nothing less than a form of vampirism. If the monk scores a confirmed critical hit against a living enemy or reduces a living enemy to 0 or fewer hit points, he can steal some of that creature's ki. This ability replenishes 1 spent ki point to the monk's ki pool, as long as the monk has at least 1 ki point in his pool. He cannot exceed his ki pool's maximum. At 11th level, each time the monk successfully steals ki, he can make an immediate saving throw against one disease he is suffering from. There is no penalty for failing this saving throw. The monk gains a bonus equal to his Wisdom modifier on the saving throw. This ability replaces purity of body.
Tough as Nails (Ex) An ironskin monk gains DR 1/-. Damage reduction can reduce damage to 0 but not below 0. This ability replaces fast movement and slow fall.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency Monks are proficient with club, crossbow (light or heavy), dagger, handaxe, javelin, kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shuriken, siangham, and sling. Monks are not proficient with any armor or shields When wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, a monk loses her AC bonus, as well as her fast movement and flurry of blows abilities.
You really want the Scarred racial trait for both of these as you can see, you need all the armor you can get. This build pays a lot of feat taxes, but you do get a 17 trip CMB which is awesome. You want to get Dodge and Wolf Style next, get some armor from magic items.
Here's the build that mixes Intimidation with Targeted Strike to trip... it only comes online at level 7th, though, so you just have to do with being a bully until then. Perhaps it's not what you wanted, since it doesn't use trip itself, but it works well with a hobgoblin.
Male Hobgoblin monk 6 Archetypes Ironskin Monk, Kata Master
LN Medium humanoid (goblinoid)
Init +4, Senses Perception +11
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DEFENSE
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AC 17, touch 14, flat-footed 13 (+4 Dex, +3 natural, )
hp 32 ((6d8)+6)
Fort +6, Ref +9, Will +7, +2 vs. enchantment spells and effects
Defensive Abilities Immunities disease,
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OFFENSE
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Speed 30 ft.
Melee flurry of blows +9/+9/+4 (1d8)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows
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STATISTICS
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Str 10, Dex 18, Con 12, Int 8, Wis 14, Cha 16,
Base Atk +4; CMB +6; CMD 18
Feats Combat Reflexes, Cornugon Smash, Improved Feint, Improved Unarmed Strike, Power Attack, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus (Unarmed Strike)
Skills Bluff +13, Intimidate +16, Perception +11,
Traits Bullied, Fast-Talker,
Languages Common, Goblin
SQ bonus feat, fearsome, iron skin, ki pool, maneuver training, menacing swordplay, panache, purity of body, resilience, scarred, staggering blow, tough as nails, weapon and armor proficiency,
Combat Gear
Other Gear flurry of blows, 0.0 gp
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SPECIAL ABILITIES
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Bonus Feat An ironskin monk adds Power Attack to his list of bonus feats. At 6th level, he adds Improved Sunder to the list. At 10th level, he adds Greater Sunder to the list. These bonus feat choices replace Dodge, Mobility, and Spring Attack on his bonus feat list.
Bullied You were bullied often as a child, and you are now constantly ready to defend yourself with your fists when an enemy comes near. You gain a +1 trait bonus on attacks of opportunity attack rolls made with unarmed strikes. Note that this trait does not grant the ability to make attacks of opportunity with your unarmed strikes.
Fast-Talker You had a knack at getting yourself into trouble as a child, and as a result developed a silver tongue at an early age. You gain a +1 trait bonus on Bluff checks, and Bluff is always a class skill for you.
Fearsome (Ex) You gain a +4 racial bonus on Intimidate checks.
Flurry of Blows (Ex) You can make a flurry of blows as a full-attack action. When doing so, you may make one additional attack, taking a -2 penalty on all of your attacks, as if using the Two-Weapon Fighting feat. These attacks can be any combination of unarmed strikes and attacks with a monk speciak weapon (you do not need to use two weapons to utlilize this ability). For the purpose of these attacks, your base attack bonus is equal to your monk level. For all other purposes, such as qualifying for a feat or a prestige class, you use your normal base attack bonus.
Immunity to Disease (Ex) You are never subject to disease effects.
Iron Skin (Ex) The ironskin monk gains a +2 bonus to his natural armor. This bonus stacks with any existing natural armor the ironskin monk already has. At 4th level, and every 4 levels thereafter, this bonus increases by +1. This ability replaces the monk's AC bonus ability and the ability to add his Wisdom bonus to his AC.
Ki Pool (Su) An ironskin monk can spend 1 point from his ki pool to gain a damage bonus equal to 3 against objects and constructs for 1 round. At 4th level, a kata master can treat ki points as panache points for any swashbuckler deed gained through this archetype. This ability modifies ki pool.
Maneuver Training (Ex) A monk uses his monk level in place of his base attack bonus when calculating his combat maneuver bonus. Base attack bonuses granted from other classes are unaffected and are added normally.
Menacing Swordplay (Ex) At 3rd level, a kata master gains the swashbuckler's menacing swordplay deed.
Panache (Ex) At 1st level, a kata master gains the swashbuckler's panache class ability. At the start of each day, a kata master gains a number of panache points equal to her Charisma bonus (minimum 1). Her panache goes up or down throughout the day, but usually cannot go higher than his Charisma bonus (minimum 1). A kata master gains the swashbuckler's derring-do and opportune parry and riposte deeds. A kata master can use an unarmed strike or monk special weapon in place of a light or one-handed piercing melee weapon for granted swashbuckler class features and deeds.
Purity of Body (Ex) You are immune to all diseases, including supernatural and magical diseases.
Resilience (Ex) An ironskin monk can shake off the physical effects of certain attacks. If he makes a Fortitude saving throw against an attack that has a reduced effect on a successful save, he instead avoids the effect entirely. This ability can be used only if the monk is wearing light armor or no armor. A helpless monk does not gain the benefits of resilience.
Scarred (Ex) You gain a +1 natural armor bonus.
Staggering Blow (Ex) An ironskin monk attacking with an unarmed strike can spend 1 point from his ki pool as a free action after a successful critical hit to stagger the creature struck for 1 round (Fort DC 15 negates).
Tough as Nails (Ex) An ironskin monk gains DR 1/-. Damage reduction can reduce damage to 0 but not below 0. This ability replaces fast movement and slow fall.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency Monks are proficient with club, crossbow (light or heavy), dagger, handaxe, javelin, kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shuriken, siangham, and sling. Monks are not proficient with any armor or shields When wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, a monk loses her AC bonus, as well as her fast movement and flurry of blows abilities.
As you can see, Intimidation is there to reduce the attack rolls of enemies, giving you better AC, and also their opposed rolls to your feints, allowing you to hit them easier. By doing this, you can hit with your Targeted Strike (once you get to level 7th) much easier.
You want to move on to get Feinting Flurry or something like that. Your high charisma qualifies you for Eldritch Heritage too, but nothing interesting there. You might wanna take Leadership, perhaps?
Anyway, hope one of those builds is closer to what you are looking for.
| Lord Kakabel |
THANK YOU Secret Wizard! I am Idramuk's DM. His character is the little brother of a hobgoblin monk he played over a decade ago in the 3.0 days. I've only been playing Pathfinder for a bit over a year (I was running D&D Encounters 4.0 *shame*), and haven't explored Pathfinder's new monk options much.
"Wolf" is exactly what he's looking for. This is exhaustively great work!