Help Me Decipher the Meaning of the Iroran Paladin's AC Boost

[Rudy2]

Iroran Paladin

Quote:

Confident Defense (Ex): At 1st level, when wearing light or no armor and not using a shield, an Iroran paladin adds 1 point of his Charisma bonus (if any) per class level to his Dexterity bonus to his Armor Class. If he is caught flat-footed or otherwise denied his Dexterity bonus, he also loses this bonus. This ability replaces his proficiency with medium armor, heavy armor, and shields.

I'm not sure I've got the meaning of the bolded part correct. I think it means that you add your charisma modifier to your dexterity modifier, and that the resulting sum acts as your dexterity modifier for your AC, being capped by your armors max dex and all.

Does this seem to be correct? Other readings?

[Calth]

I would agree with your interpretation, don't really see any other way it could be read. Just like touch attacks ignore enhancement bonuses to natural armor.

[Rudy2]

Thanks for the first, but I'm not sure I understand the relevance of the touch attacks comment?

[Calth]

Its saying that bonuses to an ac bonus type (i.e. dex, dodge, natural, armor, shield) are negated when the base type is negated. Thus the CHA bonus to Dex bonus to AC are negated whenever the Dex bonus is negated.

[Rudy2]

Ah! Yes, thank you.

[Ascalaphus]

Luckily so far, the Bloodrager (playtest) has Alignment: Any. Two levels will give you Uncanny Dodge, Bloodrage and a bloodline ability. I recommend the Celestial one if you're only going to dip.

[Cranky Dog]

It's oddly worded, but it's not unlike the Duelist's Canny Defense ability, but with Charisma instead of Intelligence.

The key wording here is that it is treated as a DEX bonus instead of a Dodge bonus. Mechanically, not much difference.

[Ascalaphus]

The difference is that armor limits it.

[Rudy2]

Ascalaphus wrote:

The difference is that armor limits it.

Yeah; this actually ends up making it quite a big difference.

[Rudy2]

So, everyone is agreed on the following interpretation:

If my Dexterity is 14, and my charisma is 16, then my effective dexterity bonus for armor is +5, so that if I'm wearing a chain shirt, with a max dex bonus of +4, I only get +4 of the +5 bonus?

[Mojorat]

Yes... you add both numbers together and write them under dex for your armor ac 18 (+4 armorv+4 dex).

[Melkiador]

Rudy2 wrote:

Iroran Paladin

Quote:

Confident Defense (Ex): At 1st level, when wearing light or no armor and not using a shield, an Iroran paladin adds 1 point of his Charisma bonus (if any) per class level to his Dexterity bonus to his Armor Class. If he is caught flat-footed or otherwise denied his Dexterity bonus, he also loses this bonus. This ability replaces his proficiency with medium armor, heavy armor, and shields.

I'm not sure I've got the meaning of the bolded part correct. I think it means that you add your charisma modifier to your dexterity modifier, and that the resulting sum acts as your dexterity modifier for your AC, being capped by your armors max dex and all.

Does this seem to be correct? Other readings?

I find the "per level" bit to be more questionable. Does that mean 1 per level, capping at your charisma modifier, or 1 per level as long as you have a positive charisma modifier. I'm sure the first was intended, but the second wouldn't be an unreasonable interpretation.

[Rudy2]

There's no way it would mean 1 per level without limit. That would be insane. A player who tried that would get my "no shenanigans" stare.

[DrakeRoberts]

No, it means 1 per level up to your charisma modifier. So yes to the "add cha mod to dex mod and treat as dex mod for ac" bit, with the caveat that the additional amount is capped by your level.

So your Dex 14, Cha 16 character has effect dex bonus to armor of +3 with 1 class level, +4 with 2 class levels, +5 with 3 or more class levels. Capped, as you said, by the max dex of your worn armor.

EDIT: and that's what I get for not reading all the posts carefully. "Yes" melkiador, the first interpretation is correct.

[Lifat]

Melkiador wrote:

Rudy2 wrote:

Iroran Paladin

Quote:

Confident Defense (Ex): At 1st level, when wearing light or no armor and not using a shield, an Iroran paladin adds 1 point of his Charisma bonus (if any) per class level to his Dexterity bonus to his Armor Class. If he is caught flat-footed or otherwise denied his Dexterity bonus, he also loses this bonus. This ability replaces his proficiency with medium armor, heavy armor, and shields.

I'm not sure I've got the meaning of the bolded part correct. I think it means that you add your charisma modifier to your dexterity modifier, and that the resulting sum acts as your dexterity modifier for your AC, being capped by your armors max dex and all.

Does this seem to be correct? Other readings?

I find the "per level" bit to be more questionable. Does that mean 1 per level, capping at your charisma modifier, or 1 per level as long as you have a positive charisma modifier. I'm sure the first was intended, but the second wouldn't be an unreasonable interpretation.

I'd call it unreasonable. The ability says "adds 1 point of his charisma bonus [b](if any]. That to me makes it clear what they mean.