Settlement Access

[moon madness]

Question for developers :
How restrictive will access to settlements be?
From what I've read your stopping character who's alignment are too opposed to the settlements from entering why?

if an evil aligned character chooses to enter a good aligned settlement he should be ok to visit make purchases etc. unless he does something evil then be chucked out, same with good in an evil settlement.
Else Neutral characters can't enter LG or CE or LE or CG and this doesn't make sense.

If this could be clarified I'd be grateful.

[Guurzak]

Entry restrictions are reputation based, not alignment based. CE can enter an LG town if his rep is higher than their minimum. (Unless the town has chosen other filters which bar him, of course.)

He won't be able to *join* the settlement, but that's a different matter.

[CBDunkerson]

Let's define different levels of 'settlement access';

Member - Must be within one step of the settlement's alignment. Gains skill upkeep benefits from the settlement. Generally has access to all settlement facilities subject to limits set by the settlement government, of which they may be part.

Visitor - Does not receive skill upkeep benefits from the settlement, but may have access to skill training and/or other settlement facilities subject to limits set by the settlement government. May not be part of settlement government. Some visitors may be more like 'residents' if they spend a great deal of time in and around the settlement.

Outlaw - Individual is banned from entering the settlement and will be attacked by NPC guards. This may be due to low reputation, violation of settlement laws, or other reasons.

[T7V Jazzlvraz]

They've discussed having various filters a Settlement can use to control access by categories; this might allow, for example, a Lawful Good Settlement to disallow folks of particular alignments, regardless of reputation. I don't recall whether they've said those filters will go down to individual character-names, but I can see demand for that.

[<Kabal> Sunnfire]

Unless someone has earned a reputation, without magical aid I don't see how guards would know to keep a particular person out.

I suppose you could make them superficially judgmental, which could be fun. Keep out anyone wearing all white carrying a staff.

You could also make them bouncer like I suppose, if your not on the list you don't get in.

But I don't see how you filter on non-tangible means without magical aid. But then there would be a use for spells like hide alignment, or alter self. Which could also be fun.

Imagine walking in to a training hall, only to discover your guys training the most infamous assassin because he spelled himself up to sneak in and look like Bob.

[FMS Quietus]

<Kabal> Sunnfire wrote:

Unless someone has earned a reputation, without magical aid I don't see how guards would know to keep a particular person out.

I suppose you could make them superficially judgmental, which could be fun. Keep out anyone wearing all white carrying a staff.

You could also make them bouncer like I suppose, if your not on the list you don't get in.

But I don't see how you filter on non-tangible means without magical aid. But then there would be a use for spells like hide alignment, or alter self. Which could also be fun.

Imagine walking in to a training hall, only to discover your guys training the most infamous assassin because he spelled himself up to sneak in and look like Bob.

Very interesting discussion. Depending on the direction you go with this, there are protections in the Pathfinder IP as well that could be used thematically as defense. Dispell Magic could be one, but there are also protections from good and evil that settlements could put in place. The former would prevent a good or evil aligned character from stepping onto the settlement with no guards needed. You could always have clerics running around doing the same as well.

[Bringslite of Fidelis]

At first there will be the minimum reputation, and probably existing "flag" or instant "flag" reaction filters. As time goes on, GW has promised more specific filters. We will see where that goes.

[Guurzak]

<Kabal> Sunnfire wrote:

Imagine walking in to a training hall, only to discover your guys training the most infamous assassin because he spelled himself up to sneak in and look like Bob.

Disguise is a planned feature. You will be able to enter hostile towns and shop while disguised, but you will not be able to train.

Blog here: https://goblinworks.com/blog/join-forces-underground/

[T7V Jazzlvraz]

In order to make sure it's not too much of an advantage, there'll be some way of penetrating disguises, too. We'll have to wait a bit to learn the whole mechanism.

[TEO Cheatle]

I see Disguises as more of a Mechanic to get past NPCs not PCs.

[Guurzak]

If you read the blog post it's clear that the mechanic applies to deceiving both PCs and NPCs.

[TEO Cheatle]

Unless they have a varied array of disguises, then humans will be able to easily identify what is happening, via pattern recognition.

[Harad Navar]

And that blog is over a year old. A lot has changed since then.

[T7V Jazzlvraz]

I can imagine that perceiving disguises might be part of the disguise-skill itself. Folks with training might have an easier time detecting those disguised, while characters who've not spent points in that arena may be more easily fooled.

[Nihimon]

I bet it gets Crowdforged! :)

[<Kabal> Sunnfire]

T7V Jazzlvraz wrote:

I can imagine that perceiving disguises might be part of the disguise-skill itself. Folks with training might have an easier time detecting those disguised, while characters who've not spent points in that arena may be more easily fooled.

This is what makes the most sense. Though you would easily be able to tell if someone were a player or not, you should not necessarily be able to tell WHO they are just by watching them. Not with the proper skills/spells, etc.

It all comes down to what they spend their time programming in as possibilities.

While it would be awesome for me to be able to used skills and spells to disguise myself as a member of a particular settlement, and then be able to actually go through it all the way up to and including repositioning NPC guards to make my guilds coming assault easier and more successful.. it would have to all be designed and coded.. and that is a ridiculous amount of work. So its unlike to go beyond some simple mechanics for some time.

While I think starting with some basics is good, its almost not worth the time/skill invested if you are only going to fool NPC's and even then only getting to walk through a settlement.

[Guurzak]

How about walking through a settlement in order to assassinate a critical building owner or formation leader, disrupting your enemy's DI's and martial capabilities in preparation for a major battle?

[<Kabal> Sunnfire]

Presuming no PCs notice you.. sure, that's my point, if you can also fool a PC.. then things like that are far more likely, and awesome.

[randomwalker]

<Kabal> Sunnfire wrote:

Presuming no PCs notice you.. sure, that's my point, if you can also fool a PC.. then things like that are far more likely, and awesome.

If you suspect someone of being a disguised assassin and kill them, that is still murder. Observing them long enough to break their disguise might reveal them as flagged trespassers, members of a feuding company or give you another legal reason to attack them. In any case, attaking from disguise is sure to break it fast, and doing so while in plain sight of others is a sure way to get the odds stacked against you.

--

to the OP:
Restrictions on entering and trading (if any) will be decided by the settlement government.
Restrictions on training and crafting in the settlement, likewise.
Alignment only mechanically restricts becoming a formal member.
Rep will also be a real restrictions, although as I understand it a settlement could choose to accept low-rep members and just pay the price by potentially losing the benefit of some of their buildings.

[Ravenlute]

As Herald of Stone Bear Clan I offer a formal pre-apology to all the flower delivery people accidentally slain for being accused of spying and turning out to be innocent. Seriously, who shows up with flowers without having an ulterior motive?

[moon madness]

For those that have replied thank you and the conversation has taken an interesting turn and seems to have gotten people thinking.
It's going to be really interesting to find out how things pan out with alignment and reputation and skills effecting each other both in and out of a settlement.

[Bluddwolf]

The settlement of Aragon will have a pretty open door policy as far as reputation access is concerned. We don't believe there will be many very low rep characters out there to begin with. What we might lose in DI for having that open door, we will make up for in numbers and in being welcoming and providing a service to our guests / visitors.

If our settlement is the only one supplying a chaotic based skill at tier 3, then it is in the best interests of all chaotically aligned characters to keep our settlement in the hands of chaotic aligned settlement management.

Likewise, if tier 3 is tied to moderate to high reputation, the same self interest is also required. No room for Chaotic Stupid!