Can someone explain this one to me? Why in the world would you ever take mythic furious focus when mythic power attack is far and away better?
With mythic furious focus, you can spend a point to negate power attacks penalties for all attacks for one round. Pretty decent.
With power attack, not only does your bonus damage get doubled on a crit before the multiplier, but you get the furious focus power for an entire minute instead of one round.
Really? Am I reading this wrong?
I am prepared for the developers to chime in and say, "well, it's mythic", but come on. This is just poor design or planning.
Furious Focus (Mythic)
Your attacks create a rhythmic barrage that doesn't sacrifice precision for force.
Prerequisite(s): Furious Focus.
Benefit: When you are using Furious Focus, you don't take Power Attack's penalty on attack rolls that are made as attacks of opportunity. As a free action, you can expend one use of mythic power to negate Power Attack's penalty on all melee attacks you make for 1 round while using this feat.
Power Attack (Mythic)
Your attacks are truly devastating.
Prerequisite(s): Power Attack.
Benefit: When you use Power Attack, you gain a +3 bonus on melee damage rolls instead of +2. When your base attack bonus reaches +4 and every 4 points thereafter, the amount of bonus damage increases by +3 instead of +2.
In addition, the bonus damage from this feat is doubled on a critical hit, before it's multiplied by the weapon's critical multiplier.
You can expend one use of mythic power when you activate Power Attack to ignore the penalties on melee attack rolls and combat maneuver checks for 1 minute.
I am not saying that. Furious focus is a great feat.
I am comparing the two mythic feats.
Once feat should not completely eclipse another to the point that you should retrain the original.
A lot of builds have power attack and furious focus. If you ascend to mythic power and take mythic power attack, you might as well retrain furious focus for something else.
And there is no reason... not one that I can think of, that you would want to take mythic furious focus.
Yes, some things are more mechanically better, but do we really need more feats that cancel out others?
I am hoping someone can show me a benefit in mythic furious focus. If not, this is just another feat trap. Why do that?
If you don't want to spend any mythic power and are concerned about penalties to hit, take Mythic Furious Focus. It has a tangible benefit not granted by Mythic Power Attack--the ability to ignore the penalties on attacks of opportunity without spending any mythic power to do so.
Whether that's worthwhile or not is up to the player, but this isn't quite a "strictly better than" scenario.
If you don't want to spend any mythic power and are concerned about penalties to hit, take Mythic Furious Focus. It has a tangible benefit not granted by Mythic Power Attack--the ability to ignore the penalties on attacks of opportunity without spending any mythic power to do so.
Whether that's worthwhile or not is up to the player, but this isn't quite a "strictly better than" scenario.
I think you misread them. They are almost exactly the same except the one negates all Power Attack penalties for one ROUND and one does it for one MINUTE, both with the same exact cost. The fact that Mythic Power Attack is literally 10 times more cost effective and gives a massive damage increase to crits means it really is better than Mythic Furious Focus. It's mind boggling to me that Furious Focus, which is higher on the feat tree has an effect that is 10 times worse than its prerequisite. Oh, I forgot you can just ignore penalties on AoO by default with it. Excuse me while I just spend a single point and get that and more for a whole combat.
Also I apologize for the tone; I'm not meaning to be an ass to you or "yell." It just kinda annoys me. I wouldn't be so annoyed if Furious Focus got the minute duration, but as is it makes zero sense in any context.
If someone finds the idea of saving those points for other uses appealing, then maybe they'd rather take Mythic Furious Focus. I don't find it very worthwhile, but one doesn't completely supersede the other.
I'm more irritated that Mythic Furious Focus doesn't really seem appropriate to its original feat. What do attacks of opportunity have to do with Furious Focus?
I think people are missing the point about Furious Focus. There are builds out there that completely revolve around AoO's. You also forget that Mythic points are a finite resource (until 10th teir, but you're a god at that point anyway).
Basically, if your build revolves around AoO, you want Furious Focus as you are not required to spend mythic points to negate your penalties on Power Attack. I'm aware that if you spend a mythic point you ignore the penalties with mythic power attack, but that's just it, you're spending a finite resource.
I'm in a game right now with a halfling tripping monk and a power attacking fighter. When the monk trips something, anyone adjacent to the mob that has been tripped gets an AoO against the mob. It happens a lot. With Furious Focus (if we were mythic), the fighter could power attack at no penalty against tripped opponents and save his mythic points for other things.
The thing is all of your AoO are made at full BAB anyway where those penalties don't really matter; it's just assumed that if you are optimized at all for fighting that your highest BAB attack is going to hit. And even if you are optimized around AoO (Come and Get Me Barbarian is what comes immediately to mind here), you will still use your full attack which would benefit much more from those reduced penalties. Yeah it does require a resource, but it is such a small expenditure as to be almost trivial. 1 point = 1 fight of no penalties... unless you're using Mythic Furious Focus of course and then your point there would be a whole lot stronger.
I disagree Chaos. Mainly because after running a mythic game, many fights went well beyond 10 rounds, even at lower level, given the number abilities being used by PC's and mythic bad guys. So no, 1 point does not equal one fight. And mythic points are not something you should be spending every fight. If you're in a long drawn out dungeon and you've had 10-12 encounters before the BBEG and you've spent the majority of your mythic points to ignore power attack penalties, you could very well be out of them.
ok... I am glad someone pointed out the AoO... I did miss that.
To be honest, what Chaos is saying I agree with (were you yelling at me, lol?, I didn't even notice until you apologized for yelling).
It would make a lot more sense to have power attack spend a mythic point for one round and mythic furious focus for 10 rounds.
uhhh, if your running 10 to 12 encounters a day then pretty much everybody is on fumes at combat eight... never mind the issue of taking like eight hours of hard charging turn on turn action.
I feel like that would just be fatiguing as a player rather than for my character.
My mythic players have about 9 points to burn. Most fights do not last longer than 10 rounds, unless you are only doing 1-2 per session or you are going really long sessions.
On average, our battles last around 6 rounds. 1 point is nothing to spend to get a huge boost to hit by negating power attack.
If you're wondering how this would be valuable, think Barbarian with Come and Get Me.
No needing to spend Mythic Power to ignore attack penalties, but most of your attacks are going to be AoO's.
Mythic Power is a precious resource, melees will never have enough of them. So the key here is not the lousy use of Mythic Power...it's the awesomeness of how this feat dovetails with an AoO build.
Very situational, AoO builds only...but awesome on those builds.
==Aelryinth
I had the exact opposite experience when I played Mythic, Renvale. Mythic Vital Strike saw to that; things ended just as quickly as normal.
That said I really haven't played too much Mythic. What do melee mythic builds need them so desperately for Aelryinth? To specify I'm not trying to be antagonistic, I'm just curious as to what you are referring to in particular. I pretty much only used mine so I could double Mythic Vital Strike twice in a turn (i.e. get my full attack rotation's worth of damage at full BAB... twice).
The more I think about it I really dislike Mythic Vital Strike.
Well, Come and Get Me, and the (mythic) feats Power Attack and Furious Focus is much cheaper feats-wise then Power Attack and Vital Strike x4, no?
So, perfect for a Barb build.
==Aelryinth
To be honest I can't think of any build that uses weapons that could not be improved by Mythic Vital Strike. It's the kind of thing where if you have to make room, other things go. Perhaps less so for Barbarian as they can get Pounce, but then Mythic Vital Strike could potentially come online earlier and has the awesome synergy with being able to spend a point for an extra standard action.
That's all besides the point I guess... what do non-Mythic Vital Strike Mythic martials use those points for that is so much better than blowing 1 to negate Power Attack penalties for (most of) a combat? That question never came up for anyone in my group because we hit the evolutionary dead end we've been talking about.
There are PFS scenarios that can easily go that way, such as one that has you trying to stealth the streets of Whitethrone, the Judge rolls for an encounter on EVERY intersection. And that's BEFORE you enter the dungeon portion.uhhh, if your running 10 to 12 encounters a day then pretty much everybody is on fumes at combat eight... never mind the issue of taking like eight hours of hard charging turn on turn action.
I feel like that would just be fatiguing as a player rather than for my character.
This. If your game runs in single-encounter days, then this might be a bad deal for you. If you play more traditional games, you might have anywhere from one to a dozen encounters of varying difficulties. Resource conservation starts to look pretty good.
If you have an optimized group the combats wont last 10 rounds, but with that said I still don't see the advantage Mystic FF has over Mysitc PA, and yeah read everyone's comments here. 1 minute is longer than 1 round so even AoO's should be affected by Mythic PA. Now if PA said AoO's did not benefit then FF would have a small edge.
edit:By "won't" I mean most likely not to.
This. If your game runs in single-encounter days, then this might be a bad deal for you. If you play more traditional games, you might have anywhere from one to a dozen encounters of varying difficulties. Resource conservation starts to look pretty good.There are PFS scenarios that can easily go that way, such as one that has you trying to stealth the streets of Whitethrone, the Judge rolls for an encounter on EVERY intersection. And that's BEFORE you enter the dungeon portion.uhhh, if your running 10 to 12 encounters a day then pretty much everybody is on fumes at combat eight... never mind the issue of taking like eight hours of hard charging turn on turn action.
I feel like that would just be fatiguing as a player rather than for my character.
If you are referring to a bunch of joke encounters then the issue still seems moot; You don't turn on Mythic Power Attack's accuracy button as it is not needed. By that same token you wouldn't really need the benefits given by Mythic Furious Focus either in that scenario... especially as those AoO are all at full BAB anyway.
Anyway, I can see why some people are considering Mythic Furious Focus to be an ultra-niche option (kinda like how Prone Slinger would be if you were playing in a campaign world where the sky had literally fallen and everyone had to crawl everywhere at all times and you wanted to be a ranged character and firearms didn't exist), but meh, I still don't think it would really be worth it in that scenario either. Besides the inefficiency of what it does compared to Mythic Power Attack, it still comes back to the fact that those Power Attack penalties only really matter for your iterative attacks; I guess along the same lines I don't consider Furious Focus to ever really be worth taking either in general besides ultra-niche builds.
No, I'm not talking about just "joke encounters". I'm talking about clearing out an entire keep full of bad guys and traps in a single run. Because sometimes things happen if you stop to camp for eight-plus hours.
I'm trying to remember if people stopped to rest in the middle of the drow city after every combat back in my grognard days.... : /