Can I cast Continual Flame for other PCs? Must they pay me?

[Big Word]

Hello, the guide to organized play indicates that PCs may have one item with Continual Flame cast on it. I will be playing an Archon-blooded Aasimar and once I have an item with continual flame on it, I'd like to be able to help other PCs to the best of my ability. (But without raising too many GM eyebrows, of course.)

My forum search has brought up the possibility that I can cast it for them and they can note it on their chronicle sheet (and presumably tracking sheet); is this right? is there instructions for how exactly this should be done?

Someone in this forum said they'd still have to pay 50g. I can't find this rule, but presumably they don't pay me. Is this right?

Thank you,
Chris

[Blackbot]

Continual Flame needs ruby dust worth 50 gp as a material component.
So someone has to buy the dust (be it you or your customer - chances are you don't want to pay 50 bucks for his sword to shine) before casting the spell.

Also I would probably note it under "Conditions Gained" and maybe "Ruby Dust" on the Inventory Tracking sheet.

[Pirate Rob]

Spell Like abilities don't use material components though, so you can freely cast continual flame on people's stuff.

It should be noted on their chronicle sheet and doesn't cost anything.

Do note that each PC may only posses 1 continual flame.

[LazarX]

Pirate Rob wrote:

Spell Like abilities don't use material components though, so you can freely cast continual flame on people's stuff.

It should be noted on their chronicle sheet and doesn't cost anything.

Do note that each PC may only posses 1 continual flame.

Actually, they DO. Relevant rules text follows. The following limitation on summoned vs called creatures is relevant.

A creature summoned in this way cannot use any spells or spell-like abilities that require material components costing more than 1 gp unless those components are supplied

[Blackbot]

I did not know you were talking about a spell-like ability, sorry.
In that case I agree with Pirate Rob.

LazarX:

PRD wrote:

Spell-Like Abilities (Sp) Spell-like abilities are magical and work just like spells (though they are not spells and so have no verbal, somatic, focus, or material components).

Link here

You are talking about called or summoned creatures. I'm pretty sure a PC qualifies as neither.
Okay, TECHNICALLY we are summoned by the VCs all the time before they send us off to our horrible, horrible deaths, but still.

[BigNorseWolf]

Unless its the extendedextendedextendedextended summon monster spell, the PC aasimar is not a summoned creature.

[Big Word]

Thanks for the guidance guys and I will note it appropriately. Would you expect this to raise controversy with GMs? I don't want to be a jerk or argue; it'd be kinda a nice thing to do for other PCs though.

[Pirate Rob]

Shouldn't cause and problems at all.

As a note I've reached 5th level with my Aasimar who has continual flame and I have never met another player that actually wanted a free continual flame from me.

[Nefreet]

Most ppl only care about heightened continual flame anyways, which you can't do with a spell-like ability.

[Big Word]

Oh interesting. Thanks.

[The Fox]

Be sure to have the GM document it on the receiving character's chronicle sheet. Documentation should include:

your character number;

your caster level (which will equal your character level if it is a SLA) at the time it was cast;

the spell level (for a SLA, it will be a 2nd-level spell, because SLAs are taken to be arcane unless the spell does not appear on the wizard spell list; if it is a cleric spell, it would be 3rd-level).

All of this is important for the player to know in the future if someone casts darkness or dispel magic on her.

[LazarX]

Blackbot wrote:

I did not know you were talking about a spell-like ability, sorry.

In that case I agree with Pirate Rob.

LazarX:

PRD wrote:

Spell-Like Abilities (Sp) Spell-like abilities are magical and work just like spells (though they are not spells and so have no verbal, somatic, focus, or material components).

Link here

You are talking about called or summoned creatures. I'm pretty sure a PC qualifies as neither.
Okay, TECHNICALLY we are summoned by the VCs all the time before they send us off to our horrible, horrible deaths, but still.

What the rule shows is that spell-like abilities are like spells in ALL ways. Including the need for material components.

[Orfamay Quest]

LazarX wrote:

Blackbot wrote:

I did not know you were talking about a spell-like ability, sorry.

In that case I agree with Pirate Rob.

LazarX:

PRD wrote:

Spell-Like Abilities (Sp) Spell-like abilities are magical and work just like spells (though they are not spells and so have no verbal, somatic, focus, or material components).

Link here

You are talking about called or summoned creatures. I'm pretty sure a PC qualifies as neither.
Okay, TECHNICALLY we are summoned by the VCs all the time before they send us off to our horrible, horrible deaths, but still.

What the rule shows is that spell-like abilities are like spells in ALL ways. Including the need for material components.

How do you read "except for material components" to mean "including the need for material components"?

[Jeff Morse]

LazarX wrote:

Blackbot wrote:

I did not know you were talking about a spell-like ability, sorry.

In that case I agree with Pirate Rob.

LazarX:

PRD wrote:

Spell-Like Abilities (Sp) Spell-like abilities are magical and work just like spells (though they are not spells and so have no verbal, somatic, focus, or material components).

Link here

You are talking about called or summoned creatures. I'm pretty sure a PC qualifies as neither.
Okay, TECHNICALLY we are summoned by the VCs all the time before they send us off to our horrible, horrible deaths, but still.

What the rule shows is that spell-like abilities are like spells in ALL ways. Including the need for material components.

Having one of those days are you. Been there. Its ok we have all been there.

[The Fox]

From the Core Rulebook, Chapter 9: Magic, p. 221:

CRB wrote:

Spell-Like Abilities: Usually, a spell-like ability works just like the spell of that name. A spell-like ability has no verbal, somatic, or material component, nor does it require a focus. The user activates it mentally.

[Angelo Gaius Cassius Fierro]

I have cast many a heightened continual flame for the Pathfinder that I have had the pleasure of adventuring with me.

Over the last few months, we've been improving how we record this purchase (of course, this should be on the character's ITS). Now we record my character number, the spell level it was cast at, my caster level when I cast it, so that will be less risk of table variation for the recipient.

Though, I have to say, having set up all these Continual Flames makes it much harder for me to use my Darkness SLA. Such is the life of a good Pathfinder.

[LazarX]

Jeff Morse wrote:

LazarX wrote:

Blackbot wrote:

I did not know you were talking about a spell-like ability, sorry.

In that case I agree with Pirate Rob.

LazarX:

PRD wrote:

Spell-Like Abilities (Sp) Spell-like abilities are magical and work just like spells (though they are not spells and so have no verbal, somatic, focus, or material components).

Link here

You are talking about called or summoned creatures. I'm pretty sure a PC qualifies as neither.
Okay, TECHNICALLY we are summoned by the VCs all the time before they send us off to our horrible, horrible deaths, but still.

What the rule shows is that spell-like abilities are like spells in ALL ways. Including the need for material components.

Having one of those days are you. Been there. Its ok we have all been there.

I see this as running the equivalent of Eschew Materials. It allows you go get use of spell like abilities of outsiders that you summon as long as the material cost falls under the Eschew Materials limit. For big ticket abilities however, that's another matter.

[BigNorseWolf]

Heighten spell and blood money on a sorcerer with a 14 strength here i come...

[Jiggy]

LazarX wrote:

I see this as running the equivalent of Eschew Materials. It allows you go get use of spell like abilities of outsiders that you summon as long as the material cost falls under the Eschew Materials limit. For big ticket abilities however, that's another matter.

Nobody's talking about a summoned creature's SLAs, therefore the rule specific to summoned creature's SLAs does not apply, leaving us with the general rule that flat-out says SLAs do not have material components.

[Zach W.]

LazarX wrote:

Jeff Morse wrote:

LazarX wrote:

Blackbot wrote:

I did not know you were talking about a spell-like ability, sorry.

In that case I agree with Pirate Rob.

LazarX:

PRD wrote:

Spell-Like Abilities (Sp) Spell-like abilities are magical and work just like spells (though they are not spells and so have no verbal, somatic, focus, or material components).

Link here

You are talking about called or summoned creatures. I'm pretty sure a PC qualifies as neither.
Okay, TECHNICALLY we are summoned by the VCs all the time before they send us off to our horrible, horrible deaths, but still.

What the rule shows is that spell-like abilities are like spells in ALL ways. Including the need for material components.

Having one of those days are you. Been there. Its ok we have all been there.

I see this as running the equivalent of Eschew Materials. It allows you go get use of spell like abilities of outsiders that you summon as long as the material cost falls under the Eschew Materials limit. For big ticket abilities however, that's another matter.

That would be the case if that's what the definition of the ability says. It does not mention that however. This is also how Jinn (?) can cast Wish without any of the necessary costs.

[Dhjika]

Nefreet wrote:

Most ppl only care about heightened continual flame anyways, which you can't do with a spell-like ability.

Since clerics get the spell as a 3rd level spell - any 5+ level cleric can provide a level 3 continual flame without needing heighten - unlikely to help the deeper darkness - but the regular darkness is more common

[godsDMit]

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Unless its the extendedextendedextendedextended summon monster spell, the PC aasimar is not a summoned creature.

An Aasimar who could summon other Aasimars would be awesome.

NPC: You and whose army?

Aasimar: *casts summon best friends from my hometown*
*five more assimars appear*

NPC: Well *censored*.

[keerawa]

My wizard has both the False Focus feat (so she can use a holy symbol in place of the material component) and the Heighten spell feat, so she's handed out many a Heightened Continual Flame to other characters!

We always write it on the player's Chronicle Sheet, as a Condition Gained. I note the object it is on, my character's name and PFS#, along with the spell level and caster level of the Continual Flame, in case any enemy tries to dispel it. Then the GM signs off on it.

[Drake Brimstone]

Seth Gipson wrote:

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Unless its the extendedextendedextendedextended summon monster spell, the PC aasimar is not a summoned creature.

An Aasimar who could summon other Aasimars would be awesome.

NPC: You and whose army?

Aasimar: *casts summon best friends from my hometown*
*five more assimars appear*

NPC: Well *censored*.

My Aasimar Cleric is Havenborn so if she casts Summon Monster or Planer Ally it just might be her BFF from Elysium.

[Jason Wu]

Drake Brimstone wrote:

Seth Gipson wrote:

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Unless its the extendedextendedextendedextended summon monster spell, the PC aasimar is not a summoned creature.

An Aasimar who could summon other Aasimars would be awesome.

NPC: You and whose army?

Aasimar: *casts summon best friends from my hometown*
*five more assimars appear*

NPC: Well *censored*.

My Aasimar Cleric is Havenborn so if she casts Summon Monster or Planer Ally it just might be her BFF from Elysium.

The somatic component should totally be your character raising her hand to her ear as if holding something and talking to the person being summoned asking if they could pop over for a bit.

-j

[Mystically Inclined]

Jason Wu wrote:

Drake Brimstone wrote:

My Aasimar Cleric is Havenborn so if she casts Summon Monster or Planer Ally it just might be her BFF from Elysium.

The somatic component should totally be your character raising her hand to her ear as if holding something and talking to the person being summoned asking if they could pop over for a bit.

-j

Agreed. Roleplaying that would be awesome.

*Summons a Hound Archon* Mr. Bubbles!!! Hi! How are you?!? *Pets him* Who's a good dog? WHO'S a good dog? You are! Yes you are! Yes you are!

(Describe the Hound Archon panting and wagging his tail.)

*Points to the bad guy* Now Mr. Bubbles, SICK 'EM!

(Describe the look of growing horror on the bad guy's face as the friendly dog becomes an angel of wrath.)