It says "Alternatively, you may store up to 1 pound of ammunition in a wrist sheath". Look at the Launching crossbow. It uses vials as ammo. So there is no reason you can't have a potion in it.
So size wise it'll fit, actually it's a kind of small. The only real question is if it would break in the wrist sheath as you try to get it out.
Have a feeling this is also going to end up as a GM call.
As a DM I'd allow it (houserule, obviously) if the player thought it through, for 3 potions.
The breakage thing is pretty much a non-issue if you construct it right. Leather forearm wrap, with leather slots. Each leather slot has a metal cylinder in it. The vials fit within the cylinders.
Given the combination of leather and metal, and the bulk (which is not huge, but it's also not zero), I'd call it a bracer and stipulate that you couldn't effectively use a shield (-1) with an arm that had one of them on it.
If a player wanted the spring-loaded variety, I'd raise my wicked DM eyebrows, imagine the sound of very expensive potions shattering, and say it could only hold one potion per ten feet of launching distance, max 2 potions.
Speaking as a player I think I'd rather have a bandolier for this sort of thing, but that's just personal preference.
If you read the text on the Launching Crossbow it specifically uses only splash weapons as its ammunition. Not potions.
So a flask of oil would be fine but the same flask filled with a potion now doesn't fit? That makes no sense. If it can hold the flask, how does the wrist sheath 'know' what in it and spit makes it spit out the potion?
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If you read the text on the Launching Crossbow it specifically uses only splash weapons as its ammunition. Not potions.So a flask of oil would be fine but the same flask filled with a potion now doesn't fit? That makes no sense. If it can hold the flask, how does the wrist sheath 'know' what in it and spit makes it spit out the potion?
Potions come in vials, which have no weight.
Alchemical weapons come in flasks, which weigh 1 pound.
They are different items.
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>The key part of this sentence is >such as<, which is never used exclusively, to mean like or for example<
In cases of "such as", in PFS, you go with the examples given.
It is the only way to avoid table variation.
Obviously some GMs ignore this, but the principle is there. They are simply choosing not to apply it.
EDIT: HERE is a similar instance of "such as" where the Campaign Coordinator chimes in with his opinion. It's not regarding spring-loaded wrist sheaths, but the same logic applies.
If you read the text on the Launching Crossbow it specifically uses only splash weapons as its ammunition. Not potions.So a flask of oil would be fine but the same flask filled with a potion now doesn't fit? That makes no sense. If it can hold the flask, how does the wrist sheath 'know' what in it and spit makes it spit out the potion?Potions come in vials, which have no weight.
Alchemical weapons come in flasks, which weigh 1 pound.
They are different items.
So something stops me from putting my potion in a flask that fits in the sheath?
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The middle ground is usually that a wrist sheathe will hold a small straight weapon like a dagger/dart/arrow, potion, wand or scroll, but not a rod.
Stricter GMs will say no scrolls or potions (usually citing they will break/can't be unfurled quickly); more lenient GMs will even allow a rod (the agreed size of a rod is in flux).
I'd even go for a single scroll...see spring loaded roll-down window shades.
The middle ground is usually that a wrist sheathe will hold a small straight weapon like a dagger/dart/arrow, potion, wand or scroll, but not a rod.
Stricter GMs will say no scrolls or potions (usually citing they will break/can't be unfurled quickly); more lenient GMs will even allow a rod (the agreed size of a rod is in flux).
An iron vial takes care of any breaking issues.
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So something stops me from putting my potion in a flask that fits in the sheath?If you read the text on the Launching Crossbow it specifically uses only splash weapons as its ammunition. Not potions.So a flask of oil would be fine but the same flask filled with a potion now doesn't fit? That makes no sense. If it can hold the flask, how does the wrist sheath 'know' what in it and spit makes it spit out the potion?Potions come in vials, which have no weight.
Alchemical weapons come in flasks, which weigh 1 pound.
They are different items.
Yes. You cannot craft in PFS. For the most part, if you own something, it's exactly as described in the book it came from. Can you show me where potions come in flask sizes?
We can dance back and forth all night, but the OP wanted to know how this was handled in PFS, so I'm giving him the PFS answer.
the idea of putting 5 Arrows (20"+ depending on draw length, I have a 30"-32" myself) in a wrist sheath,is very silly. (unless its some kind of magical wrist sheath, cause magic fixes everything).
Those arrows shafts would get in the way of almost any actions.
But I guess its mechanics over realism.
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the idea of putting 5 Arrows (20"+ depending on draw length, I have a 30"-32" myself) in a wrist sheath,is very silly. (unless its some kind of magical wrist sheath, cause magic fixes everything).
Those arrows shafts would get in the way of almost any actions.But I guess its mechanics over realism.
Nobody disputes this. The arrow argument is brought up every time. The whole idea behind a reliable, 100% safe, spring loaded wrist sheath, that somehow fits many different types of items, and is easily concealed under a sleeve, with no worry that it might go off at any time with the slightest bump, *and* it fits with bracers, is "very silly" to me.
Yes, game mechanics over realism is a good way to put this.
So something stops me from putting my potion in a flask that fits in the sheath?If you read the text on the Launching Crossbow it specifically uses only splash weapons as its ammunition. Not potions.So a flask of oil would be fine but the same flask filled with a potion now doesn't fit? That makes no sense. If it can hold the flask, how does the wrist sheath 'know' what in it and spit makes it spit out the potion?Potions come in vials, which have no weight.
Alchemical weapons come in flasks, which weigh 1 pound.
They are different items.
Yes. You cannot craft in PFS. For the most part, if you own something, it's exactly as described in the book it came from. Can you show me where potions come in flask sizes?
We can dance back and forth all night, but the OP wanted to know how this was handled in PFS, so I'm giving him the PFS answer.
Erm - the original post says nothing about PFS. Nor has the OP posted again in the thread since then. Jacob Saltband was the first person to mention PFS in the thread.
From a parsing of syntax, the "such as" is a list of examples, not a list of restrictions. If PFS uses it as the latter that's fine, but in that case they're grossly overlimiting what a wrist sheath by RAW can hold. The only restriction is that it be an object roughly the length and width of a forearm.
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The "Wrist Sheath and Scrolls" thread he mentioned in the OP is a recent thread concerning the interaction of wrist sheaths and scrolls in PFS. It was virtually identical to how this thread is turning out.
And there's a good reason for it. Your GM may not always agree with you about what fits in a wrist sheath. If one GM says "yes" to a scroll of Breath of Life, and you buy one because of that call, and the next GM says "no", you now have a useless scroll (unless you carry it in hand for the whole game).
If everyone knows the situation ahead of game, then there's no table variation, and things run smoothly.
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Ah, okay. I was confused; I don't normally follow the PFS forums so I wasn't aware it had come up there. I can see the reasoning behind the restrictions for PFS, but it's also those restrictions are one of the key reasons why I don't really join society, heh.
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GMs have leeway in PFS when rules - like the wrist sheathes - aren't explicit.
The sheath can hold one forearm-length item such as a dagger, dart, or wand, or up to five arrows or crossbow bolts. Alternatively, you may store up to 1 pound of ammunition in a wrist sheath.
...as it applies here.
Table variation is inevitable in cases like this, unless you always play with the same GM. GMs aren't obliged to stick with only the listed examples when there's wording like "such as..." in there. Any home game GM plays the same way.
So something stops me from putting my potion in a flask that fits in the sheath?If you read the text on the Launching Crossbow it specifically uses only splash weapons as its ammunition. Not potions.So a flask of oil would be fine but the same flask filled with a potion now doesn't fit? That makes no sense. If it can hold the flask, how does the wrist sheath 'know' what in it and spit makes it spit out the potion?Potions come in vials, which have no weight.
Alchemical weapons come in flasks, which weigh 1 pound.
They are different items.
Yes. You cannot craft in PFS. For the most part, if you own something, it's exactly as described in the book it came from. Can you show me where potions come in flask sizes?
We can dance back and forth all night, but the OP wanted to know how this was handled in PFS, so I'm giving him the PFS answer.
I think I'd rather have my question answered. In PFS, is there some rule that potions MUST stay in vials? If I buy a flask, I couldn't put a potion in it? Is the vial an integral part of the potion? Are you telling me a PFS GM wouldn't allow a potion in a flask?
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In PFS, is there some rule that potions MUST stay in vials? If I buy a flask, I couldn't put a potion in it? Is the vial an integral part of the potion? Are you telling me a PFS GM wouldn't allow a potion in a flask?
I'd be fine with it - that's not "crafting". Potions don't care what you put them in. It's almost a reflavour, except that you're changing the mechanics of durability.
Actually, an iron vial takes care of the weight issue as well, since they weigh 1 pound - and it would be unlikely to break.
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So something stops me from putting my potion in a flask that fits in the sheath?If you read the text on the Launching Crossbow it specifically uses only splash weapons as its ammunition. Not potions.So a flask of oil would be fine but the same flask filled with a potion now doesn't fit? That makes no sense. If it can hold the flask, how does the wrist sheath 'know' what in it and spit makes it spit out the potion?Potions come in vials, which have no weight.
Alchemical weapons come in flasks, which weigh 1 pound.
They are different items.
Yes. You cannot craft in PFS. For the most part, if you own something, it's exactly as described in the book it came from. Can you show me where potions come in flask sizes?
We can dance back and forth all night, but the OP wanted to know how this was handled in PFS, so I'm giving him the PFS answer.
Actually, you are not giving him the PFS answer. You are giving him your interpretation, and both, in my opinion, being weirdly strict and obtuse in your reading of the post you cite, and trying to apply an answer for pasta to apples.
That post you cite is specific to that situation, it is not a be-all or end-all post, even for PFS.
Darts are not much bigger, if any bigger at all, than a potion flask. Consider a dart for a halfling or gnome, then compare it to a set of 5 arrows for a half-orc... Yet both of those things will fit into the same wrist sheath...
1, i agree.that.iron flask potion in wrist sheath should be fine.
2. Darts are.much larger than potions.
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1, i agree.that.iron flask potion in wrist sheath should be fine.
2. Darts are.much larger than potions.
Blowgun darts don't even list a weight for a unit of 10.
Darts as a standalone ranged weapon are 1/2 pound for a medium creature, so a gnome's dart is 1/4 pound, or something like 4 ounces.
I sincerely doubt that a weapon that is designed to throw, that weighs 4 ounces, is going to be terribly large, especially when it is sized for a 3' tall creature.
And the fact, as mentioned up-thread, that arrows, in a bundle of 5, are going to run longer, if sized appropriately for the creature, than the creature's forearm. After all, proper full draw with a bow is to have it pretty much out at one arm's length, then pull the arrow back so that only a little bit is sitting on the rest, the nock is on the string, and you have the string drawn back to within a couple of inches of your face. That distance should be fairly close to double the length of your forearm. Yet that will fit into your spring loaded wrist sheath...
Im not saying it should be an issue. Just saw the notion of darts being similalry sized as potions. A potion is 5cm. A roman dart was 30-60 centimeters. So even a halfling version of the shortest romandarts should be around 15 cm. Not saying itd be a terribly effective weapon but thats the size.
Blowgun darts are a whole different thing and probably not what they were talking about.
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That post you cite is specific to that situation, it is not a be-all or end-all post, even for PFS.
It is the most comprehensive way to avoid table variation, which is key in Pathfinder Society, and it has the support of Campaign Leadership.
I can think of no better way to handle similar issues, including Wrist Sheaths. Can you?