Half Orc and Half Elf Ability Rule


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


My first post and my first ever thread started here. I'm so excited!

This topic is more just me looking for opinions on a set Pathfinder rule.

Okay, under 3.5 rules the Half Orc had...what a +2 to STR and CON and a -2 to CHA. The Half Elf had...um...a +2 to INT and DEX and a -2 to CON. Is that correct? I believe so.

My question is why did Pathfinder under their new basically 3.75 rules system give the two 'mixed' races the same +2 to drop in any stat of their choosing like a Human and that's all?

I think, since these two are mixed races, that the rule should have been that the player pick one of the former +2s -- STR or CON for the Half Orc and INT or DEX for the Half Elf and THEN, with only the one used, they could add the Humans +2 to wherever they like. These are two races joined, yes? They should benefit from each parent...to a point.

My only concern is that -2. Hmm? Not sure what to do about that.

Opinions?

Thanks ahead of time everyone.

Snip

Grand Lodge

It's quite simple.

The change to the Half-Orc was to get them out of he stupid brute idiot box they'd been painted into and make it a true combination of orcish heritage and human flexibility. You CAN make your half-orc an idiot of brute strength if you WANT to. You're simply no longer locked into that stereotype.

The changes in the half-elf pretty much follow from the same logic.


The change to the Half-Orc was to get them out of he stupid brute idiot box they'd been painted into and make it a true combination of orcish heritage and human flexibility. You CAN make your half-orc an idiot of brute strength if you WANT to. You're simply no longer locked into that stereotype.

Exactly my point and why I wanted a combination of the older rule in 3.5 and a tweak of the rule to help benefit from both races.

Say I wanted a Half Orc Wizard. I'd pick CON as one of my +2s and not STR. For my +2 to add wherever from my Human side, I'd put in INT. Done. Plug in the rest of my numbers and pick my spells. Time to play.

I suppose my idea for a tweak of the rule might've been they thought it too overpowered. Dunno.

I guess my concern is I don't see a 'mix' in their current rule choice for the Half races. I see three Human picks when rolling up Ability scores and that's all.

Thanks for the quick reply.

Snip


Snip the Shadow wrote:

My first post and my first ever thread started here. I'm so excited!

This topic is more just me looking for opinions on a set Pathfinder rule.

Okay, under 3.5 rules the Half Orc had...what a +2 to STR and CON and a -2 to CHA. The Half Elf had...um...a +2 to INT and DEX and a -2 to CON. Is that correct? I believe so.

My question is why did Pathfinder under their new basically 3.75 rules system give the two 'mixed' races the same +2 to drop in any stat of their choosing like a Human and that's all?

I think, since these two are mixed races, that the rule should have been that the player pick one of the former +2s -- STR or CON for the Half Orc and INT or DEX for the Half Elf and THEN, with only the one used, they could add the Humans +2 to wherever they like. These are two races joined, yes? They should benefit from each parent...to a point.

My only concern is that -2. Hmm? Not sure what to do about that.

Opinions?

Thanks ahead of time everyone.

Snip

Hate to nitpick, but Half Orcs only got a +2 STR and -2 int AND cha, half elves didn't get anything


Wow!

I got it waaay incorrect! Sheesh!

Thanks for the clarification.

Snip


Snip the Shadow wrote:

Wow!

I got it waaay incorrect! Sheesh!

Thanks for the clarification.

Snip

NP, with the upgrade to 3.75, half elves and half orcs get an improvement when you think of it.


Solidchaos085 wrote:
Snip the Shadow wrote:

Wow!

I got it waaay incorrect! Sheesh!

Thanks for the clarification.

Snip

NP, with the upgrade to 3.75, half elves and half orcs get an improvement when you think of it.

They sure do. Much better.

I still like my idea even if I was so far off the mark. Ah well.

Thanks again.

Snip


Snip the Shadow wrote:

Okay, under 3.5 rules the Half Orc had...what a +2 to STR and CON and a -2 to CHA. The Half Elf had...um...a +2 to INT and DEX and a -2 to CON. Is that correct? I believe so.

So far from the truth. Half-elves had NO racial adjustments. Half-orcs had +2 str, -2 cha, -2 int.

Grand Lodge

Snip the Shadow wrote:
Solidchaos085 wrote:
Snip the Shadow wrote:

Wow!

I got it waaay incorrect! Sheesh!

Thanks for the clarification.

Snip

NP, with the upgrade to 3.75, half elves and half orcs get an improvement when you think of it.

They sure do. Much better.

I still like my idea even if I was so far off the mark. Ah well.

Thanks again.

Snip

No one is going to stop you or stomp on you if you use it at home.


Yeah, your house rule is your house rule. If it works for you and your players, that's great.

Me, I like the idea of the part-humans gaining the human's stat modifier. It's like getting a portion of the human parent's flexibility while also gaining some other special abilities derived from their non-human heritage.

Sczarni

Also, in the Advanced Race Guide, we are given insight on how to create a Half-orc, a Half-elf, or a custom race of your own design.

If Half-elves and Half-orcs received +2 to two different stats, with no corresponding penalty to a third stat, it would probably raise their "race points" unfairly higher than the other Core races.


Snip the Shadow wrote:
My question is why did Pathfinder under their new basically 3.75 rules system give the two 'mixed' races the same +2 to drop in any stat of their choosing like a Human and that's all?

Pathfinders design assumed that all character races should start with a net +2 to their stats and that when possible/appropriate there shouldn't be a negative if possible.

They also assumed that things crossed with humans or 'half breed races' were versatile species (which to some extant mimics real world biology).

As such they received a +2 to one statistic of their choice, both to reflect these concepts and to make them more attractive races to play for ANY class. Where before they were mainly only used for certain ones classes you could now play them as any class and have a good main stat for that class, thus increasing the amount of them in play and expanding RP opportunities as well

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