Goblin Squad Member
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Hey I just wanted to throw out a few ideas and was afraid that they would get lost because of the recent toxicity of the forums (one locked and another in danger of being locked). Please don't use this thread to start blaming who got toxic first. Many of the people arguing have, in the past, actually agreed, debated in a non-insulting manner, apologized to each other, and apparently PM'd and spoken amiably on TeamSpeak. Ok, so, here they are.
If you get killed and looted you become unflagged (immune) to pvp (not pve) for 10 minutes. The timer would start from when you retrieve your husk. You lose this immunity if you gain the Attacker, Criminal or Heinous flags and take a rep hit for doing so. You also lose it if you are rezzed by another player. Why 10 min? I think I read somewhere that it takes about that long to move across a hex. I don't think you could use this immunity to gather a bunch of immunes together for an attack/mission; they would have to heal, regain Power, refresh abilities and grab some new equipment. Also in any case when a bunch of bozos that you don't know or trust (you can see their rep) are starting to form you should be taking action no matter what anyway (running away, calling allies, prepare for pvp). This would make corpse camping extremely difficult.
Make starter/tutorial areas not just high-rep loss, Marshall patrolled, etc., but pvp FREE. These areas would be small. They can be supported by Pathfinder lore; this is Iomedae's Sanctuary, this place is under the Edict of Compliance by Asmodeus, Prince of Law, etc. This immunity could have a threshold determined by Goblinworks if they don't want players with some skills and achievements using the area as a completely safe place to run to. I know they don't ever want a player to feel completely safe as part of the overall plan, but, reconsider: a small spot where the newest of the newbies can learn game mechanics without being ganked. This is where you could allow duels which I know they also don't want.
Lairs, instanced or not, out in Wilderness hexes with treasure chests, monster guardians and consequence-free pvp. You'd know what you're getting into and it might be a blast. And there could still be the lairs that go under the normal rules as well.
And what else?
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Goblin Squad Member
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One issue I've seen with the immunity (flag / timer) is that immune characters will then return to the battlefield, and in the confusion, will draw the (useless) fire. Meanwhile their "active" target friends are able to attack, without catching as much focus fire on themselves.
This example was experienced in Fallen Earth, not sure if it was fixed.
However having an immunity after respawn did alleviate or eliminate respawn camping.
10 minutes might be too long, or it should end as soon as your return to the general area of where you were killed. Why should you be immune from PVP in order to retrieve your belongings from your corpse?
It is always safer to assume your corpse has been stripped, and not look to return to it at all.
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Goblin Squad Member
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One issue I've seen with the immunity (flag / timer) is that immune characters will then return to the battlefield, and in the confusion, will draw the (useless) fire. Meanwhile their "active" target friends are able to attack, without catching as much focus fire on themselves.
This example was experienced in Fallen Earth, not sure if it was fixed.
However having an immunity after respawn did alleviate or eliminate respawn camping.
10 minutes might be too long, or it should end as soon as your return to the general area of where you were killed. Why should you be immune from PVP in order to retrieve your belongings from your corpse?
It is always safer to assume your corpse has been stripped, and not look to return to it at all.
I rarely have returned to my corpse, except in PVE situations in most MMOs. Then again, I don't travel around with more than I can easily afford to lose either.
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Goblin Squad Member
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One issue I've seen with the immunity (flag / timer) is that immune characters will then return to the battlefield, and in the confusion, will draw the (useless) fire. Meanwhile their "active" target friends are able to attack, without catching as much focus fire on themselves.
This example was experienced in Fallen Earth, not sure if it was fixed.
However having an immunity after respawn did alleviate or eliminate respawn camping.
10 minutes might be too long, or it should end as soon as your return to the general area of where you were killed. Why should you be immune from PVP in order to retrieve your belongings from your corpse?
It is always safer to assume your corpse has been stripped, and not look to return to it at all.
The immune flag would be visible like any other; players in combat would have to learn and react to it like any other flag or condition. And remember, the flag I'm proposing only operates when a player is killed and looted; I'm assuming all the good unthreaded stuff will be gone unless your friends defended your husk as usual. If you're the type of player who doesn't go back to your husk then you play as usual. The timer would only start once you retrieved your husk, as I stated.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The immune flag would be visible like any other; players in combat would have to learn and react to it like any other flag or condition. And remember, the flag I'm proposing only operates when a player is killed and looted; I'm assuming all the good unthreaded stuff will be gone unless your friends defended your husk as usual. If you're the type of player who doesn't go back to your husk then you play as usual. The timer would only start once you retrieved your husk, as I stated.
So you would not be immune to PvP when you respawn, and furthermore you wouldn't be immune to PvP while running toward your corpse; you would only be immune once you actually interacted with the corpse?
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Goblin Squad Member
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The immune flag would be visible like any other; players in combat would have to learn and react to it like any other flag or condition. And remember, the flag I'm proposing only operates when a player is killed and looted; I'm assuming all the good unthreaded stuff will be gone unless your friends defended your husk as usual. If you're the type of player who doesn't go back to your husk then you play as usual. The timer would only start once you retrieved your husk, as I stated.So you would not be immune to PvP when you respawn, and furthermore you wouldn't be immune to PvP while running toward your corpse; you would only be immune once you actually interacted with the corpse?
No I forgot-you would have to be immune when you respawn and then have the 10 min. to run and retrieve what you could and then perhaps have time to regain your strength. Hmmm. Might be a little too ambitious.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think there's a good case to be made for an Immunity state to exist when you first log in, lasting only until you move or activate any ability, and only up to 2 or 3 minutes regardless.
And while I'd like there to be an Immunity state when your client disconnects, I realize that too many players would forcefully disconnect to avoid losing a fight for that to ever be viable.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Yeah, I think there would be situations that immunity would be great for curbing griefing. But I'm really wondering when and for how long. Probably have to wait and see how things shake out. But I still like the idea of small areas the very newest players can be free from non-consensual pvp and lairs with consequence-free pvp in addition to regular ones.
