I'm playing with 2 other guys and I am the skill monkey/sneaky person. I haven't yet decided on a race but I was thinking dwarf, aasimar, or tiefling. My goddess is Dessna and I chose the luck domain. For part of my back story I was going to be a roadwarrior in Isger fighting to keep the roads safe. I kind of want to do Two-Weapon fighting for my Ranger side. I have not decided on the Hunter's Bond. I might just go with the animal companion.
One thing I always worry about with animal companions in gestalt builds (although my actual experience with such games is limited, and I am unsure if it is justified) is whether their saves would end up being too low, since the DCs would typically be aimed at a whole party with perfect saves.
Dwarf has a certain advantage as a TWF build, although I do not know if this takes it away from your original concept. The reasons is because they have access to a racial double weapon. Double weapons are excellent for TWF since, while they can be treated as a one handed and light weapon for TWF, they can also be treated as a regular two handed weapon. This means that you could pull off standard attacks with 1.5x strength and power attack damage. This really helps make your actual DPR.
Interestingly, a tiefling could also pull off something similar if you gave them the alternate racial trait to get a bite (since, if you only have a single natural weapon, you get the same bonuses as two-handing). Seems simple enough, and does not interfere with your TWF style. Unfortunately, the fact that it would be hard to enhance if you are not doing natural weapon/twf style is a problem (although, the Bodywraps of Mighty Strikes is a relatively cheap option which is not favored since it only enhances a somewhat small number of attacks per round; perfect for someone that only occasionally uses natural attacks/unarmed strikes though. Also, greater magical fang might be an option for rangers)
For characterization, I do like that all your characters get darkvision. Considering the fact that your god is strongly associated with the night, but is not evil, the ability to go around at night without tripping over yourself seems like a plus.
I'm rolling with a cavalier//wizard in a Gestalt game and haven't had issues with saves thus far. The horse is a beast on the fortitude/reflex side, and poor on will, as expected. At 6th level he picks up devotion, though, which will help quite a bit.
You're going to want to invest in barding, potions, potion sponges, magic items, and alchemical preventatives like antitoxins. I'd grab boon companion ASAP and bump its intelligence for its 4th level stat increase, netting 3 new tricks, opening up the feats you can take and gaining the ability to understand a language. Sir Thugsalot has posted a number of mount-oriented builds on this forum and I'd look them up. I assume you're going to want a wolf or similar for a companion instead of a horse, but much of the advice is the same.
STR Ranger's guide is where I'd go to look for TWF advice. I'd look up Lastoth's mounted archery ranger guide for advice on that route. Sir Thugsalot has written some good stuff on using quickdraw to its fullest should you want to swap between bow, lance and melee weapon(s).
I have decided to be a tiefling. I am no longer sure about my ranger fighting style. I just know that I do not want archery or mounted combat.
the bottom line is that its going to be hard to screw up a ranger/inquisitor- all the things that make inquisitors viable melee characters, plus full BAB (and d10 HD, and all good saves, and wisdom synergy, and extra spells...), can't go wrong. bane only effects one weapon, so the best build is probably 2hander... though the destruction judgement and favored enemy both effect multiple weapons, so i guess a double weapon really probably would be your best bet.
if you're playing gestalt to use APs with too few characters an animal companion will be a nice addition, if you're doing it for fun (and encounters will be tailored to gestalt power level) an animal companion will be out of its league (in my experiece... we actually had a summoner switch because his eidolon couldn't keep up, and they're stronger than animal companions). if you decide not to take an animal companion, i like the spirit ranger archetype but there are lots that trade away hunters bond (and you could always take the other bond option).
the bottom line is that its going to be hard to screw up a ranger/inquisitor- all the things that make inquisitors viable melee characters, plus full BAB (and d10 HD, and all good saves, and wisdom synergy, and extra spells...), can't go wrong. bane only effects one weapon, so the best build is probably 2hander... though the destruction judgement and favored enemy both effect multiple weapons, so i guess a double weapon really probably would be your best bet.
Ah, fine point there. Relying on only one weapon at a time might be best. Still, you could go for a switch hitter (melee build that uses style feats to be decent at archery too before using quickdraw when opponents close in). Even if you have very modest dexterity, you will find your favored enemy and/or judgments will more than over the gap.
Also....due to my deep seated desire to plug this kind of build (so forgive how much I go on about it)... How about a ranger with a dip of monk so they can use TWF style feats instead of flurry with unarmed strikes? I suggest a monk dip for an unarmed build since their form of Improved Unarmed Strike is never off hand, which means they always get full strength and power attack damage. Unarmed strikes are considered one weapon for spells, so bane could still work. Maybe go with a dip into Master of Many Styles archetype for monks since it switches out flurry for a bonus style feat that can help with flavor/power. Dragon style is nice for damage, but I kind of have a sweet spot for boar style since it allows you to tear opponents apart with your bare hands.
another nice thing about a monk dip is that many inquisitor abilities only work on weapons... there is some debate about whether or not your fist counts as a weapon (really its a natural attack), but not for monks- their unarmed strike explicitly counts as a natural attack or manufactured weapon (whichever is more beneficial).
that said, if you're going to take the dip think about putting it on the inquisitor side- that hurts a little more in terms of delaying spell levels and bane but it allows you to maintain full BAB...
Or drop a level of ranger. Again, with judgments and favored enemies, do you really have to worry to much about your attack bonus? You still end with +19 BAB, which is hardly shabby with all those bonuses. A dip into the ranger side is also perfectly within the limits of boon companion too.
Sure, there is a bit about power attack delay...but is it that noticeable? Maybe also a delay in an iterative attack too, except that might be less obvious since newly acquired ones would hit at no BAB....not much to miss.
Hmmm. Never considered the monk dip. I'm not sure what to think about that.
It has been suggested that taking favored enemy Dragons as the first favored enemy would be a good idea for this campaign and I was told nothing else. So I found the Yokai Hunter Inquisitor archetype. Any thoughts?
I think I have narrowed the combat style down to TWF and THF thanks to you guys. You have made some excellent arguments for both cases nate lange. Any further advise?
If you are considering two handed weapons, have you considered a reach build? It is an excellent way to turn yourself into an obstacle 25' wide, and tieflings have access to a bite weapon that could be used to threaten adjacent squares. Just think of getting judgments and favored enemy boosted hits off through a ton of AoOs.
I'd also like to admit something that is fairly off topic: I mostly fell in love with that ranger/monk build because, when you throw in a style that allows for slashing like boar style, it provided a way to have a natural attack build...well without all the hassle of natural attacks (for example, it is a bit hard to keep up with bite/claw/claw after level 10, and I would rather not delve into the various helms, capes, etc for more natural attacks) . The fact that it works well mechanically is just a nice side benefit.
I hadn't considered it. I did not know what I would use if I went the two-handed. I admit that option does intreage me. How would you go about doing it? How ever it might not really be an option since I went for the optional Tiefling traits and wound up with 2 abilities for the price of the spell like ability which is what the bite replaces. The abilities were +1 Natural Armor and the ability to see on the Ethereal Plane. I suppose I could try to see if the GM would let me put a rat folk tailspike or a kobold tailspike on my tail.
If I did go TWF I think I would go duel Gladius. Or maybe just one in my off hand.
natural attack are kind of a trap for inquisitors... you can't use bane or several of your judgments with them! for weapons- 2hander vs. 2WF often comes down to stats.... high str favors 2hander, high dex favors 2WF; a reach build is kind of the middle ground cause it needs str for damage but needs dex to make use of combat reflexes. i haven't tried to count your feats, but you might be able to put together a 'switch-hitter' who went back and forth between 2hander and 2WF... if you can afford proficiency with the Meteor Hammer, that can be used as a reach weapon or as a double weapon (decided as a free action at the beginning of your turn)- you could select 2WF for combat style and spend your actual feats on combat reflexes, power attack, etc. it would be feat intensive (and you'd have to invest heavily in Str and Dex), but it could be fun and functional.
barring that, either option is good just pick whichever one seems more fun (and/or works better with your stats) and run with it. if you go 2WF a double weapon or two of the same (light) weapons is actually a strong choice because any weapon-specific feats you take will apply with both hands.
...Why would high dex be favored for TWF on a ranger? Rangers skip the prerequisites for feats they take as part of their style, so they can easily go with a high strength build. That is one of the main appeals of using rangers for TWF.
Not that you really even need that high a high dex to get TWF feats anyway. On a 20 point build, you could easily end up with 16 16 14 physical stats as long as you have a race that gives a bonus to either strength or dex. With the 4th level ability score adjustment into dex, you would qualify for all the good TWF feats normally. But this is discussion more for fighters and rogues, since rangers can skip the dex prerequisites.
I wouldn't say that the lack of natural attack is that bad. It is like the advantage of getting twohanded attacks with a double weapon I mentioned earlier. It is nice to have, but not too essential. I mean, most reach users are human (since most characters are human) without too much trouble. I am not entirely unsure how much dex you might really need for a reach build due to combat reflexes, but 14 should suffice for a while before you start seeing stat increasing items.
But of course, going the traditional route with TWF of gladius (which are clearly intended to be 'shortswords, but we added slashing') is fine too. You might want to look into taking a wolf as your animal companion. Their bites have the trip property, and when they advance at 7th level, they get a sizable strength increase along with a larger size, so they can make it somewhat realistic to trip a lot of land based enemies. Why? Because the enemies would have to waste an action in order to get up, which means that they are less able to run (and if you are flanking with the wolf, that means an attack of opportunity). Overall, it means you can get more attacks off.
Have you thought about am inquisitor archer concept? team work feats work well with an animal companion and he should be ok to seriously lay on the hurt.
If archer concept intrigues you and you are a dwarf then also consider inquisitor zen archer monk, you can still get an AC from animal domain and the wisdom synergies just line up
here's why i said what i did about str v. dex builds:
16 Str/Dex is a balanced build, in 20 pb high Str would be 18 (with probably 12-14 Dex)... a ranger is the only class that can 2WF with those stats and it does (i think) have an edge in dpr when it gets to full attack, but 2hander has the advantage when you need to move (which is fairly often). high dex builds depend more on static bonuses (from things like power attack/piranha strike or arcane strike) which gain more benefit the more attacks you get (favoring 2WF). double weapons sort of get the best of both worlds, which is why they're so great for rangers (especially strong rangers). and 14 is probably sufficient for combat reflexes but higher is better- mostly because reach builds really benefit from being enlarged and the bigger you get the bigger your penalty to Dex (usually); if you have 14 dex, getting enlarge person (with a reach weapon) makes you threaten a huge area (like 50' across) but you'll be limited to 2 AoOs/round (though items or cat's grace will fix that).
the combination of all these factors (the strengths and weaknesses of each style, and the ranger's unique ability to do all 3 well), is why i suggested the meteor hammer- that one weapon can also do all 3!
....two of the three races suggested by l3thlongshot can't benefit from enlarge person (including tieflings, which is the one he actually chose to go with). Admittedly, your principles are generally sound though.
yeah- the 'enlarge person' comment was a general statement not applicable to aasimar/tieflings/and the 4 elemental races... the concept may apply for this build too though, at higher levels- if he chooses righteous might as a spell known or puts the righteous enchantment on his armor.
Alright I think I will go 2WF with @ gladius.
Does anyone think the tiefling only feats are any good. I was thinking of getting grasping tail since I will have a tail. That way I could fire a hand crossbow, drop it, pick it back up with my tail, and draw a weapon.
armor of the pit is pretty handy...
Fiend sight is good if you have the two feats to drop in order to get the See in Darkness ability.
Thanks. You guys were a great help.