Vishkanyas and Sleep Venom confussion


Rules Questions


Okay! So here's some foreknowledge...

Toxic: A number of times per day equal to his Constitution modifier (minimum 1/day), a vishkanya can envenom a weapon that he wields with his toxic saliva or blood (using blood requires the vishkanya to be injured when he uses this ability). Applying venom in this way is a swift action.

Vishkanya Venom: Injury; save Fort DC 10 + 1/2 the vishkanya's Hit Dice + the vishkanya's Constitution modifier; frequency 1/round for 6 rounds; effect 1d2 Dex; cure 1 save.

Sleep Venom

You can change the nature of your toxic spittle to put your enemies to sleep.

Prerequisite: Vishkanya.

Benefit: As a swift action, you may alter the effects of your venom so the target falls unconscious. This changes the initial and secondary effect of your venom to the following: initial effect staggered for 1d4 rounds; secondary effect unconsciousness for 1 minute. You must make the decision to alter your venom before you apply it to a weapon.

Normal: Vishkanya venom deals Dexterity damage.

So here's the general question... How the hell does this work?

Do they have to make a save every round they are staggered or become unconscious, or do they make a secondary save after a D4 rounds, or is there no secondary effect save and the poisoning recipient is unconscious after the D4 rounds, or something all together different?

I guess it's the wording that's messing with me. If there's no secondary effect to start with Toxic why would it suggest a change to Sleep Venom? Is the D4 rounds of staggered also considered the onset time for a secondary effect? I feel like a tiger chasing his own tail here. Thanks for the help fellow gamers!

Dark Archive

Initial effect means when the target is hit by the venom they need to make a save if they fail they take this effect (Staggered for 1d4 rounds)

Secondary Effect occurs on the following round (as it does not change the frequency of the poison), they get a save to avoid falling unconscious for 1 minute as the poison is cure 1 save they are no longer poisoned if they pass although they initial effect might still be running for another few rounds


Take the writeup for vishkanya venom. Replace the initial and (nonexistent) secondary fields with the listed effects for sleep venom. Now you have a new poison.

The poison section mentions how to adjudicate poisons with secondary effects.


So, yet another odd question about this poison/feat combo. It then also takes two rounds to use it on one's weapon? Saying it's now two swift actions.


My interpretation was that the type of poison is a toggle, that can be changed mid-battle or outside of battle, and so shouldn't usually interfere with battle.


I agree that it seems to be a toggle. It's really awkward otherwise.

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