There are special exceptions as thenobledrake notes, but for the most part, sadly, access to additional bonus feats has been done by archetypes instead of classification. So anyone playing a standard monk loses out.
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There are special exceptions as thenobledrake notes, but for the most part, sadly, access to additional bonus feats has been done by archetypes instead of classification. So anyone playing a standard monk loses out.Anyone playing any monk loses out, standard or not. The archetypes with better bonus feat lists are all ranch and no vegetable tray because they trade out flurry and with it the ability to actually maybe hit things.
May I Introduce The Talented Monk
It solves both this AND the bonus feat issue. Trade out only the abilities you want to for the things you want from more then one monk archetype, and see a vastly expanded bonus feat list.
Man, until level 17, that's all of a +2 bonus to hit, but you make it sound like a +10. Monks already get higher base damage on their unarmed strikes, so you can invest in a higher + on your AoMF rather than going for damage enhancements like Flaming.There are special exceptions as thenobledrake notes, but for the most part, sadly, access to additional bonus feats has been done by archetypes instead of classification. So anyone playing a standard monk loses out.Anyone playing any monk loses out, standard or not. The archetypes with better bonus feat lists are all ranch and no vegetable tray because they trade out flurry and with it the ability to actually maybe hit things.
Actually statistically +x will yeild a higher average damage then the +1d6 energy enhancements on a weapon. So the +x is already the better option for anyone enhancing a weapon, the scaling damage of unarmed strikes doesnt really dictate what kind of enhancement a monk should take.
Either the APG or Ultimate Combat specifically listed three new feats as bonus feats monks can take. They are Ki Diversity (any level), Ki Throw (level 10), and Improved Ki Throw (level 14). No other additions or errata, as far as I know. Something to remember is that monks don't have to meet ANY of the prereqs for those feats listed. Everything introduced at levels 6 and 10 are also at least nice to have, if not downright great. So, they're not necessarily missing out on THAT much with this class feature.
I have to ask, what is this obsession with the AoMF?
Take a good look at brass knuckles. You still get your increased unarmed strike damage and flurry, but it is a regular weapon so its way cheaper.
Brass knuckles: "These close combat weapons are designed to fit comfortably around the knuckles, narrowing the contact area and therefore magnifying the amount of force delivered by a punch. They allow you to deal lethal damage with unarmed attacks. You may hold, but not wield, a weapon or other object in a hand wearing brass knuckles. You may cast a spell with a somatic component while wearing brass knuckles if you make a concentration check (DC 10 + the level of the spell you're casting). Monks are proficient with brass knuckles and can use their monk unarmed damage when fighting with them.
I have to ask, what is this obsession with the AoMF?
Take a good look at brass knuckles. You still get your increased unarmed strike damage and flurry, but it is a regular weapon so its way cheaper.
Brass knuckles: "These close combat weapons are designed to fit comfortably around the knuckles, narrowing the contact area and therefore magnifying the amount of force delivered by a punch. They allow you to deal lethal damage with unarmed attacks. You may hold, but not wield, a weapon or other object in a hand wearing brass knuckles. You may cast a spell with a somatic component while wearing brass knuckles if you make a concentration check (DC 10 + the level of the spell you're casting). Monks are proficient with brass knuckles and can use their monk unarmed damage when fighting with them.
Check the errata, they removed that feature from brass knuckles. Monks dont get unarmed damage with them.
I think the OP's question has been sufficiently answered. Unless anyone can find any additional feats that allow themselves to be taken as monk bonus feats.
I have to ask, what is this obsession with the AoMF?
Take a good look at brass knuckles. You still get your increased unarmed strike damage and flurry, but it is a regular weapon so its way cheaper.
Paizo decided to rule differently. So, you can no longer wear enhanced brass knuckles and also get increased unarmed damage.
Check the errata, they removed that feature from brass knuckles. Monks dont get unarmed damage with them.I have to ask, what is this obsession with the AoMF?
Take a good look at brass knuckles. You still get your increased unarmed strike damage and flurry, but it is a regular weapon so its way cheaper.
Brass knuckles: "These close combat weapons are designed to fit comfortably around the knuckles, narrowing the contact area and therefore magnifying the amount of force delivered by a punch. They allow you to deal lethal damage with unarmed attacks. You may hold, but not wield, a weapon or other object in a hand wearing brass knuckles. You may cast a spell with a somatic component while wearing brass knuckles if you make a concentration check (DC 10 + the level of the spell you're casting). Monks are proficient with brass knuckles and can use their monk unarmed damage when fighting with them.
Really? Lordy do they hate monks or what?
Really? Lordy do they hate monks or what?Check the errata, they removed that feature from brass knuckles. Monks dont get unarmed damage with them.I have to ask, what is this obsession with the AoMF?
Take a good look at brass knuckles. You still get your increased unarmed strike damage and flurry, but it is a regular weapon so its way cheaper.
Brass knuckles: "These close combat weapons are designed to fit comfortably around the knuckles, narrowing the contact area and therefore magnifying the amount of force delivered by a punch. They allow you to deal lethal damage with unarmed attacks. You may hold, but not wield, a weapon or other object in a hand wearing brass knuckles. You may cast a spell with a somatic component while wearing brass knuckles if you make a concentration check (DC 10 + the level of the spell you're casting). Monks are proficient with brass knuckles and can use their monk unarmed damage when fighting with them.
Sometimes I wonder. Luckily Owen Stephens apparently likes them :P, seriously check out the Talented monk, it solves like 90% of the monk's issues simply by making all of its options modular including things like making scaling damage an option for any combat style, and the ability to get full bab without requiring flurry of blows.
Sometimes I wonder. Luckily Owen Stephens apparently likes them :P, seriously check out the Talented monk, it solves like 90% of the monk's issues simply by making all of its options modular including things like making scaling damage an option for any combat style, and the ability to get full bab without requiring flurry of blows.Really? Lordy do they hate monks or what?Check the errata, they removed that feature from brass knuckles. Monks dont get unarmed damage with them.I have to ask, what is this obsession with the AoMF?
Take a good look at brass knuckles. You still get your increased unarmed strike damage and flurry, but it is a regular weapon so its way cheaper.
Brass knuckles: "These close combat weapons are designed to fit comfortably around the knuckles, narrowing the contact area and therefore magnifying the amount of force delivered by a punch. They allow you to deal lethal damage with unarmed attacks. You may hold, but not wield, a weapon or other object in a hand wearing brass knuckles. You may cast a spell with a somatic component while wearing brass knuckles if you make a concentration check (DC 10 + the level of the spell you're casting). Monks are proficient with brass knuckles and can use their monk unarmed damage when fighting with them.
Yes, yes. I've already bought the pdf and it's companion pdf. I even went for a cigarette after building a talented monk. So now can we all just use Talented Monk and stop it with the monk threads?
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Sure, there is a lot of helpful 3pp material, but it is often difficult to get this to be accepted for actual game use.
And frankly I understand why. The Agile and Guided weapon enchantments are unequivocallybroken. They are absurdly powerful for a minimal cost. Agile seems to be one of the go-to answers to making a good monk but I would never allow it.
Sure, there is a lot of helpful 3pp material, but it is often difficult to get this to be accepted for actual game use.
And frankly I understand why. The Agile and Guided weapon enchantments are unequivocallybroken. They are absurdly powerful for a minimal cost. Agile seems to be one of the go-to answers to making a good monk but I would never allow it.
Agile isnt 3rd party. Its in a paizo product...
Neither Agile nor Guided are 3PP, though ;)
[Edit: Agile is from "Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Pathfinder Society Field Guide", while Guided is from "Pathfinder Adventure Path #10: A History of Ashes". The latter was written for 3.5, however.]
They aren't core either :)
But yes, clearly Paizo hates the monk. Clearly.
Either way 3pp or from an AP , anything outside of the core books is GM discretion at best
The devs have spoken about this material, saying efdectively that they don't worry about balance for these PrCs or feats or items because they are not part of the base ruleset and will always be optional. This is also why there is never any FAQ material or specific feedback on it.
Furys fall has been debated for a long time and the devs will stay silent because it isn't core material.
I would be quite surprised if a developer has actually said that they "don't worry about balance" for rules options outside the core game. They may not produce FAQs or errata for those products, but that's not the same thing as not worrying about balance.
Oh, for sure Are.
But they have said that the non-Core lines are sometimes used for "Experimental" rules, and neither of those two weapon properties have made it over to the Core line, despite other things in PFS FG being moved over (in Agile's case).
Guided was never even made into a Pathfinder ability. It was for 3.5.
I don't know if this counts but, the players companion Faiths & Philosophies added 9 mediation style feats that the monk can use his bonus feats on.Do you have a link/source on these? I cannot find them anywhere.
Archives of Nethys. (d20pfsrd hasn't gotten around to this supplement yet.)
I think the OP's question has been sufficiently answered. Unless anyone can find any additional feats that allow themselves to be taken as monk bonus feats.There was a thread recently arguing that a couple of specific Kitsune feats have extra language saying "Special: You can take this any time you could take a feat", which makes no sense at all unless you assume that the intent is to specify that they can be substituted for class bonus feats (such as wizards, fighters, and monks get). In which case I guess those exist.
See my response here. Short version: None of those feats actually have that "Special" line.
Either the APG or Ultimate Combat specifically listed three new feats as bonus feats monks can take. They are Ki Diversity (any level), Ki Throw (level 10), and Improved Ki Throw (level 14). No other additions or errata, as far as I know. Something to remember is that monks don't have to meet ANY of the prereqs for those feats listed. Everything introduced at levels 6 and 10 are also at least nice to have, if not downright great. So, they're not necessarily missing out on THAT much with this class feature.
It would have been nice if the monk was able to take style feats in place of bonus feats, and it would mean the monk actually gained more from Styles than any other class, a situation they do not currently enjoy. No, scratch that: the dip-friendly Master of Many Styles means that other classes can gain MORE from Styles than the monk can, except the MoMS which is actually a sucky archetype if not used to just dip a few levels for the styles.
I believe I can say with some surety that that was a really stupid thing to do when their version of a magic weapon for monks is like one quarter as good as just having a magic weapon if not worse than that.
The logic goes something like this:
The Amulet of Mighty Fists is a monk-intended item, therefore it's the go-to item for monks to use. Therefore no other item should supplant it and provide better for the monk than this.
The AOMF is also very powerful when used by druids, animal companions, and monsters. Therefore we shall not raise the cap on it to match a normal magic weapon.
Result: monks are nerfed for their main attack-form, in a combat class that can only do melee unless you take a specific archetype.
My fix is to give the monk a magic fang-style enhancement to hit and damage scaling from 4th to 16th level, so the AoMF can be used for properties only.
Either the APG or Ultimate Combat specifically listed three new feats as bonus feats monks can take. They are Ki Diversity (any level), Ki Throw (level 10), and Improved Ki Throw (level 14). No other additions or errata, as far as I know. Something to remember is that monks don't have to meet ANY of the prereqs for those feats listed. Everything introduced at levels 6 and 10 are also at least nice to have, if not downright great. So, they're not necessarily missing out on THAT much with this class feature.
Also, Binding Throw (Ultimate Combat) at 14th.
Well nine of those feats are not yet in the SRD, but it's nice to know they could be coming soon.
As a GM, I find that it is totally reasonable to institute the following:
Bonus Feat: At 1st level, 2nd level, and every 4 levels thereafter, a monk may select a bonus feat. These feats must be taken from the following list:
Catch Off-Guard, Combat Reflexes, Deflect Arrows, Dodge, Improved Grapple, Scorpion Style, and Throw Anything.
At 6th level, the following feats are added to the list:
Gorgon's Fist, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Disarm, Improved Feint, Improved Trip, and Mobility.
At 10th level, the following feats are added to the list:
Improved Critical, Medusa's Wrath, Snatch Arrows, and Spring Attack.
A monk need not have any of the prerequisites normally required for these feats to select them.
A Monk can also take any select any feat that lists Improved Unarmed Strike as a prerequisite as a bonus feat, but they must meet all prerequisites for such a feat in order to take it.
No, they don't.
I have to ask, what is this obsession with the AoMF?
Take a good look at brass knuckles. You still get your increased unarmed strike damage and flurry, but it is a regular weapon so its way cheaper.
Brass knuckles: "These close combat weapons are designed to fit comfortably around the knuckles, narrowing the contact area and therefore magnifying the amount of force delivered by a punch. They allow you to deal lethal damage with unarmed attacks. You may hold, but not wield, a weapon or other object in a hand wearing brass knuckles. You may cast a spell with a somatic component while wearing brass knuckles if you make a concentration check (DC 10 + the level of the spell you're casting). Monks are proficient with brass knuckles and can use their monk unarmed damage when fighting with them.
Because, due to various trials and tribulations in the rules forum and FAQs, brassknuckles do not gain the benefit of unarmed only feats. For example, they can't be used for pummeling style.
Admittedly, pummeling style makes AoMF kind of redundant since it tears through DR, and you could honestly just go with a nice greater magic fang or weapon spell for most purposes.
Overall- they like monks, but they have problems with where they want to set their limits. Like a kid dipping his toe into the pool water for 10 minutes straight to see if it is alright.
Anyway, I heard someone say that the archetypes that get good bonus feats don't have flurry. But I have an observation- the sohei arhcetype uses the term 'may' when it goes on about mounted feats, and it does not appear to explicitly say that this option trades out the normal bonus feat options. So does that mean that mean you can pick the normal options? If so, then it is a great unarmed archetype, since the weapon training and armor also lets you grab gloves of dueling and brawling armor for two seperate +2's to unarmed attack and damage (a total of +7 that normal monks never see).
With pummeling style there to ensure that you almost never have to do a standard action act....well, sohei seems to edge out on brawler for pure DPS from what I can see.
Oh, and a lovely feat that monks can grab via bonus feats that works fantastically with pummeling style- Horn of the Criosphinx . x2 strength bonus is a nice little boost, no?