what's the 'rogue oracle'?

[ohako]

I'm somewhat convinced that you can sub out any of the basic classes (fighter, wizard, cleric, rogue) for an oracle. I mean, it's not a perfect match, obviously, but it gets pretty close

1. fighter: say, a dwarf oracle of metal. heavy armor proficiency, boosted fort saves, martial weapons, craft skills, etc. You know, the spell silverbeard?
2. wizard: how about an elf oracle of the heavens? no armor, flashy AoE save or be screwed spell, knowledge (arcane) skill, and you can stick stars and moons on your hat. Use the deaf curse and only use the dream special ability from dreamspeaker elf for extra weirdness. That's practically a wizard right there.
3. cleric: oracle of life, any race, done deal. throw in the blackened curse for the whole Ragathiel-ish 'heal you or burn you' vibe.
4. rogue: hmmm....I don't know. I think the only mysteries that offer Stealth as a class skill are Bones and Dark Tapestry. I kinda wish there was a 'red mantis' mystery, that would be kinda neat. Any thoughts?

[Tirq]

I'd like to see something like that, but I do believe that to preform as a "Rogue" you need 3 basic things.

1. Sneaking
2. Disabling traps
3. Social interactions.

Oracle can solve these easily with Dark Tapestry mystery, except for the obvious Disabling of Traps.. but there's always traits for that. High charisma makes social interactions easy, too.

Just to add some wood to the fire, I think the exact same thing about Fighters. They're so versatile that not even a little system mastery can make them whatever you want them to be.

[Sebastian]

There's an archetype in one of the Pathfinder focused books called the Seeker, which gives the Oracle Trapfinding, makes Disable Device and Perception class skills, and grants a bonus to those checks. Unfortunately, it doesn't do anything for Stealth.

[ohako]

Oh, I like that Seeker archetype. I always forget that Oracles get archetypes, because mysteries sorta take their place.

Okay, here we go

Race: Halfling (quintessential rogue race, duh)
Mystery: ???
Archetype: Seeker
Trait: Fast-Talker (makes Bluff a class skill)
Trait: Highlander (makes Stealth a class skill)

Skills: Bluff, maybe Diplomacy, Disable Device, Perception, Stealth

(I think I'm going to skip paragon surge, because I'm working on a 'rogue' oracle, not a 'cheese' oracle)

What's a good mystery for a small-sized Seeker Oracle?

[Titania, the Summer Queen]

Lore..

You can get cha for reflex and AC

Plus. I think you can get it sometimes fir dex based skills With some finagling

[BigNorseWolf]

you can just snag a trait for the stealth.

[Sebastian]

I went with Time for my rogue-like Oracle. My curse was from another supplement and results in all held items gaining the broken condition (which really, really sucks), but let's me disable mechanical traps as a standard action. It was originally flavored as devils breaking my stuff, but I reflavored it to represent the weight of time and the ages that the character carries due to the mystery.

Keep in mind though that, although Seeker gives you trapfinding, it takes away the other bonus skills from your Mystery, which leaves you with a pretty small set of class skills. I ended up taking the feat Cosmopolitan to get a few more.

[Reynard_the_fox]

The Deafened curse gives you free Silent Spell on every spell you cast, making you THE best stealth caster. Sadly, the oracle spell list doesn't have a ton of gems for that type of gameplay. But go Dark Tapestry, with its myriad infiltration and mind-reading abilities, and you'll be basically a rogue that trades sneak attack and max skill ranks for FULL spellcasting (all of it silenced) and varied supernatural/magic stuff. You can get flight, good armor that grants stealth bonuses, alter self/beast shape for minutes/day, and more.

[ohako]

Hmm,

Race: Halfling
Mystery: Dark Tapestry
Curse: Deaf
Archetype: Seeker
Trait: Highlander (for Stealth class skill)
Trait: Seeker (for Perception class skill)

This is an excellent stealth caster. With trapfinding. Very nice. Can't really do social skills, but it's still a very nice 'rogue oracle'. Thanks for the help, folks.

I'll post a build for a 'fighter oracle', 'wizard oracle', 'cleric oracle', and 'rogue oracle' over in the little used 'cool team builds' thread, once I get around to it.

[Zark]

ohako wrote:

Hmm,

Race: Halfling
Mystery: Dark Tapestry
Curse: Deaf
Archetype: Seeker
Trait: Highlander (for Stealth class skill)
Trait: Seeker (for Perception class skill)

This is an excellent stealth caster. With trapfinding. Very nice. Can't really do social skills, but it's still a very nice 'rogue oracle'. Thanks for the help, folks.

I'll post a build for a 'fighter oracle', 'wizard oracle', 'cleric oracle', and 'rogue oracle' over in the little used 'cool team builds' thread, once I get around to it.

I would swap the Deaf curse for Blackened curse. Fits better with the stealth/caster concept. Also a Deaf "rogue" just doesn't feel right.

[Cheapy]

Nature Oracle could make a good "rogue oracle".

Summon Nature's Ally is a fine trapfinding and disabling tool.

[Corlindale]

Wind is also a pretty amazing mystery for "rogue" oracles. Lots of powers that deal with infiltration and escape, and a useful list of bonus skills.

Noteable revelations:

Invisibility: For obvious reasons. The ability to divide up the duration is both good and bad - used wisely it amounts to more uses per day, but for extended use you can quickly end up burning through it all. Being SU gives it some good advantages compared to the spell since it a) doesn't provoke (useful for making an escape from melee range of something big and scary) and b) doesn't have verbal components, making it extra useful for the stealthy type.

Wings of Air: It's flight! It's incredibly fast and with good maneuverability! It's a swift action to activate! It's a supernatural ability!

Gaseous Form: The ultimate in infiltration and escape abilities. When you don't have the time or the ability to pick a lock, the ability to simply whoosh through the keyhole is invaluable. You can even bring your party along, giving this power a solid advantage when compared to the spell. It's been useful countless times in our Skulls and Shackles campaign (lots of breaking and entering)

Wind Sight: Clairvoyance with both sight and sound. Great for scouting your burglary sites before entering. Much faster to use than the spell, and the ability to divide up the rounds means a lot of uses per day if you time it carefully.

Air Barrier: A bit lackluster at early levels, but for a skillful character it can be nice for avoiding those pesky armor check penalties. Also becomes AMAZING at level 13.

The only real downside to Wind is that the spell list is rather lackluster. Most of the spells do the same thing in slightly different ways, though the power to lock down ranged attackers completely with control winds can certainly come in handy.

[XMorsX]

ohako wrote:

I'll post a build for a 'fighter oracle', 'wizard oracle', 'cleric oracle', and 'rogue oracle' over in the little used 'cool team builds' thread, once I get around to it.

What is this thread? I am not aware of this.

[ohako]

XMorsX wrote:

What is this thread? I am not aware of this.

That would be here

[Reynard_the_fox]

Zark wrote:

I would swap the Deaf curse for Blackened curse. Fits better with the stealth/caster concept. Also a Deaf "rogue" just doesn't feel right.

Blackened is viable and gives you some good offensive spells, but you can overcome deafness. First, you can put a rank into linguistics to be able to read lips for any other language you know; and second, you can take Eldritch Heritage to get a familiar to help you out. In my build I went for a monkey, so whatever it heard it could communicate to you via sign language.

Also, you can cast Silence with NO downsides! :D

[ohako]

Hah! I was worried that sign language didn't exist in Pathfinder. Shows what I know!

Sign language is a thing both for drow and flail snails. DSL is a totally valid target for a rank of Linguistics.

a) be a deaf oracle
b) take two ranks of linguistics (Drow Sign Language, Common)
c) take Skill Focus (Knowledge (arcana)) and Eldritch Heritage (arcane), and pick up a monkey familiar
d) The monkey has your skill ranks and hands. The monkey knows sign language and can understand verbal Common speech!

This is totally rude. I like it.

It's not a cure-all for the curse, because you still have to look at your monkey (or with a mirror) to know what your friends are saying, and the monkey can only translate one speaker at a time, and it's not instantaneous, etc. But still. That's a gold star right there.

[XMorsX]

ohako wrote:

XMorsX wrote:

What is this thread? I am not aware of this.

That would be here

Nice!

[Reynard_the_fox]

ohako wrote:

Hah! I was worried that sign language didn't exist in Pathfinder. Shows what I know!

Sign language is a thing both for drow and flail snails. DSL is a totally valid target for a rank of Linguistics.

a) be a deaf oracle
b) take two ranks of linguistics (Drow Sign Language, Common)
c) take Skill Focus (Knowledge (arcana)) and Eldritch Heritage (arcane), and pick up a monkey familiar
d) The monkey has your skill ranks and hands. The monkey knows sign language and can understand verbal Common speech!

This is totally rude. I like it.

It's not a cure-all for the curse, because you still have to look at your monkey (or with a mirror) to know what your friends are saying, and the monkey can only translate one speaker at a time, and it's not instantaneous, etc. But still. That's a gold star right there.

Thanks! Here's the full build.

The Dark Scout:

Halfling Oracle of the Dark Tapestry
Curse: Deafened
Seeker archetype? http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/oracle/archetypes/paizo---orac le-archetypes/seeker
(lose class skills, 3rd & 15th level revelations; gain magical trapfinding and improved revelation spells)

Str 6
Dex 16
Con 12
Int 14
Wis 10
Cha 18

Weapons:
Light Crossbow
Dagger

Traits:
Fast Talker (+1 bluff, class skill)
Slippery (+1 stealth, class skill)
(alt: helpful, reactionary)

Skills (7/level (including FCB)):
Key: Stealth, Perception, Disable Device, Bluff, Diplomacy, Know: Religion
Secondary: knowledges, sense motive, spellcraft, disguise, linguistics, acrobatics

Revelations:
1 Many Forms
5 (from feat) Cloak of Darkness
7 Wings of Darkness
11 Pierce the Veil

Feats:
1 Skill Focus: Knowledge (Religion)
3 Eldritch Heritage - Arcane (familiar - Monkey) (name: Motie)
5 Extra Revelation
7 Improved Familiar? (maybe 9th depending on ruling)
9 Persistent Spell
11 Improved Eldritch Heritage

Spells:
1 Cause Fear (later replace with Prot. From Evil)
1 Bless
1 Obscuring Mist
2 Hold Person
2 Spiritual Weapon
2 Lesser Restoration
3 Chain of Perdition
3 Dispel Magic
3 SMIII
3 Magic Vestments
4 Freedom of Movement
4 Blessings of Fervor

At higher levels, using Pierce the Veil with Deeper Darkness and Silence is really quite a mean thing to do.

[blackbloodtroll]

Let's not forget the Wrecker Curse.

[Icyshadow]

So now the Oracle is a jack of all trades? Interesting.

[blackbloodtroll]

Well, Half-Elf, or PC with the Racial Heritage(Half-Elf) feat, has Paragon Surge available.
Sort of puts the candle on the cake.

[Mir]

instead of using sign language you can take the two-world trait and put message on your class list for 0 level spells.