I have a level 1 PFS ranger and I've decided to try out the weapon & shield style. I am aware its not the 'optimal' ranger, but I am wondering what the better choices are as he levels. A good combo seems to be a Quickdraw Bashing Shield to use with Imp. Shield Slam and Shield Master. Advice is most welcome.
Half-elf ranger (Freebooter Archetype)
Str 17
Dex 14
con 14
Int 10
Wis 13
Cha 10
Feats
L1 (racial) Exotic Weapon Prof: Falcata
L1 Dodge
L2 (ranger) Two weapon fighting
L3 Improved Shield Bash
L4
L5
L6 Shield Master
L7-11 ??
Make sure the shield is spiked, that is an easy bit of extra damage. TBH I am not sold on the falcata - rangers and other skillful characters can do perfectly will with skill focus, i.e. in perception - with the racial bonus you will probably have an insane roll - or the extra bonus to will saves.
How are you feeling about generic useful feats such as toughness, iron will, etc, and what other characters are there in the party?
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I've been working on a Sword and Board Ranger idea for a while now, and I'll try to offer some advice.
I also went with a Half-Elf, but I decided to take Dual Minded instead of Ancestral Arms. Going Ranger means your Will saves will be weak, and Dual Minded helps with that. Throw in the ability to take Iron Will as well, and thats +4 to Will saves (plus an additional +2 vs Enchantment - which includes Charms and Compulsions, two nasty Will save conditions). I also threw in the Indomitable Faith character trait for an extra +1. If you decide to do this, wielding a scimitar is not a bad choice.
I also went with the Two-Weapon Combat route, and decided to wait until 11 to take Shield Master. But, it seems you're set on going with Weapon and Shield style, so I'm not going to press the matter. :)
I decided to also take Quick Draw as my first level feat, and use a Spiked Quickdraw Shield as my off-hand weapon. The idea being that I can switch to using a Longbow when needed, because occasionally you'll need to think about ranged attacks in PFS. Also, if you ever need to move, you can then use a free action to put away your Quickdraw Shield, move up to an enemy and attack with your weapon two-handed for extra damage. Another good reason to also try to grab Power Attack, so that when you have to two-hand your weapon, you can also Power Attack. And then, after your attack, you can grab and strap on your Quickdraw Shield again. (Power Attack would be a good feat to grab at 5th level).
If you're going to go Weapon and Shield, you will want to get a STR and DEX belt, so you can grab the later Two-Weapon Fighting feats (Improved and Greater), but that might be a hard thing to do, depending on your fame.
Also, you might want to consider lowering your CHA a little to free up some points for your other ability scores, unless there's a reason you need a 10 CHA. If you really don't feel like min-maxing, you can still drop it to an 8 and not be too much worse for the choice. (If you decide to do this, you can bump your WIS to 14, giving you an extra +1 to WIS-based skill checks, and more importantly, an extra +1 to Will saves).
So, for feat breakdown, here's what I would suggest:
Alternate Half-Elf Racial Trait: Dual Minded. (Use a scimitar as your main weapon)
1) Quick Draw (or Improved Shield Bash)
2) Two-Weapon Fighting (Ranger Bonus Feat)
3) Improved Shield Bash (or Quick Draw if you took Improved Shield Bash at level 1)
5) Power Attack
6) Shield Master (Ranger Bonus Feat)
7) Iron Will
9) Improved Two-Weapon Fighting (if you can get the DEX high enough)
10) Bashing Finish (Ranger Bonus Feat)
11) Greater Two-Weapon Fighting (if you can get the DEX high enough)
Hopefully that has been helpful.
Nothing is set in stone yet, as he is level 1. I was wondering about the possibilities of taking advantage of Shield Mastery (a feat with a +11 bab requirement) at level 6. Assuming its a worthwhile feat, that is.
I know Shield Slam adds a bull rush attempt and is a pre-requisite for Shield Mastery, but he does not need to have it. Improved Bull Rush does sound nice, though.
I'm also searching threads with similar questions and it seems like shield spikes and bashing do not mix?
my suggestion is using an heavy shield as a main weapon and a shortsword/any other light weapon as offhand for maximum AC. I don't know if quickdraw is worth it, you can have your shield p always and draw your weapon normally. I also don't think shield slam is worth without the bull rush feats, that you really can't afford.
Ok, so Shield Slam/Imp Bull Rush is two feats that could be better used elsewhere.
I've been working on a Sword and Board Ranger idea for a while now, and I'll try to offer some advice...
That looks very much like something I'd try. The 10 CHA has to do more with me not liking the -1 on skill rolls (my own personal quirk).
Assuming I don't get a belt to meet the feat requirements of ITWF and GTWF, what alternate feats would you suggest?
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That looks very much like something I'd try. The 10 CHA has to do more with me not liking the -1 on skill rolls (my own personal quirk).
Assuming I don't get a belt to meet the feat requirements of ITWF and GTWF, what alternate feats would you suggest?
That's a tough one. Perhaps Armor Proficiency (Heavy) at 9th so you can wear Mithral Full Plate? Not sure what else to take at 11th. I guess by that point you can take pretty much whatever you want; it'll only matter for 3 more scenarios before you retire.
EDIT: You could also just take Shield Slam. After re-reading the feat, I'm pretty sure that Improved Bull Rush/Greater Bull Rush does little with Shield Slam. Mainly because it says you compare the attack roll to the CMD to see if you Bull Rush it. So you don't get the bonus on this Bull Rush because you're not making a CMB check. All that IBR/GBR would do is grant the AoO.
Maybe I can take slow advancement at level 10. :o)
On using the falcata: would it be better to slot Imp. Critical or get the Keen enchantment? if not Keen, would burst be a good choice?
I dont think there a lot more to figure out.
Is there a reason you didn't go Fighter with this routine?
As mentioned, I was wondering how to best take advantage of ranger's Weapon and Shield combat style feats, particularly Shield Mastery - a feat normally taken at level 11. You can choose that feat at level 6 without meeting the requirements.
Thanks again for the input
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Strictly speaking, a "board and board" ranger is better because of shield mastery; enchanted shields are way cheaper than enchanted weapons, and both shields take advantage of being able to bull rush and such.
I'd take the Greater Bull Rush line to make your bull rush high, as well as Boon Companion to make an ally to flank with and trip opponents (you bull rush them past the wolf, who gets an AOO and knocks them over).
1) Two-weapon fighting style
2) Improved Shield Bash
3) Improved Bull Rush
5) Boon Companion
6) Shield Mastery
7) Improved Two-weapon fighting style
9) Greater Bull Rush
11) Grater Two-Weapon Fighting style
I'd take the Greater Bull Rush line to make your bull rush high, as well as Boon Companion...
Just realized that Freebooters don't get animal companions, ah well -_-
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Strictly speaking, a "board and board" ranger is better because of shield mastery; enchanted shields are way cheaper than enchanted weapons, and both shields take advantage of being able to bull rush and such.
I'd take the Greater Bull Rush line to make your bull rush high, as well as Boon Companion to make an ally to flank with and trip opponents (you bull rush them past the wolf, who gets an AOO and knocks them over).
1) Two-weapon fighting style
2) Improved Shield Bash
3) Improved Bull Rush
5) Boon Companion
6) Shield Mastery
7) Improved Two-weapon fighting style
9) Greater Bull Rush
11) Grater Two-Weapon Fighting style
I'm thinking of doing something similar: Klar & Klar. Except I'll probably take TWF as a bonus feat to skip the DEX requirement.
Considering a ranger can get Shield Master without the prerequisites, do you even need TWF at level 6?
Benefit: Your penalties on attack rolls for fighting with two weapons are reduced. The penalty for your primary hand lessens by 2 and the one for your off hand lessens by 6. See Two-Weapon Fighting.
Normal: If you wield a second weapon in your off hand, you can get one extra attack per round with that weapon. When fighting in this way you suffer a –6 penalty with your regular attack or attacks with your primary hand and a –10 penalty to the attack with your off hand. If your off-hand weapon is light, the penalties are reduced by 2 each. An unarmed strike is always considered light.
Benefit: You do not suffer any penalties on attack rolls made with a shield while you are wielding another weapon. Add your shield's enhancement bonus to attack and damage rolls made with the shield as if it were a weapon enhancement bonus.
Going on a limb here: at level 6 I can make an off-hand attack with a medium shield with no penalties and no TWF - Is that right?
you'll still take the impressive penalties on your attack with your main weapon.
But otherwise, yes.
==Aelryinth
Ah, of course! I though I was missing something.