|
So my girlfriend wants to make a luchador themed character, she is dead set on a gnome and wants a chimpanzee as her tag-team partner. I was telling her Druid because they get the animal companion early on and dipping into Tetori Monk for all the grapple moves. But could she do Ranger and take Natural Weapon as a style feat and then dip into Tetori. Any advice on the character and such
If I remember correctly the mad dog barbarian from The animal archive can choose from the full list of animal companions. And barbarian fits very well with a luchadore concept. Maybe dip a couple level of monk and take boon companion to keep your chimp buddy up to par.
wow.... there's an excellent chance that this will be a disaster...
the gnome takes a racial strength penalty (which effects CMB and CMD) and takes a size penalty to CMB and CMD...
hmmm... if she's just trying to have fun (and won't mind being a joke/terrible wrestler, at least at low levels) the easiest way to try to do this would probably actually be a cleric with a 1 level tetori dip- take the animal domain for your animal companion (try to build it to handle most of the actual grappling, at least at low level) and the plant[growth] domain to un-small herself; boon companion will bring the companion up to full strength, put all your other feats into wrestling stuff and once you can stack Righteous Might and Divine Power you might make a decent wrestler... the only other alternative i can think of would be a Lore Warden (fighter)/Tetori (monk)- lore warden grants some bonuses straight to CMB/CMD and tons of bonus feats (plus full BAB), and you've already seen what tetori can do; take the agile maneuvers feat and really focus on getting your Dex as high as possible, also keep your Escape Artist as high as possible because your CMD will never be as good as a bigger stronger melee character. none of that addresses the monkey thing though (for this second build)- this build (which would be a more effective grappler) gives up on an animal companion... just keep your handle animal skill up and buy and train monkeys to wrestle with you.
good luck!
|
Luchador screams Unarmed Fighter/Barbarian to me. There are a couple styles that could work here - Earth Child Style was basically written for her (assuming you fight giants at all), and Monkey Style might fit the fighting style of one of those crazy "vertically-challenged" luchadores. Sadly they require Stunning Fist for the full chain... I suppose the Martial Artist monk archetype could substitute for unarmed fighter. I second the Mad Dog barbarian with Boon Companion, though that of course means she won't have room for all the feats she needs... hrm.
Make sure she understands that grappling and other combat maneuevers WILL be very difficult on anything bigger than she is. This can be partially overcome with potions of Enlarge Person or a friendly caster, but IMO it kind of defeats the point.
See if she can be a bit more specific about what she wants, and we can prescribe a specific build. What aspect of Lucha does she want to capture?
Druid would work great as long as she would be Okay taking full advantage of Wild-Shape.
At level 12, turn into a huge earth elemental (+8 Str, +4 Con, -2 Dex, +6 Natural Armor, Immune to crits, sneak attacks and bleed, DR 5/-)
Throw on all the grappling items:
Anaconda Coil Belt
Brawling Armor
AoMF+2
Gauntlets of the Skilled Maneuver(grapple)
Brawlers Armbands
Take Improved Greater and Rapid Grapple plus power attack.
Even if her starting strength is, say a 14 after race.
With everything I just listed she will have +1 at 4th, +1 at 8th, +2 for the belt, +8 for shaping.
So Strength while shaped will be 26.
Grapple CMB will be +29 (+9 bab, +8 str, +2 armor, +2 gloves, +1 bracers, +2 belt, +2 size, +4 feats)
This will go down to +26 with power attack, but she can always buff with lockjaw to get grab and another +4. The Powerful shape feat will add another +2 to CMB and CMD also. There is also pinning rend which can toss on 2d8 bleed damage if she chooses to pin.
At that point, ignoring anything unlisted for the moment, a full round grapple will be this:
Grapple to initiate (move action) +26, Constrict for 1d6+8
Grapple to damage (move action) +26, Slam 2d8+16 Constrict for 1d6+8
Grapple to damage (swift action) +26, Slam 2d8+16 Constrict for 1d6+8
So an average full round of 75.5
Some monsters can be hard to grapple because of magical effects, so it may be better to get an AoMF with Anchoring and Ghost Touch if and when you can.
By the way, she should look at the ki throw line. It works well for wrestlers and grapplers. Pinning throw is invaluable if you want to suplex and pin a guy.
can someone describe the video? Cant view it from where I am.
|
|
Sorry, it is a lot of high flying Ray Maysterio and other matches. Luchadors are traditionally more agile and perform more aerial maneuvers than professional wrestlers in the U.S. who more often rely on power and hard strikes to subdue their opponents. Luchadores execute characteristic high flying attacks by using the wrestling ring's ropes to catapult themselves towards their opponents, using intricate combinations in rapid-fire succession, and applying complex submission holds. Does all that help...trust me Im about to kill her character as soon as the campaign starts with all the frustration she is giving me
it sounds to me like she wants more of a standard monk, making use of acrobatics and flurry of blows... or maybe even some kind of monk/ninja multiclass with a lot of attention to acrobatics. there's a feat called 'death from above' that is intended for charging from higher ground or from above while flying- you could pretty easily set a jump DC to gain that benefit (possibly one that depends on the enemy's size category); there's also acrobatics feats like disorienting maneuver and cartwheel dodge that play to what she wants.
but really you could just have her play a monk and make most of that fluff... she says 'ok, i jump and kick off the wall next to me to get high enough and then punch the ogre in the nose' and you say "roll to hit" - she rolls and hits, you say "alright, you jump up and crack him square in his face" then (since mechanically all she did was make a normal attack) you follow up with "do you want to move anywhere?" that way she gets all the fluff she's looking for and you don't have to worry about any of the headaches :)
as for some kind of monkey... there is a feat tree that would let her get one as an animal companion (Nature Soul+Animal Ally, from Faiths and Philosophies; and, Boon Companion, from Animal Archives; works out to have an animal companion equal to a druid of your level- there's no monkey on that list, technically, but you could easily find one of an appropriate power-level to let her take), or you could tell her she has to wait til 7th level then let her take leadership and get an awakened monkey for a cohort.
Actually looks a lot like a spring attack character with full ranks in acrobatics. I could definitely see, say, a barbarian with the pit fighter archetype working perfectly for this. Death from above is a necessity. Rage will boost a 13 str character to a 17 str character so it's not all that bad. And gnomes do get a bonus to constitution, which is a a good bonus. It's not all bad.
Beast Totem will give her claws. She can rule them as mighty fists. It's 1d4 so whatever. Or she could use a weapon. Really not that different from improved unarmed strike. A level in martial artist would give her flurry and a d4 unarmed strike attack as well, though it would be inferior to 2 claws for quite a few levels. Brawler works too if she doesn't want to multiclass.
Beast totem eventually gives pounce, and its AC boost works with the agile, lightly if at all armored unit. P. good.
Underfoot isn't too bad for this sort of thing, and if you let her ignore the goblin requirement, tanglefoot is very thematic.
If she wants to do Ray Mysterio, I would go more for a dex-based monk with High Jump, fast movement, and good Acrobatics and Escape Artist(maybe maneuver master or master of many styles). With this build, you'd want Agile Maneuvers.
Technically, grapple doesn't have a size limitation, so she can use the grapple checks against anybody. (She gets a size penalty to GMD, but there's not a limit to how big a character she can grapple.)
Some cool maneuver feats for small characters are Under and Over and Choke Hold. Also, the Snapping Turtle Style tree gives you a free grapple check when someone misses you.
If you are ok with 3rd party material the talented monk from super genius games would probably help alot. It breaks the monk and its archetypes into talents and 'edges' (more powerful talents) and allows you to pick between them. It would allow you to for instance mix the normal monk, with parts of the tetori monk, and maybe the flowing monk to get a mix that fits the idea. You can also leave out the excessively mystical aspects of the monk if they dont suit the concept while still being very good at unarmed and unarmored combat.
Also the monkey style feats from ultimate combat might be a good fit.
In terms of the monkey this is where it is a bit difficult. The problem is if she wants it to fight with her, it needs to scale, so just a dip isnt really going to be helpful. I would personally let her take an edge (from the talented monk) to get an animal companion monkey and be done with it. I dont think it would be overpowered given how precious edges are in the talented monk, and the fact the monkey is not the most powerful of the animal companions.
The Gnome really makes this kinda hard. If she really wants to be a midget, a halfling with a Dex build could work better and still be small. But El Santo the most legendary Luchador of em all was 5'10, 210lbs. Actually quite a big guy unless compared to most American wrestlers. Even Rey mysterio isn't really small.
The Luchador:
For some Build advices: Take a look at this feat: http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/disorienting-maneuver Acrobatics check to whirl yourself into an oponent for a bonus on CMB. Congratulations you now can do an Enziguri.
Possibilities:
Ordinary monk -- Do a Dex build dodge most attacks(maybe Snake style), buy an Agile Amulett of Mighty Fists(Dex to damage)put Dex into your your CMB via Agile Maneuvers. Maybe go for a trip build.
You could now start with a low strength and will be quite viable ind the end.
The Downside is, since you need to spend feats to get your Dex for Maneuvers, to learn maneuvers an dare dependend on a +1 Agile Amullett of Mighty Fists the first levels you will be painfully weak.
Barbarian/Monk -- Even as a gnome you can get some solid Str while raging. Can take the Mad Dog Barbarian archetype for an animal companion. You can take a few lvls in martial artist to be able to Rage cycle.
Tetori -- Awesome Grappler, but would be gimped by small size and low Str.
Brawler Figther -- More feats than the monk can do the Dex build above too. With full Bab more HP, and Weapon Training your Unarmed Maneuvers will be stronger. However you lose out on speed, which is kinda crucial for the luchador flavor. Maybe a Monk/Brawler multiclass would be the way to go.
Order of the Cockatrice Cavalier -- Semms unfitting at first glance, but has got some fitting abilities. Dazzling Display, without a weapon, boni during his "Moment of triumph". Full Bab, d10 HD is also good. However you are Feat starved and lack Acrobatics as class skill. Maybe multiclassed this could work.
How TO GET THE CHIMP:
1. Take a pet class(Ranger, Druid, Mad Dog Barb and Cavalier are the possible ones). Migh need the Boon Companionb Feat to keep it's HD up.
2. Eldritch Heritage(Sylvan) should give you an animal companion. If this works legally is still debated, but if you are in a home game I'd allow it. You need three feats(Skill Focus, Eldritch Heritage, Boon Campanion) to get your buddy to full work and could just take...
3. ...Leadership instead. Take your Monkey as cohort would be the simpelest way here. Let some Druid Awaken him(http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/a/awaken) and you now got an intelligent chimp, that can take class levels himself to learn similar techniques as yourself.