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So Bestiary 4 has the Fungal Creature template. It is really cool. And it raises a lot of questions.
Breaking it down: Fungal creatures are plant creatures that look like fungal versions the original animal-based creatures they were made from. When a person is transformed into a fungal creature, they don't simply become that fungal creature. They actually die, their soul moving on to the afterlife while a new fungal soul moves in. This newborn fungal creature does not retain any of the original being's memories, but the mind and physiology are mapped and carried over. It also seems that aspects of the original creature's nature or personality carry over: The example fungal creature was originally a nymph. Her current alignment: CG.
Biological needs bits: To sustain themselves, they merely need to maintain regular contacct with moist earth. They are generally content to sit in quiet contemplation, but when faced with animal-based life, they get hit by powerful urges to spread their spores to reproduce, making new fungal creatures but also killing whowever was being remade into one. Nothing is said about whether this urge can be resisted or overcome.
So generally harmless when left alone, depending on the nature of the original creature.
It should be noted that not only can fungal creatures transform other beings into more of their kind, but the Inner Sea Bestiary's Fungal Queens can do so as well. Unlike the fungal creatures, these creatures(being born of infected succubi) are aggressively evil. The method of their transformation also seems like it may be a bit different. IIRC, it's implied that creatures transformed by Fungal Queens are not killed by the transformation process, and can actually be cured given the right magic. (edit-I may be remembering the bit on curing incorrectly. There may have been no mention of that at all in the Inner Sea Bestiary entry) Fungal Queens can also only dominate and control a limited number of fungal creatures at a time, with the overflow owing no allegience to their creator.
Now for the tricky stuff:
Let's say you had a party of adventurers. One of them was a really swell person. Then he got infected by a fungal creature. Now these adventurers are faced with a really swell fungal creature with the face of their friend. A new living, breathing person. Could they possibly bring themselves to kill this being to bring their friend back? And would it even work? Raising their friend from that corpse might very well bring the fungal version back. After all, that soul was the last one living there. So how does that work? How could a party find a way to bring their friend back? And could they find a way that lets both beings live?
And then there's the matter of the spore-spewing urges. How strong should that compulsion be? And how might it best be overcome? Especially relevant for groups that might be willing to continue on with the fungal version of their friend(while possibly trying to find a way to restore his soul and memories without killing the new guy)
What an experience that would be, travelling with a living ghost of your friend that doesn't even remember you even if they might instinctively trust you.
These folks stand in sharp contrast to the Bodythief and its Pod People(also in Bestiary 4), because an entire village filled with innocents infected and turned is still a village filled with innocents, as free-willed as they were before. They're just different innocents now. How might different societies adapt to such a presence?
It's really fun imagining a society involving fungal creatures, their possible Azruverda caretakers, svirfneblin, and Benorus cults. :)
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Well true resurrection or regular if you have piece of them should do the trick of bringing them back without killing the new guy.
As for your reproduction question. If its anything like the humanoid compulsion then that depends on whether you have prophylactics. If both of these cases are true then the average fungal creature will have thoughts about the compulsion every 7 on seconds on average and they'll do it as often as fungally possible, even if its a bad idea to do so.
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You know, with the methods of reproduction these templated monsters have frankly the world should be full of vampiric fungal werewolves.
Funguswolf. Ew.
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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The raise dead is an interesting question. I know that mind seed (psionic power) reformatted the mind/soul, so if your buddy was mind seeded and then you killed him raise dead would bring back reformatted guy.
I think unless the sample used was taken *before* he became a fungal creature, any revivification would bring back the funguy. ;-)
Now with the pod creature the original should be True resurrection normally (since there's nothing left) but I don't see the pod person dying when his creator is killed, and could lead to some interesting RP opportunities. Indeed, a magus/bard/inquisitor pod person might even be an interesting cohort option, since he's roughly going to be that two levels lower.
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The raise dead is an interesting question. I know that mind seed (psionic power) reformatted the mind/soul, so if your buddy was mind seeded and then you killed him raise dead would bring back reformatted guy.
I think unless the sample used was taken *before* he became a fungal creature, any revivification would bring back the funguy. ;-)
I wonder if there might be a possible workaround: If the fungal creature person donated a body part(like say a finger bone) and remained living, could that part be used to resurrect the original person since the fungal creature's soul wouldn't be in the queue? Or would the entirety of the fungal creature's body be "claimed" as the fungal soul's?
Thinking about that fingerbone some more, it might well be turned into some stiff fibrous structure rather than actual bone by the transformation process. Now I'm wondering if, in that case, the original soul would be brought back in a fungal body...
That pod person cohort scenario had me thinking of Seltyiel. That's almost too easy to imagine in his case. ;)
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I haven't gotten to the fungal creature template yet in my Bestiary 4 read. Does it reproduce by spores, and how much control does the fungal creature have over spore production? I could see letting a fungal creature formed from a dead compatriot live, but bringing them back to civilization could be extraordinarily dangerous, as you could quickly create a fungal epidemic.
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I haven't gotten to the fungal creature template yet in my Bestiary 4 read. Does it reproduce by spores, and how much control does the fungal creature have over spore production? I could see letting a fungal creature formed from a dead compatriot live, but bringing them back to civilization could be extraordinarily dangerous, as you could quickly create a fungal epidemic.
On reading it, I wonder if the fungal creature even really knows that reproduction via spores is wrong (because it kills the host). While fungal creatures with decent intelligence scores could be taught "No, making more fungal creatures by infecting beings with spores is bad," we don't know how much control over it they have. Is it like sex (takes conscious effort) or like breathing or sweating (mostly involuntary)?
Any sane society would most likely aggressively seek to destroy any fungal creatures they were aware of. Worry about resurrection after the threat is removed.
Lesse here...
The fungal creature create spawn ability specifically destroys the original body. So you're not getting the original person back without a wish, miracle, or a true res.
The urge to contaminate others to make more fungal critters is specifically described as "overwhelming." I'd handle it as a fungus critter confronted with viable hosts (which is anything that breathes, isn't immune to poison, and can suffer con damage - even other plant creatures are vulnerable!) going into a fugue state and attacking.
You actually have to die from the con damage to become a fungal creature, so a fungal creature that's trying to make more is limited to relying on the 1/day spore cloud, and then subduing possible hosts and forcefeeding them its own flesh and blood.
Now, you COULD have peaceful contact with a fungal creature with the right magical disguise - they can't inherently tell if you're not a fungus creature, so with sufficient disguise you can fake being fungal yourself and not set off the fugue state.
Or if you communicated at long range, you could probably have a decent conversation.
Otherwise, I'm not seeing a way for fleshies (or even treants) to safely interact with fungal creatures.
The nymph that's the sample creature might warn travellers to leave before they come too close. Or she might well come hunting the murderers who'd been fighting and putting the down the fungal squirrels, racoons, deer, and bears. And then be very considerate and helpful as the new converts adjust to their new fungal lives.
(Fictional) people in situations like this rarely act with any sort of reason (because in reality most people don't react reasonably in emotionally charged situations.)
"It's not a person, it's a freakin' infestation! Burn the fungus and get our old buddy back!"
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I haven't gotten to the fungal creature template yet in my Bestiary 4 read. Does it reproduce by spores, and how much control does the fungal creature have over spore production? I could see letting a fungal creature formed from a dead compatriot live, but bringing them back to civilization could be extraordinarily dangerous, as you could quickly create a fungal epidemic.On reading it, I wonder if the fungal creature even really knows that reproduction via spores is wrong (because it kills the host). While fungal creatures with decent intelligence scores could be taught "No, making more fungal creatures by infecting beings with spores is bad," we don't know how much control over it they have. Is it like sex (takes conscious effort) or like breathing or sweating (mostly involuntary)?
Yeah, it's left wide open just how overwhelming that urge actually is. Regarding the spore production, it seems to be as natural as breathing, as their gills are constantly spewing the stuff. Another controlling factor is that they seem content to stick to their natural environments. That could lead to a situation where a fungal population could be safely (and unfortunately) segregated, with only uninfected creatures with proper protection interacting with them(or fungal creatures that had managed to suppress their natural urges doing the same in the other direction).
Man, now I really want to see that symbiotic svirfneblin + azruverda-tended fungal creature society now...
I guess none of you folks who argue so passionately for the fungal creatures right to exist have either watched "Invasion of the Body Snatchers" or the even more chilling novel it was drawn from.
We're talking about free-willed Fungal Creatures here, not Pod People from the same Bestiary. ;)
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Consider also that it can only puff once a day. If it goes off and puffs somewhere away from everyone it should be good.
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Let's say you had a party of adventurers. One of them was a really swell person. Then he got infected by a fungal creature. Now these adventurers are faced with a really swell fungal creature with the face of their friend. A new living, breathing person. Could they possibly bring themselves to kill this being to bring their friend back? And would it even work? Raising their friend from that corpse might very well bring the fungal version back. After all, that soul was the last one living there. So how does that work? How could a party find a way to bring their friend back? And could they find a way that lets both beings live?Anyone who's watched Voyager, would know what answer Captain Janeway would make, if they remember the example of Tuvix.
Typically, I find "what would Captain Janeway do?" to be a strong argument for the exact opposite course of action.
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Consider also that it can only puff once a day.That just means they're all male. One good puff a day and they're done. :-)
This lends itself to an easy joke, but maybe there's something to it as a possible preventative measure for sociable fungal people. Signs asking that visitors announce their presence and such...
Fungal Person: Oh, hi! Hey, just stay up there for a moment, will you?
Adventure: Okay.
Fungal Person: And could you try to look....I don't know...meaty?
Adventurer: ....wait, what?
Fungal Person: Almost there, this is hard to do while you're watching you know!
Adventure: O_O
Fungal Person: OH GODS.
Adventurer: O_O
Fungal Person: Whew! Okay, safe for visits! What brings you to the neighborhood? Staying long? I'm afraid I'm feeling a bit sleepy now, but-
Adventurer: O_O
Actually, wondering what easily attainable magics coudl help. Or there might even be some mundane solutions, certain things fungal creatures can consume to neutralize their spores or dull the urge to release them.
Same theme really even if the mechanics are different. My respect for something's right to live and breed, stops short of anything...
Actually, it's really not the same at all. Don't forget that Fungal Creatures are only a threat if you seek them out and get up in their face. In a world where these beings are known to exist, peaceful coexistence is as easy as villagers knowing not to go to that certain valley or cave or the fungal creatures themselves taking measures to protect themselves and others through isolation(which again, they're generally content with). And that's before one even gets into all the possibilities that can come out of different approaches to peaceful coexistence.(Wait, svirfneblin/azruverda/fungal-creature society that reveres Benorus and Chucaro! :D)
edit-(bioluminescent fungal creatures!)
All that, and the fungal creatures are again, free willed beings possessed of the nature of the beings they were born from. That's a world of difference from the pod people made by Bodythieves.
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Frankly, the description suggests that they're a little too heavily driven by instinct to be considered truly free-willed...
/QUOTE]
Actually, it's really not the same at all. Don't forget that Fungal Creatures are only a threat if you seek them out and get up in their face. In a world where these beings are known to exist, peaceful coexistence is as easy as villagers knowing not to go to that certain valley or cave or the fungal creatures themselves taking measures to protect themselves and others through isolation(which again, they're generally content with). And that's before one even gets into all the possibilities that can come out of different approaches to peaceful coexistence.(Wait, svirfneblin/azruverda/fungal-creature society that reveres Benorus and Chucaro! :D)...
Well...part of the problem is that the fungal template doesn't make something "good" in alignment. All it takes is one evil individual, or even an apathetic one that just doesn't care, and suddenly you have an epidemic (For a real life example, see Typhoid Mary). Now in the Darklands I could certainly see a relatively peaceful society inhabiting one of the vaults, etc, but then the Darklands are full of so many worse creatures that they would be naturally quarantined. A civilization of such creatures on the surface would be bad news.
Dot for later.
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Well...part of the problem is that the fungal template doesn't make something "good" in alignment. All it takes is one evil individual, or even an apathetic one that just doesn't care, and suddenly you have an epidemic (For a real life example, see Typhoid Mary). Now in the Darklands I could certainly see a relatively peaceful society inhabiting one of the vaults, etc, but then the Darklands are full of so many worse creatures that they would be naturally quarantined. A civilization of such creatures on the surface would be bad news./QUOTE]
Actually, it's really not the same at all. Don't forget that Fungal Creatures are only a threat if you seek them out and get up in their face. In a world where these beings are known to exist, peaceful coexistence is as easy as villagers knowing not to go to that certain valley or cave or the fungal creatures themselves taking measures to protect themselves and others through isolation(which again, they're generally content with). And that's before one even gets into all the possibilities that can come out of different approaches to peaceful coexistence.(Wait, svirfneblin/azruverda/fungal-creature society that reveres Benorus and Chucaro! :D)...
They doesn't need to good to be a passive threat. Their general behavior pattern is to do nothing. They're fungus. Without a need to go looking for thing, food/shelter/mates/etc, there isn't really any reason for them to move.
You do have a point that once a fungal creature found it's way into a settlement though.
You know, I'm wondering about an isolated village/region forming a symbiotic relationship with fungal creatures. When an elder's body begins to fail, this could also apply to the fatally ill, mortally wounded, or just severely crippled, they take a final journey to the swamps near the valley's mouth, becoming one of the X(Suitable colloquial title), which guard the valley.
Winter is coming. He has seen many and know this will be his last. The harvest was poor this year, and there will be little food to spare. Lifting his pack, he looks at the child strapped to the frame. Never very strong, the blinding fever stole her sight and left her weak. Too weak to survive the long, cold nights of the Midnight Lord.
Slow shuffling steps. There is no need for haste. His parents will be waiting for him. They took the journey together, and are together still, often sitting on a fallen tree near the first of the big reed islands.
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It is easy to tell the start of spring. It is when Sunshine begins to race up and down the hills, and Grandfather always follows, dragging the warm breeze behind him.
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Winter is coming. He has seen many and know this will be his last. The harvest was poor this year, and there will be little food to spare. Lifting his pack, he looks at the child strapped to the frame. Never very strong, the blinding fever stole her sight and left her weak. Too weak to survive the long, cold nights of the Midnight Lord.
Slow shuffling steps. There is no need for haste. His parents will be waiting for him. They took the journey together, and are together still, often sitting on a fallen tree near the first of the big reed islands.
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It is easy to tell the start of spring. It is when Sunshine begins to race up and down the hills, and Grandfather always follows, dragging the warm breeze behind him.
Dude. ;_;
Have to use this now.
edit-I'm seriously misting up at this concept, no exaggeration.