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Dragoncatch Guisarme : "A dragoncatch guisarme can be used to make a special trip maneuver against creatures using wings to fly. If the maneuver succeeds, the target's wings are fouled and the creature is knocked off balance, falling to the ground and gaining the entangled condition."
My question: If I trip a winged flying opponents hovering in front of me 5 feet off the ground with a dragoncatch guisarme, is he prone and entangled, or upright and entangled? Asked differently, is the entangled condition bestowed instead of the prone condition of a regular trip, or in addition to it?
As I read it, it is entangled instead of being tripped, given that it is a special trip maneuver.
With a larger height than in your example, it is a moot point of course, since the become prone from the falling damage.
From the falling rules ...
Creatures that take lethal damage from a fall land in the prone position.
So if they fall from more than 10 feet (1d6 damage), they would be both prone and entangled, otherwise just entangled.
OK, so you guys think the opponent has fallen to the grpound, but is not prone.
Logical follow-up questions:
- Does this kind of trip produce an AoO if I have Greater Trip? I guess so: (Greater Trip: "Whenever you successfully trip an opponent, that
opponent provokes attacks of opportunity.")
- Since he has fallen to the ground, he shouldn't be flying any more. So can I use that AoO to trip him regularily now?
- If I do, does he provoke a new AoO from Greater Trip, provided I have Combat Reflexes?
OK, so you guys think the opponent has fallen to the grpound, but is not prone.
Logical follow-up questions:
- Does this kind of trip produce an AoO if I have Greater Trip? I guess so: (Greater Trip: "Whenever you successfully trip an opponent, that
opponent provokes attacks of opportunity.")- Since he has fallen to the ground, he shouldn't be flying any more. So can I use that AoO to trip him regularily now?
You get the AoO but it AoO occurs just before the Creature goes to the ground...hence you can not use it to wipe it prone afterwards :/
I agree with gourry187 concerning the falling height.
You get the AoO but it AoO occurs just before the Creature goes to the ground...hence you can not use it to wipe it prone afterwards :/
If that was true, then the Greater Trip AoO from a regular trip would happen before the enemy is prone, too, meaning I wouldn't get the +4 against a prone enemy... It is not my understanding that that is so.
In my understanding, I make the trip (whether normal or dragoncatch-guisarme), the trip concequences are applied, and then the Greater Trip AoO is done.