Some of the end-game bosses are going to be five Dragon Disciples (who are the cause of evil dragons returning) with a different chromatic dragon. So I thought it would be really cool to give the party five metallics to counter it, leading to an epic dragon battle of pure awesomeness!!
Since this will be my first time GMing, I don't really know how to balance stuff, but I know that simply giving the dragons to the party has major overpowering issues. However, I kind of want them to get attached to their dragons, and have them as companions afterwards, to face the other BBEGs with them.
I had an idea to acquire them which was Sarenrae gives a different Metallic to every race, for safekeeping until the five true heroes (the party) come to get them. They obviously have to earn their trust though haha.
The campaign will be Mythic, going all the way up to 20/10, so the characters will already be extremely strong...
So, what level do you think the characters should get their companions, what age should these companions be, and how much would you say the CR of encounters should increase by when the party has dragons?
Would make more sense for Apsu to be the party's benefactor. As for level/CR, I can't say. Each dragon varies by CR based upon their age categories. A copper dragon won't be as powerful as a gold, etc. etc.
You could always grant each party member the capstone ability of the Dragon Disciple class, allowing each of them to take the form of a different metallic (power ranger style--now that I think of it).
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Apsu, of course. I only say Sarenrae because she is the most important character in the background. The heroes are basically her champions, and she gives them gifts and pointers along the way. But Apsu fought in the battle against Rovagug (the true villain of the story) with her, so she could enlist his help.
That power ranger's idea is bloody awesome!!! If there's no way to balance, I'm using that in a heartbeat, thanks a lot man! :D
Give them a free leadership and use the
If the evil dragon disciples (without either side having dragons) would be a fair match for the party, then giving each side equal quality dragons on top of that should balance out.
I would suggest using THIS and This.I was just going to suggest using gestalt rules with the dragonrider class.
If the OP is concerned with having a managably balanced game and everyone riding dragons, this is probably the best route. Having things tied to class abilitiies, even if you go gestalt is the easiest way to manage this.
First and foremost because the dragons will only gain power as the players gain power (levels). So if they get them at say level 7, they will still be relavent for the big boss battle at level 17, but not ruin every rational encounter at level 7. The theme of the dragon rider is also a good one, with the bonded dragons giving up some of their own power, to bond with and aid the riders. The focus mechanics of the class also really help keep things in line. Sure you are riding a badass dragon, but if you want the best dragon (Red, or Gold) you will be giving up your own actions so it can act fulling in a round until very high levels.
If you dont want to go gestalt (which has its own issues), just have every character take a mandatory feat that gives the dragon at a reduced progression. Say at the druid multiclass progression (level - 2 minimum 1). They get the dragons, you dont have to deal with the complexity of gestalt characters, and they had to give something up to get them. It wouldnt be much more disruptive to power then allowing the leadership feat. Maybe less depending on what kind of leadership scores the characters would have.
Erm, what does gestalt mean in this context?
Gestalt was a 3.5 optional rule (from unearthed arcana), where characters could essentially take 2 classes and take the best of saves/hd/skill points/bab from either, and get the class abilities of both. It makes for more powerful characters, but also allows for alot more versatile characters. What was recommended was letting your characters staple the super genius games dragon rider (its available on d20pfsrd if you want to take a quick look at it) on to their existing class gestalt style.
I would recommend just giving them the dragon mounts (from the dragon rider class) via a feat at a slightly slower progression, and call it done. A lot easier to manage then the potential of adding a whole other class to the mix.
Give them the dragons and balance the enemies accordingly. The trouble with this is that the PCs will be the squishiest things on the battlefield, so maybe you want a conceit of some kind that protects them (dragons damaged first) somehow.
I encourage you to make this a one-session or a one-encounter thing, not a campaign-long thing.
Do a "dress rehearsal" for this scene, playing out the fight on your own with some obvious player actions. This is not the kind of thing you want to screw up.
I would pick a given CR and let each player have the age category appropriate for that CR.
I'd probably also try to keep that CR at or below the party level if the party is mid-high level.
If the party is still pretty low level (<8th) I wouldn't even use this idea until much later.
Give them the dragons and balance the enemies accordingly. The trouble with this is that the PCs will be the squishiest things on the battlefield, so maybe you want a conceit of some kind that protects them (dragons damaged first) somehow.
I encourage you to make this a one-session or a one-encounter thing, not a campaign-long thing.
Do a "dress rehearsal" for this scene, playing out the fight on your own with some obvious player actions. This is not the kind of thing you want to screw up.
I would pick a given CR and let each player have the age category appropriate for that CR.
I'd probably also try to keep that CR at or below the party level if the party is mid-high level.
If the party is still pretty low level (<8th) I wouldn't even use this idea until much later.
The OP wants to include the dragons as a significant part of the campaign
However, I kind of want them to get attached to their dragons, and have them as companions afterwards, to face the other BBEGs with them.
This is why I recommend the scaling dragon mounts. Otherwise either the dragons will be too powerful for their level and overshadow the players when they get them, or they will be too squishy at higher levels and not be useful as a continued part of the campaign. Given that the dragon mounts are about as powerful as the better animal companions, they would be able to be used at any level, even low levels if thats what the dm wants. Static dragons of CR X wont suite the OP's needs.
I also recommend the Gestalt rules and the dragon rider.
It does all the work for you. The Dragonrider was designed by Owen K.C. Stephens a WotC and Paizo freelance game designer.
Thanks everyone! Yeah, I'll use the scaling with the dragonriders. Would it be possible to ONLY use the dragon table, and they don't gain any other powers per level? A certain, um, strong-willed player has his heart set on samurai, though if I used the gestalt rule I suppose that wouldn't matter...
Just out of interest, Lincoln, which CR would you say for both sides of dragons if the characters are say... Level 17?
Thanks again, amigos!