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Please help critique my Paladin/Oracle for PFS. (This is my first Paladin Character)
At level 4
~Name: Flann Maelow
Angel-blooded Aasimar, Oath of Vengeance Paladin 3 / Oracle of Lore of Ragathiel
~Ability scores at lv 4 are:
Str 18
Dex 7
Con 15
Int 14
Wis 8
Cha 18
STR: 15 + 2(Race) + 1(lv4), CHA: 15 + 2(Race) + 1(Boon), Lv8 - into Con
~HP(at lv4): 10+6+6+5+8+3= 38hp
Favor class into Hp.
~AC: 10 + (+1) Mithral Agile Breastplate 7 + Cha 4 = 21
~Weapon of choice: Longsword (THF)
~Saves (with clock of resistance +1):
Fort: 9
Reflex: 9
Will: 9
CMB: +7
CMD: +15
~Curse: Haunted (bad ideal?)
~Traits:
Seeker - +1 trait bonus on Perception checks and Perception is a class skill.
Dangerously Curious - +1 bonus on Use Magic Device checks and Use Magic Device is a class skill.
~Feats and powers:
Alter Self (Dhampir) 1/day
Lv1 Revelation) Sidestep Secret (Su) - Cha for AC and Reflex
Lv1) Fey Foundling - +2 hp per healing dice from heals
Lv3) Extra Revelation - Focused Trance (Ex) - up to Cha mod (4) a day +20 circumstance bonus on an int-check
at lv 5) Power Attack
at lv 7) Extra LOH
at lv 9) Extra LOH
~Skills (18 points total)
+6 in 6 Knowledge points - 6 (1 in each skill)
+7 Perception - 4
+12 Use Magical Device - 4
+9 Diplomacy - 2
+3 Linguistic - 1
+8 Climb -1
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Questions:
~Is this build viable for PFS Season 5 + ?
~Should I go more offensive? Grab Exotic Weapon Prof (Falcata)?
~Drop those Knowledge skills?
~Take Nature Mystery instead? For Nature's Whispers?
~Go with the Lame Curse instead and wear heavy armor + Nature's Whispers?
~Put favored class into Skill point?
Any and all advice is greatly welcome!
~Is this build viable for PFS Season 5 + ?
I have a level 12 paladin just like this. This is an amazing build especially for PFS. Being a paladin in season 5 can only help things.
~Should I go more offensive? Grab Exotic Weapon Prof (Falcata)?
You could but a Paladin is feat starved enough, so I wouldn't waste it. I used a longsword my whole career and was very effective. In the begining I used it two handed, but as I leveled up I realized it was getting hit A LOT and hard, so I grabbed a shield, and was still very effective.
~Drop those Knowledge skills?
Never. This is PFS those skills are really important especially in Season 5 when they can determine your path.
~Take Nature Mystery instead? For Nature's Whispers?
I wouldn't. Again, in PFS skills rule.
~Go with the Lame Curse instead and wear heavy armor + Nature's Whispers?
You CHA is your DEX for AC. You have +4 "DEX", you'll be fine with Mithral Medium. That movement is good to have. You could always take Legalistic curse if you have Blood of Fiends.
~Put favored class into Skill point?
That's how I did it.
My other advice would be to take Extra Revelation and take the one that lets you use CHA for Knowledge Skills. As an Oracle you can take the 0-level Enhanced Diplomacy
I feel this is absolutely one of the best builds for PFS because you really can fill any niche needed, without overshadowing someone who specializes in that niche. You can do damage, but won't outclass a two handed barbarian, you can heal a bit, but won't out do a cleric, you have tons of skills that are pretty high (if you use CHA for them) but someone who dedicates ranks every level will be better.
The downside to the build is that you are a paladin in an organization that is, shall we say, morally gray at best. There are some scenarios that will present troubles for paladins.
i didn't look at this in depth, but your saves look wrong...
fort= +3pally +2 con +4 cha +1 cloak = +10
ref= +1 pally +4 cha +4 cha +1 cloak = +10
will= +3 pally +2 oracle -1 wis +4 cha +1 cloak = +9
also, i'm kind of a sucker for the haunted curse but for this guy it just seems like tongues[celestial] would be too perfect to pass up...
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Thanks for the info Judokai. I don't think I will take the CHA for INT Revelation yet. It seems more useful later on.
And I do know that Paladins can have a hard time in PFS, going for a more "see the big picture" kind of paladin.
@nate lange,
Oops! Must have missed something some where!
Does the haunted curse affect the drawing of weapons? Cos I really like it flavor and ability wise... but I'm not sure if it is ideal for a combat build.
Noble scion might not be bad, Also you can take Greater plus ultimate mercy with a +2 cha headband for free raise deads!
Thanks! Almost over looked that!... Hummm.... I'm really low on feats... Guess I will just have to take greater mercy at lv 7 and maybe Ultimate Mercy at lv 11?
Ultimate Mercy needs 10! Uses of lay on hands! I need at least 1 use of extra LOH for that!Don't think I can afford to drop power attack or the extra revelation feat...
haunted does not affect drawing weapons- it will affect potions, scrolls, wands, etc... (some GMs, i know, will let you get/use sheaths for wands so you draw them like weapons but i honestly have no idea if they exist in society play).
i've never played a PFS adventure, so take this with a grain of salt, but i would guess that using a wand in combat will not be viable. first, with haunted you'll need to start with it in hand or use a standard action just to get it (see parenthetical statement above); second, after using it you'd need to spend another action to store it or else drop it as a free action (but haunted will make it land up to 10' away in a random direction); finally, once combat has started you're usually gonna be better off attacking than screwing around trying to get a shield bonus. use the wand to buff before a fight when you know its coming and buy a quickdraw shield to use when you need an AC bump in combat.
in terms of your tough love... a skillful pally is an atypical (and probably somewhat sub-optimal) build, but you seem to have put it together pretty well. you get a revelation at 3rd automatically, so i'd suggest using that instead of the feat for focused trance. now that you have another feat to work with, i'd suggest something to boost your damage (which will generally not be very impressive except, maybe, when smiting)... if you're going to focus on Longsword, weapon focus increases chance to hit by 5%... honestly Arcane Strike is probably your best option- it can't be used in the same round as self-LoH (they're both swift actions), which makes pallys the martial class that benefits least from it, but its an extra +1 damage at 4th and will be +2 next level (thanks to your racial SLA always using your character level for its caster level).
hope that helps
edit: i'm an idiot... you're not leveling as an oracle, that why you used that feat (its 1am and i've been up for 20 hours, so only kind of my fault). it might still be better to take arcane strike if you care about combat at all... otherwise, focused trance will definitely let you get a lot more out of your knowledges.
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@nate Lange,
Got it. I will grab the wand and a quickdraw shield. Having both should be useful. I'm saving them for situations where AC becomes a priority
I'm getting Keen on my Longsword as soon as I'm able to.
On Weapon Focus vs Greater Mercy... I'm still a little torn... I guess I will wait till lvl 7 before deciding. And I think I can squeeze Ultimate Mercy in at lv 9 if I can grab a headband of Cha +4
Btw, I realize I totally for got about getting 3 ranks in Acrobatics. I think I will drop my hp to 35 and place my favourite class into Acrobatics for now. I will focus back on hp from lv 5 onwards.
~Don't Arcane Strike require my character to be able to cast arcane spell to qualify?
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With a -2 Penalty to Dex, why bother with Acrobatics? You'll never hope to beat the DC for moving through threatened squares. If you're planning to fight defensively, then without extra feats (Crane style) it's not worth the -4 penalty to hit. If you need it for jumping over and not falling into lava... eh, fine. But I wouldn't dump Dex down to a 7, PFS doesn't need to be that Min/Maxed. You could go for Str 16, Dex 10, Con 14, Int 14, Wis 10, Cha 16 without having to dump Dex or Wis.
i agree with belryan, probably... investing in acrobatics doesn't seem like a great choice. its not a class skill and you're out of traits to make it one- so with 3 ranks your total bonus will be +1 (assuming my memory is correct about mithril agile breastplate having 0 penalty to acrobatics), so you're chances of making any jump or tumble-in-combat check are basically 0. (edit: ok, in fairness you'd probably have like a 25% chance on a fair number of checks)
i'm assuming that you picked 3 ranks just for the bonus to fight defensively... i'm skeptical about that as well. your damage output isn't going to be great to begin with and the extra -4 to hit will really put it in the crapper; there's a decent chance you'll have the highest AC in the party already (if you had time to kick out shield you almost certainly will), so its probably not necessary; last and worst- taken together, you become the hardest party member to hit and also the one who's the least threat... meaning enemies will ignore you and go after the party's squishy damage dealers (who don't have the option of self-healing as a swift action). as a pally (IMO) you're better off as a damage soak (with just enough AC to not get overrun by packs of chumps) than making an AC monster (that will get ignored after 1-2 rounds). plus, you have the Int for combat expertise- that's a better cost/benefit, if you want more defense work that in somewhere.
remember too that UMD can cover over a multitude of lacking skills... grab a couple scrolls of jump (or expeditious retreat) for when you need to get over gaps, maybe even one of grace in case you really need to get by someone without an AoO- and you've got a wand of shield, could take shield of faith as an oracle, and can buy scrolls of barkskin all to up your AC without resorting to fighting defensively.
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Yes, it's legal, if your Paladin wants to be bound by the Shackles of Hell, and you own Blood of Fiends.
Choose one that befits your character concept. Is he an Oracle that decided to take an Oath and become a Paladin? Why Ragathiel? Maybe, since he's an Aasimar, he can only speak Celestial when stressed (Tongues curse).
Really though I'd like to know your actual background / concept for the character and we can build around that rather than just assigning stats on a page.
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The base ideal is a Fey Foundling aasimar with a dark past. One he does not even know about. (Hint, he alter self into a dumpire.)
In some ways, I based him on the character Warlow from the true blood tv series. This is sort of my take of a goodly golarion version of Warlow. Who is a Fey Vampire hybrid in the series.
is the legalistic curse viable for an aasimar paladin? I keep getting the feeling it will only make your actions as a paladin even more restrictive.
Also, isn't the legalistic curse tied to hell? as in it is an evil curse?
It is viable for an Aasimar, and yes it is tied to hell... You were cursed by Hell, that seems sort of appropriate doing you think?
The other thing I did with my Paladin is I took Corrugun Smash from the Cheliax Companion, which is a free Demoralize when you 2-handed power attack. Then I added Cruel to my Longsword which sickens anyone shaken. This made for a pretty effective debuff causing a -4 to saves, skills and to hit, and a -2 to damage. I sort of had internal struggles with Role-Playing aspect of a Paladin adding Cruel to a longsword, but let myself be talked into it since a Paladin can be cruel to evil. Yeah, I know weak excuse, but I loved the mechanics of it.
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BTW, if you're not going to be using a shield, why not go for a Bastard Sword, as it fits in with the Ragathiel concept (favoured weapon). You can two-hand it with Martial Weapon Proficiency, so you wouldn't need to spend a feat on full Exotic proficiency.
For the Dhampir aspect, I think Tongues would work really well if Dhampirs had their own language that you could speak when stressed.. alas, they don't, so you can't really work that aspect into it.
Upon further thought, yeah Jodokai is right and Legalistic could work well for your character concept.
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I think I will do that!
I'm still trying to incorporate aspects of fey and vampire into Flann.
I chose Ragithal, cos of his dual nature. He is born to a Lord of hell, yet overcame his birth to become a force of good. The vengeance and redemption aspects tie up nicely with Flann.
One question tearing at me is... should I go with lore for the more Pathfinder-type paladin. or go with nature, for a more Fey-focused character?
And should I go with dual-cursed? The use of misfortune, while cheesy, fits a character of fey background, while having both haunted and legalistic, seems to reflect his dual conflicting natures well.
Flann is basically playing the "good character with a dark and tormented past/nature" stereotype.
My version of this is a Demonspawn Tiefling Oracle (Lore) 1 / Paladin (Oath of Vengeance) 11... I feel like the Tiefling race is a much better option, due in large part to its favored class ability for Paladins. That and the backstory of being descendant from a fiend and seeking redemption by driving them from this plane of existence.
Also consider the Tiefling trait Suicidal and the very fitting Legalistic curse for a Paladin who feels compelled to keep his word.
I've got the build if you're interested - planning on playing it through Wrath of the Righteous and really looking forward to it.
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My version of this is a Demonspawn Tiefling Oracle (Lore) 1 / Paladin (Oath of Vengeance) 11... I feel like the Tiefling race is a much better option, due in large part to its favored class ability for Paladins. That and the backstory of being descendant from a fiend and seeking redemption by driving them from this plane of existence.
Also consider the Tiefling trait Suicidal and the very fitting Legalistic curse for a Paladin who feels compelled to keep his word.
I've got the build if you're interested - planning on playing it through Wrath of the Righteous and really looking forward to it.
If you can post the build, I would be very grateful.
I will have to adapt it for an Aasimar character, mainly cos I prefer Flann's back story to be that of a good person with a bad past seeking redemption, over an that of a fiend-born seeking redemption.
Unlimied Misfortune with a one-level dip in Oracle is pretty cheesy IMO, make sure to use it responsibly.
Nature's Life Leech could work well with the Dhampir-ness but it might be a tricky thing for a Paladin to do without violating his Code.
Don't think Life Leech is possible with its lv 7 requirement.
However, the more I discuss Flann's background, the more I feel compelled to make him a proper Fey/Dhampir type character.
Therefore I think I WILL go with Nature Oracle, Dual-cursed, Legalistic and Haunted.
It may make me a lot less useful from a Knowledge-pathfinder point of view, but I think it would suit Flann's back story a lot more.
I guess the RP side of me won over the optimize side...
My version of this is a Demonspawn Tiefling Oracle (Lore) 1 / Paladin (Oath of Vengeance) 11... I feel like the Tiefling race is a much better option, due in large part to its favored class ability for Paladins. That and the backstory of being descendant from a fiend and seeking redemption by driving them from this plane of existence.
Also consider the Tiefling trait Suicidal and the very fitting Legalistic curse for a Paladin who feels compelled to keep his word.
I've got the build if you're interested - planning on playing it through Wrath of the Righteous and really looking forward to it.
If you can post the build, I would be very grateful.
I will have to adapt it for an Aasimar character, mainly cos I prefer Flann's back story to be that of a good person with a bad past seeking redemption, over an that of a fiend-born seeking redemption.
Fiend-born can't be good people with a bad past? I would think that's almost the definition of a Tiefling PC...
The character is built around all of the benefits that the Tiefling race offers - if you're set on Aasimar Paladin (the child of an angel seeking a life of holiness doesn't exactly sound like the tortured soul concept you were working on), then its probably better to stick with what you have... but I will advise you that a single level of Oracle is probably all you need, and that you'll benefit more with more levels in Paladin.
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My version of this is a Demonspawn Tiefling Oracle (Lore) 1 / Paladin (Oath of Vengeance) 11... I feel like the Tiefling race is a much better option, due in large part to its favored class ability for Paladins. That and the backstory of being descendant from a fiend and seeking redemption by driving them from this plane of existence.
Also consider the Tiefling trait Suicidal and the very fitting Legalistic curse for a Paladin who feels compelled to keep his word.
I've got the build if you're interested - planning on playing it through Wrath of the Righteous and really looking forward to it.
If you can post the build, I would be very grateful.
I will have to adapt it for an Aasimar character, mainly cos I prefer Flann's back story to be that of a good person with a bad past seeking redemption, over an that of a fiend-born seeking redemption.
Fiend-born can't be good people with a bad past? I would think that's almost the definition of a Tiefling PC...
The character is built around all of the benefits that the Tiefling race offers - if you're set on Aasimar Paladin (the child of an angel seeking a life of holiness doesn't exactly sound like the tortured soul concept you were working on), then its probably better to stick with what you have... but I will advise you that a single level of Oracle is probably all you need, and that you'll benefit more with more levels in Paladin.
Got it. I would likely only go a single level of Oracle.
Going Tiefling, would be ideal mechanically and flavour wise.
The reason I picked Aasimar instead, specifically Angel-blooded is for the ability to for Flann to "revert" to his "past form", that of a Vampire or Dhampir, via Alter self.
I'm RPing this as him losing control of himself. It just fits the character ideal more. Like he occasionally struggles with his hidden inner self.
A good person with a tortured nature.
I mean... imagine if the paladin of a party suddenly grow fangs and have blood sucking issues...