I'm in a Way of the Wicked campaign at the moment and am likely going to be dealing with Clerics hitting my evil self and my Eidolon with Holy Word.
My question is this: Does the 24 hour banishment prohibit the spell Summon Eidolon from calling back the Eidolon?
Yes, Holy Word explicitly prevent the outsider from returning to the material plane for 24 hours. There is no exemption in the Summoner class features that gets around this limitation, and banishment effects work normally.
And yes, having to save at a -4 penalty or lose your primary class feature for 24 hours is harsh.
It's not harsh. The summoner just starts porting in standard action summons, all with smite good/evil and potentially many attacks to benefit from the smiting.
Plus the summoner spellcasting itself, which is nearly as good as an actual 9-level caster thanks to massive level reductions for spells.
How would this work in relation do Dimensional Anchor? If I used it on my Eidolon, would that keep the Eidolon from being banished?
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It's not harsh. The summoner just starts porting in standard action summons, all with smite good/evil and potentially many attacks to benefit from the smiting.
Unless they are a master summoner, only a single instance can be active at a time.
After that, they are no better at summoning that a standard wizard.
Also, dimensional anchor does not prevent summoned creatures from disappearing at the end of a summoning spell.
I would say based on this line (and I know it isn't much to go off of) that the banishment effect of Holy Word would function regardless of if a Dimensional Anchor was in place.
That line refers to the summon spell running out on its own though, not being forcibly cut short by HW - and Eidolons have no duration.
I'm aware, note my use of parenthesis, but it's the closest thing we have to provide any guidance. The Eidolon while different from other summons is still a summon.
And, at the very least when the dimensional anchors time runs out the Eidolon should be whisked away, assuming that dimensional anchor counters banishment (which I don't think it does).
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That line refers to the summon spell running out on its own though, not being forcibly cut short by HW - and Eidolons have no duration.I'm aware, note my use of parenthesis, but it's the closest thing we have to provide any guidance. The Eidolon while different from other summons is still a summon.
And, at the very least when the dimensional anchors time runs out the Eidolon should be whisked away, assuming that dimensional anchor counters banishment (which I don't think it does).
The banish effect is instantaneous though; it tries to remove the Eidolon, fails, and it ends. The 24 hours only kicks in if the original attempt was successful.
Dispelling the anchor before Wording isn't an outrageous tactic, and a Summoner spending actions to lock his Eidolon in place is a summoner not casting other things. Plus the anchor keeps him from calling it back to his side in an emergency.
I'll give you that you that it would seem banishment is an instaneous effect. So, you're right that it wouldn't have any effect if it didn't work initially. However, I still stand by that dimensional anchor will not protect from banishment.
@Psyren
I did cross-post yes.
However, I still stand by that dimensional anchor will not protect from banishment.
But if Dimensional Anchor blocks all forms of "extradimensional travel" (friendly or otherwise), wouldn't kicking the Eidolon off the plane fall under said blocked travel?
@Psyren
I did cross-post yes.However, I still stand by that dimensional anchor will not protect from banishment.But if Dimensional Anchor blocks all forms of "extradimensional travel" (friendly or otherwise), wouldn't kicking the Eidolon off the plane fall under said blocked travel?
Ah ha! But the spell text reads as follows:
A green ray springs from your hand. You must make a ranged touch attack to hit the target. Any creature or object struck by the ray is covered with a shimmering emerald field that completely blocks extradimensional travel. Forms of movement barred by a dimensional anchor include astral projection, blink, dimension door, ethereal jaunt, etherealness, gate, maze, plane shift, shadow walk, teleport, and similar spell-like abilities. The spell also prevents the use of a gate or teleportation circle for the duration of the spell.
A dimensional anchor does not interfere with the movement of creatures already in ethereal or astral form when the spell is cast, nor does it block extradimensional perception or attack forms. Also, dimensional anchor does not prevent summoned creatures from disappearing at the end of a summoning spell.
So, without any interpretation the spells mentioned by Dimensional Anchor are blocked, which does not include banishment or Holy Word (which relies on banishment's affect).
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And how many times have the developers stated that it is impossible to make all inclusive lists?
A lot.
The important word in that list is include. This indicates that list is not all inclusive.[/b]
Couple that with the preceding statement that provides context.
completely blocks extradimensional travel
Holy Word and Banishment are from the Core Rule Book, so at least for this I'm not accepting that answer.
I think Banishment affects are supposed to work differently.
But don't state they work differently.Holy Word and Banishment are from the Core Rule Book, so at least for this I'm not accepting that answer.
I think Banishment affects are supposed to work differently.
Theres not a 100% clear indication, or else this question wouldn't be asked. And it's been asked since 2010 or so with no actual resolution so far as I'm aware.
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Claxon, perhaps a new FAQ attempt is in order.
As I see it there are two questions.
A) If an extra-planar creature is under the effect of Dimensional Anchor can it be sent back to its home plane via the spells Dismissal, Banishment, or Holy Word?
B) Can an Eidolon who has been sent back to its home plane via Holy Word (unable to return for 24 hours) be summoned back using either the Summoner's ritual or the spell Summon Eidolon?
I expect the answer to B is no. The answer to A seems less clear but I would expect that Dimensional Anchor does not prevent a creature from being returned from whence it came.
- Gauss
Dimensional Anchor was written before Eidolon. The intent was clearly that it does NOT let you circumvent banishment effects, but start an FAQ if you really want.
Gauss I agree completely with your post.
StreamOfTheSky, are you saying banishment should work despite dimensional anchor or shouldn't?
I'm saying Banishment should work. Dim Anchor isn't meant to be a way to cheese your way out of inoculating your summoned creatures from being sent home by other casters.
I'm saying Banishment should work. Dim Anchor isn't meant to be a way to cheese your way out of inoculating your summoned creatures from being sent home by other casters.
I totally agree. It's supposed to be a drawback that summoned creatures can be banished. It's supposed to be part of "the balance", but if you can cast dimensional anchor on your Eidolon then it's never a problem. Worse yet, there is the item (I forget the name) that is supposed to be like handcuffs basically that basically cause a dimensional anchor affect on a creature. Which could be put on an Eidolon to make it invulnerable to banishment without any need for spell casting at all (under the oppositions interpretation).
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Dimensional Anchor was written before Eidolon. The intent was clearly that it does NOT let you circumvent banishment effects, but start an FAQ if you really want.
I agree that it should be FAQ'd, but not that the intent is clear. For me, it makes sense that an Anchor can be used by a summoner to reinforce a summon, similarly to how it can be used by a summmoner to reinforce a binding. It's just one more safeguard in the canny caster's toolbelt.
Psyren, it all depends on how Dismissal, Banishment, etc. are interpreted. Do they "end" the time on this plane? Or do they transport the creature?
If transport then Dimensional Anchor may work although I believe that is way outside of the intent of the spell.
If ending the time on this plane then that would be related to the summoned creatures clause in Dimensional Anchor.
In short, I do not believe that Dimensional Anchor is intended to keep ANY extraplanar creature here against these spells. If we were talking about any other situation I think people would come down on the side of No. But, we are talking about a class feature and as a result people want it to work in order to protect the class feature.
- Gauss