I'm currently playing a Sorcerer with a single level dip into Oracle. I choose to go with the Haunted curse which says to "add mage hand and ghost sound to your list of spells known." Since curses advance at 1/2 level per non-oracle level, when I reach Sorcerer level 8 I'll be adding levitate and minor image to my "list of spells known." My questions:
1. Does each class have a separate "list of spells known" or does my character have one "list of spells known" that apply to all spontaneous caster classes I've leveled?
2. If I have more than one "list of spells known" am I able to use my spells per day from Class A to cast a spell known by Class B if it's a class spell for Class A?
3. If I have more than one "list of spells known" can I add spells gained from a Curse to a non-Oracle "list of spells known" since it doesn't specify? If not what am I supposed to do with Level 2 spells for a class that can't cast them?
1: Yes, separate.
2: No. They come from different sources. The sorcerer stuff is from your bloodline and awesomeness, the oracle spells are from whatever weird juju you have going on. Arcane and divine anyway.
3: I don't really understand the question, but you can cast them. If your curse gives you arcane spells, in this case Mage Hand and Ghost Sound, they count as oracle divine spells for the purpose of casting. Same with spells you are granted for any level you can cast. "If not what am I supposed to do with Level 2 spells for a class that can't cast them?" Is unclear. These spells are not put in by the designers to tease and annoy. If a spell is not on the standard oracle list but it is on the mystery list,you can cast it.
For example, if you take the Metal mystery, you get Lead Blades at 2nd level. It is normally a ranger only spell, but because of the mystery, you get it as an oracle spell. You don not have to take a dip into ranger to qualify to cast it.
3. No. You add them to your oracle spells known list. Class abilities always reference that class unless stated otherwise. (Ie. level means class level, spells known list means spells known for that class, etc.)
Everything, and I mean EVERYTHING is tracked separately. Your oracle side gives nothing to your sorcerer side and vice versa.
Right, the issue is I'm only bothering to take 1 level of Oracle. So for this example assume 10 charisma and my leveling scheme went like this:
1: Sorcerer 1
2: Sorcerer 1/Oracle 1
3: Sorcerer 2/Oracle 1
4: Sorcerer 3/Oracle 1
5: Sorcerer 4/Oracle 1
6: Sorcerer 5/Oracle 1
7: Sorcerer 6/Oracle 1
8: Sorcerer 7/Oracle 1
9: Sorcerer 8/Oracle 1
So at character level 9 my spell list would look like this:
SORCERER
Level 0: 8 Spells, unlimited uses
Level 1: 5 Spells, 6/day
Level 2: 3 Spells, 6/day
Level 3: 2 Spells, 5/day
Level 4: 1 Spell, 3/day
ORACLE
Level 0: 4 Spells + Mage Hand and Ghost Sound, unlimited uses
Level 1: 2 Spells, 3/day
Level 2: Levitate and Minor Image, 0/day
Meaning Levitate and Minor Image would be useless. The issue I have with this is that RAW, my Curse only says "add levitate and minor image to your list of spells known" instead of "to your list of Oracle spells known." My contention is that I should be allowed to have my spell list look like this instead:
SORCERER
Level 0: 8 Spells + Mage Hand and Ghost Sound, unlimited uses
Level 1: 5 Spells, 6/day
Level 2: 3 Spells, 6/day
Level 3: 2 Spells + Levitate and Minor Image, 5/day
Level 4: 1 Spell, 3/day
ORACLE
Level 0: 4 Spells, unlimited uses
Level 1: 2 Spells, 3/day
Level 2: None, 0/day
I reason I argue this is because the Oracle Curse advances with non-Oracle levels and thus would seem to be tied to character advancement rather than simply class advancement. I wouldn't attempt to argue this point with other class features such as the Sorcerer's Bloodline, since the wording of how those spells are added is different.
You wouldn't get them automatically for sorcerer. That's the penalty for only taking one level in oracle. You can't get round that. There is nothing stopping you from taking them normally as a sorcerer though but they are separate, you certainly don't get them as free spells known.
I see where you are going though.
If you were to choose a mystery which had divine spells on the list, like Life, you would be eligible to get the following spells as your oracle class advances:
Bonus Spells: detect undead (2nd), lesser restoration (4th), neutralize poison (6th), restoration (8th), breath of life (10th), heal (12th), greater restoration (14th), mass heal (16th), true resurrection (18th).
A friendly GM might rule that your oracle level gives you some knowledge of the magic involved in your chosen mystery and because a sorcerer normally chooses from the Sorc/wiz list, but has some vagueness in the rules as to where his power comes from, the GM might let you take one of those divine mystery spells as a sorcerer spell known.
Might. It isn't RAW, but you can make a role playing argument for it. Blagging Lesser Restoration and Heal as sorcerer spells may be worth the pleading.
I suppose I'm mainly confused why the text for an Oracle's curse is so vague while the text for spells learned by a Mastery or Bloodline are quite clear:
"add [spell] your list of spells known"
vs
"an oracle learns an additional spell derived from her mystery"
"a sorcerer learns an additional spell, derived from her bloodline"
Anyway I guess I'll talk to my GM about it, thanks for the help!
You have it right the first time, they get added to your list of oracle spells known, as stated a class section always references itself and does not overlap, your character's oracle side and sorcerer side do not cross over.
So at level 8 you have
ORACLE
Level 0: 4 Spells + Mage Hand and Ghost Sound, unlimited uses
Level 1: 2 Spells, 3/day
Level 2: Levitate and Minor Image, 0/day
Meaning that you cannot use your level 2 spells unless your charisma score is high enough to grant you bonus spells of that level, as I understand it.
And additionally if I may be a dick for a moment assuming a charisma stat of 10 you can only ever cast cantrips because you need to have a score of 10+spell level in order to be able to cast. Not at all the point of course.
"Meaning that you cannot use your level 2 spells unless your charisma score is high enough to grant you bonus spells of that level, as I understand it."
Interesting, I didn't realize bonus spells perday applied in this way. So does that mean with an Ability Score of 28 I technically have a 9th Level Spell Per Day despite not actually having access to 9th Level spells? I.E. could I sacrifice this 9th level spell for Arcane Blast? I was under the assumption that I couldn't.
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bbobjs wrote: "Meaning that you cannot use your level 2 spells unless your charisma score is high enough to grant you bonus spells of that level, as I understand it."
Interesting, I didn't realize bonus spells perday applied in this way.
It doesn't. Hordshyrd is incorrect. You do not gain bonus spell slots of a given level until you are capable of casting spells of that level.
So yes, you gain the spells as 2nd level oracle spells, and yes, they do absolutely nothing for your character, that's the price you pay for choosing that specific curse on a dip.
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