With alter self you can assume the form of a humanoid and it seems you get the natural weapons this form has by doing so.
Is there any humanoid creature that has horns or something similar?
The satyr is a fey, the minotaur is a monstrous humanoid. The most fitting would really be the satyr or something as close to it as possible.
Could there be a weregoat? Or a goatfolk?
Is there any other way to get horns apart from the lesser fiend totem rage power?
I want to build a follower of Shub-Niggurath and she is called the Black Goat of the Woods with a Thousand Young and is (in myth) said so swallow her followers and regurgitate them transformed into what I understood to be goat-men. So I am looking for ways to become closer to this ideal.
But if I go the fiend totem route I can't take the greater beast totem for pounce later on.
My plan is a multiclass of scarred rager barbarian and cleric. So to get alter self I'd have to chose a race that gets it as SLA but the aasimar could do that.
An alternative I could ask my GM to allow me a reflavored boar shaman druid (reflavored to a goat shaman) instead of cleric. But then I would not be able to take the plant(growth) domain I want. The boar shaman can get a gore attack via totem transformation. It should not matter much if it comes from tusks or horns.
All ideas are welcome.
Unfortunately, there does not appear to be any choices after a look at the humanoid listings. But how about we approach this from another perspective?
If the issue is whether you can pounce and get your gore attack, then about looking for another way to get gore? Lesser fiend totem a supernatural power, rather than a polymorph effect, so it can stack with just about anything you want.
From the looks of it, you can get pounce through beast shape II, which is a level 10 spell for alchemists (which can also be taken through your mutagen with an archetype, but same level for it to be available), level 10 magus, level 7 sorcerer, and level 6 wizard.
Or you could take it through druid at 6th level via your wildshape. This might a good option where you dip barbarian and then play a combat druid. You will have a lot of strength (+8 strength when you rage as a large animal), and there is synergy between your gore and the wildshape's natural attacks (they all benefit from an amulet of mighty fists).
With this option, you play a barbarian 2/druid x, and you can start Goring at level 2 and pounce by level 8. This also allows you to follow a gradual change from a brutal and depraved human into a more and more inhuman beast. Just take the Extra Rage feat so that you can continue to have enough rage to get use your gore often (with 14 con, you would have 8 rounds of rage before and 14 after the feat).
Plus, you could turn into an actual goat. Baaah! And yes, you could just pick a form that naturally has a gore attack, but that can get rather restricting to find something with what you need and some arbitrary attack. The rage power lets you stick horns onto velociraptors and T-rexes. Nothing else needs to be said after that.
There is some disagreement about whether lycanthropes are templates and ineligible for such a purpose.
Tieflings are often depicted with horns, they just can't get a gore attack. If this is about image, though, that shouldn't matter, right?
@Lemeres: Good ideas. I am already planning on playing a pure wildhspe druid in another game so I was hoping I could avoid having another one but perhaps I'll go that route.
Or I'll take this one as my druid and play something else in the other game.
@titania: I'll talk to my gm about this.
@mplindustries: Tieflings are not humanoids so I could not take them for alter self but they might be an option as my race to start out with a beastman like look.
Since a divine caster that does melee seems to be the general idea here, how about a Qlippoth-Spawn tiefling? It has bonuses to strength and wisdom, and it seems like the race that I would most easily associate with the alien creatures of the dark tapestry/Lovecraft mythos.
It certainly has the right amount of random consonants to fit in with that mythos.
Nice idea lemeres.
While I am looking at the tiefling and his alternate traits I found something. They can get goat legs from fiendish sprinter and, if a gm allows a bit of reflavoring, a natural weapon (normally either a bite or two claws) from maw or claw. Perhaps I could choose maw and get horns instead. As you can only do a bite or a horn attack in one turn it would not really matter.
And the result would be what I wanted, a goat-man.
While I don't like dumping int the Qlippoth-Spawn might be a good option because I need at least a little cha for my channel energy. But alter self would be nice to have as well. Especially because clerics don't get it.
I'll think it over.
One problem remains. I asked the question here, so please answer there if you want because it is a rules question. Can an aasimar or tiefling use a domain power that allows him to enlarge himself as if using enlarge person.
edit: As maw or claw replaces the spellike ability it would not matter as I would not get alter self anyways.
Is it horns, or a gore attack that interests you?
I want horns and I'd like them to be usable as a natural attack. I don't really care if they are natural attack (horns) like the satyr has or a gore attack.
They are in bestiary 2 are they not?
Might be. It is the reflavoring part that I have to ask about. And which form I assume when turning into a werebeast.
If your dm will allow. Take 1 level of summoner synthesis.
If I understand it right the synth's eidolon shell will vanish if you are hit and enough damage is dealt to deplete the eidonlon's hp.
That would make for a rather short fun in most fights. With only a dip that is.But apart from that I'm no summoner friend and I'd like to stay away from the synth, more to as a dip.
edit: I looked at the half-orc summoner and I have to say I didn't like it. And I don't see what you mean with the permanent aspect of the eidolon. As I read it it always only lasts 1 minute.
@mplindustries: Tieflings are not humanoids so I could not take them for alter self but they might be an option as my race to start out with a beastman like look.
I think what he meant (and I would suggest) is playing as a tiefling as your base race. :P
They have darkvision as well, and have pretty decent 'subraces' oni spawn even has alter self as a daily spell like ability.
@mplindustries: Tieflings are not humanoids so I could not take them for alter self but they might be an option as my race to start out with a beastman like look.I think what he meant (and I would suggest) is playing as a tiefling as your base race. :P
They have darkvision as well, and have pretty decent 'subraces' oni spawn even has alter self as a daily spell like ability.
Yes, I'm half way decided to do just that. But I really want to have the plant(growth) 1st level domain power and I fear that it will not work with a tiefling.
|
Aasimar can have Horns, but no gore attack.
Wait until you can get a Helm of the Mammoth Lord, then gore as you please.
I guess it will be one of those:
- the tiefling with goat legs and a natural attack (if I'm allowed to use my domain power)
- the scion of humanity aasimar with alter self (if I can find a way to use it to get horns attacks)
- some other race with the lesser fiend totem rage power
I would like the tiefling best but having a melee that can (for some rounds per day) enlarge himself as a swift action was the core of the concept (together with playing a follower of the outer gods) so I would not throw it away lightly.
half-orcs can pick up tusks as a racial (replaces ferocity, i think) and benefit from enlarge person and the like- you could talk to your GM about 're-fluffing' one of those? i mean, honestly, if your GM is on board you could take a half-orc with the "toothy" and "shaman's apprentice" alternate powers, switch out the falchion/greataxe proficiency for something more thematic (that's still a martial weapon) and call it a "Goatman" (with the head natural attack being horns instead of a bite)- the only tricky part would be determining how to adjust the subtypes.
Does it have to be PFS legal? If not ask your GM if you could take tiefling and reflavor its alternate trait Maw or Claw (which is a replacement for the racial spell-like ability and grants either single bite attack dealing 1d6 points of damage or two claw attacks dealing 1d4 each) as gore. This would combine with goat legs for even more goatish form. And if your GM would allow you to be qlippoth-spawn you would get nice ability scores (+2 Str, +2 Wis, -2 Int) for barbarian/cleric build.
Ask your GM if you can use the ARG to build a tiefling, then put a gore attack on and take off one of the other racial benefits of the same cost (natural attack is 1 pt, and fiendish sorcery is 1 pt, switch them out). It's not that big a stretch, tieflings have horns, it's just yours are bigger than normal, and you didn't get any sorcery benefits from your sire.
Tieflings are often depicted with horns, they just can't get a gore attack. If this is about image, though, that shouldn't matter, right?
By the way -- tieflings are native outsiders, not humanoids, so you cannot turn into one with Alter Self. Of course, that point no longer matters if you go with the approach suggested in later messages of being a tiefling with horns all the time.
Thanks for the ideas. I'll see and wait what my gm answers.
Reflavoring the tiefling racial "Maw" to "Gore" functionally doesn't change anything mechanic wise. Both are primary attacks. Both get 1.5xStr when used alone, as long as you keep the same d6 damage.
Especially since hooves tail and horns are one of the most iconic tiefling images since they were first introduced.
(So long as you don't then try some mechanic monkeying to get a bite along with it from adopted or something)
But it does have mechanical repercussions. That is why this thread exists. Gore attacks area bit hard to come by without a price (fiend totem over beast totem.) Outside of specific beast forms and such, I cannot think of anything other than an 8,500 gold item that gives a gore.
In comparison, bites can easily be gained through a rage power, a discovery, and even a trait. A tiefling with a gore could easily go alchemist (or heaven forbid-vivisectionist) and get 4 natural attacks with the feral mutagen discovery by level 2.
Isn't there a way to have a prosthetic implanted? Have one surgically attached.
Anyway, if you really want to go off the wall, you could look into fleshwarping and the like to get a gore. Rather...extreme. There are rules for it, but I can't for the life of me find anything consistent. It is much harder to pull off when you are not the GM with a mad scientist off screen where you don't need to actually deal with the messy details.
paizo released a whole book (the advanced race guide) just to make it so people could build custom races... it happens to fall under the OGL and so is posted on the official PRD. just talk to your GM about putting together a custom race.
fauns and satyrs are fey, but if your making a more mundane goatman monstrous humanoid is the most likely type... what you want is humanoid, and with the precedent of lizardmen and tengu you could make a decent case for humanoid based on a goat. (so Humanoid- 0 points)
you could try for large size (removing the need for enlarge person) but given the size of goats (and the fact that you'd need to add the giant sub-type for no discernible reason) you should be medium (0 points)
based on a goat's stats you probably take "flexible" for +2 Dex and +2 Con (2 points)
and then maybe the following specials- low-light vision (1), natural attack [gore] (1), +2 survival (2), jumper (always count as running for jump checks)(2), natural armor (+1 natural armor bonus) (2)
@lemeres: Bite and gore are both on the same extremity (the head) and can't be used in the same round. That's why it doesn't make a mechanical difference.
Again, there is some debate about whether they can stack. If you only go off of precedent, then you can see various monsters that can combine the two, despite the lack of an ability that would add a new mechanic allowing this. The gargoyle is the often cited example.