Guisarme vs. Fauchard -The Superior Option?

[NECR0G1ANT]

My next PFS character will be a trip fighter, so I wanted a weapon with reach and the trip weapon trait. I've narrowed my choice of main weapon to the following:

CRB p.280 wrote:

Guisarme

Damage 1d10 S; Traits: Reach, Trip

LOCG p.92 wrote:

Fauchard

Damage 1d8 S; Traits: Deadly d8, Reach, Sweep, Trip

Which do you think is better?

I'm partial to the fauchard because I think the Deadly damage will compensate for the lower base damage, but I'm interested to hear what you all think.

[Sossen]

Sweep gives +1 to hit while doing a Swipe which is a big deal, so advantage for the Fauchard.

Otherwise, the Guisarme will have a clear damage advantage while you are using the initial Striking rune. During those levels the Fauchard deals 4.5 extra damage on a crit on average, but the Guisarme deals 2 more base damage on average which translates to 4 more base damage on a crit. At other Striking rune levels the Fauchard catches up as long as you are critting fairly often. This is only considering attacks without MAP - subsequent attacks rarely crit and so the Guisarme has an advantage here, but the Sweep trait on the Fauchard can mitigate this when there are multiple targets available.

If you want to be using Swipe often then go for the Fauchard, otherwise I think the Guisarme is better.

[Hsui]

Guisarme in my opinion. If you are minion clearing (which swipe is great at doing), then the +1 for swipe is not really necessary anyways.

[graystone]

Guisarme. Over the long run that extra base damage is going to add up more than the bonus on a crit will and the more likely you are to crit a creature, the less likely you'll NEED he extra damage as you're likely hitting something under your level.

[NECR0G1ANT]

Sossen wrote:

During those levels the Fauchard deals 4.5 extra damage on a crit on average, but the Guisarme deals 2 more base damage on average which translates to 4 more base damage on a crit.

Check your math - a d10 averages a 5.5 and a d8 averages 4.5. That's 1 more damage on average, twice that on a crit.

[Squiggit]

NECR0G1ANT wrote:

Sossen wrote:

During those levels the Fauchard deals 4.5 extra damage on a crit on average, but the Guisarme deals 2 more base damage on average which translates to 4 more base damage on a crit.

Check your math - a d10 averages a 5.5 and a d8 averages 4.5. That's 1 more damage on average, twice that on a crit.

Sossen said with a striking rune, which bumps the guisarme up to 2d10 and the fauchard to 2d8, or 11 damage vs 9. Or 2 more damage for the guisarm.

Presumably since deadly doesn't upgrade until you have a major striking rune.

Once you get a major it bumps up to 3/6 on a crit for the guisarm vs 9 on a crit for the fauchard, which is a little better for the latter weapon.

Essentially though, depending on your runes a fauchard does 1/2/3/4 less damage on a regular hit in exchange for 2.5/.5/3/5.5 extra damage on a crit. For no rune/striking/major/greater.

[NECR0G1ANT]

Squiggit wrote:

NECR0G1ANT wrote:

Sossen wrote:

During those levels the Fauchard deals 4.5 extra damage on a crit on average, but the Guisarme deals 2 more base damage on average which translates to 4 more base damage on a crit.

Check your math - a d10 averages a 5.5 and a d8 averages 4.5. That's 1 more damage on average, twice that on a crit.

Sossen said with a striking rune, which bumps the guisarme up to 2d10 and the fauchard to 2d8, or 11 damage vs 9. Or 2 more damage for the guisarm.

Oh, I understand now. My mistake.

[PossibleCabbage]

Nothing keeping you from starting with a Guisarme then switching to a Fauchard when you can afford the major striking rune.

[Draco18s]

Deadly/Fatal aren't worth it. You lose a die size permanently in order to get an extra die on a crit. You don't get that average damage back until you're fighting creatures FOUR levels lower than you are, last time I did the math.

https://topps.diku.dk/torbenm/troll.msp
https://pastebin.com/9itBXB0D

You'll have to tweak things to get the right dice and relative AC/tohit, but there's a few template weapons in there (including a light pick, which has Fatal).

[NECR0G1ANT]

PossibleCabbage wrote:

Nothing keeping you from starting with a Guisarme then switching to a Fauchard when you can afford the major striking rune.

I was considering doing so once I get Swipe. How much does that cost in Organized Play?

[NECR0G1ANT]

From what you all have said, I think I will be going with the guisarme. Thank you all for your advice.