PFS Caster / Support Bard - Armor, Wands and Scrolls

[Feend]

I wasn't sure if I should necro my older thread that was about building a bard. Since I am done making my bard, I made a new thread about gearing up. And thank you everyone that posted on the build thread. There was a lot of great suggestions which gave me much to think about and a better idea of what kind of character to build.

This is for a PFS character, I just hit level 3 and am selecting new spells, skills and starting to map out what I should buy and save for. Now that I have a few levels and cash I have more questions. This character plays a support role.

Amor

I am not a combat bard, I am in the back casting. I am not sure what Armor to get? Should I get a mithral chain shirt or Mithral BP? Or something else? The BP gives better AC, but I will have a -1 penalty check to my skills. I have read other threads on this but I am not sure still what is better for a support Bard. Or should look at something else? I don't really intend to be on the front lines so not sure if the Medium Mithral BP is worth the extra AC. Also, should I look at getting a shield too?

Wands/Scrolls

MY current spells are charm, hideous laughter, and grease. I haven't chosen my new level 1 one spell. I do have a wand of CLW, but haven't purchased any other bard wands yet. Suggestions? I am not really sure which spells are better to get as class spells, wands, or scrolls.

How much should I invest in UMD? If I do what wands would be good to get? Color Spray or Mage armor? What does my UMD need to use non-bard wands/scrolls effectively.

All advice and discussion is appreciated.

[Conman the Bardbarian]

Instead of buying a shield you can get a wand of shield for 750gp or 2pp for +4ac. You're probably not going to want an attack spell wand since it's saves are going to suck unless you're a 10th level magician bard.

The higher you get your UMD up the more options it will give you. I wish it was covered under versatile performance.

[Feend]

Thanks Conman. I agree it would be nice if UMD was covered by VP.

[Cuttler]

level 1 spells

charm person: personnaly dont like this spell...not eally useful in combat because ti moves the attitude from hostile (which is what the foes are usually when they see you) to indifferent...so maybe a little useful out of combat, but that's it.

ear-piercing scream : an effective low-level spell if you have a good charisma score (thus good DC)...the damage is not really important, but the potential daze effect (no action ) can be good...

vanish : also a very good spell, gets better as you gain level.

level 2 spells (when you get there):

soundburst : 1d8 damage + stun (FORT save) for 1 round in 10' radius (many foes);

glitterdust : blind if miss their WILL save in 10' radius (many foes);

cacophoneous call : get nauseated condition for 1r/level if fail WILL save...basically a save or die spell since they wont do much thing if they fail

Silence: (always useful)

So that should cover your first few selections of spells. Some combination like vanish on yourself and silence on a copper that is on you and then you follow the opposing wizard (ready action to follow him) and he wont be able to cast for the combat.

Having glitterdust and soundburst is good since they affect different types of save...

remember that a bard don't do a lot of damages with his spell (not his job)...however, he can give a lot of condtions which can deeply swing the tides of battle!!

Having a good UMD is always good for a bard, more so if you want to use spells not on your class spell list. Having cure wands to help party is good.

the problem with wand and scroll is that they use the minimum stat required to establish the spell's DC. So not very effective for bard's spell which focus more on giving conditions...

[Akerlof]

A mithral breastplace costs 4200 and a mithral chain shirt costs 1100. The breastplate gives you 2 more AC for 3100 GP, to get the same bonus on the chain shirt you would need to spend an extra 5000 GP and have something like 20 fame. So the mithral breastplate saves you 1900 GP in the long run.

The standard ACP for a breastplate is -4, reduce that by 1 for masterwork (mithral is always masterwork,) and by another 3 for mithral and you get an ACP of 0. You won't take any penalties for wearing a mithral breastplate.

The DC to use a wand is a flat 20. So optimally, you would get +19 on your UMD, that way you won't be able to "jam" your wand even if you roll a 1. (The wording under "try again" is: "if you ever roll a natural 1 while attempting to activate an item and you fail..." so if you succeed on a 1 you don't suffer any negative consequences.) If you want to UMD things in combat you probably want to get it as high as possible, otherwise you're wasting rounds. If you're going for out of combat, it's much less important, the higher it is just reduces the chance that you'll lock yourself out for a day, +9 means you succeed 50% of the time while +4 means you succeed 25% of the time. So, you generally have half as many chances to lock yourself out of a wand if you have a +9 as you would with a +4.

For spells known: Expeditious retreat is good: You don't have to run faster than the dragon, you just have to run faster than the dwarf in full plate. (Might be worthy of a wand, though.) Summon Monster 1 starts looking good at 3rd level, at worst it's either a +2 on your meleer's attack rolls or an extra body between you and the big, nasty thing trying to eat you. Remove Fear is situationally a VERY good spell: Many full BAB, heavily armed and armored melee characters will have weak will saves, it's much better to not have them running at their full speed for 4 rounds while someone else is trying to eat your face. Have you SEEN how fast a barbarian can move when he's serious about it?

Shield is a good wand, and there's a cracked ioun stone that works like a ring of spell storing for level 1 spells and costs 2000 GP, so you can turn that into an "out of combat" wand down the road. A wand of Mage Armor is only 750GP and does a great job of tiding you off until you can afford a mithril breastplate (And you're still 1150 GP ahead of the same AC chain shirt.) Wand of Enlarge Person is good, though it's a 1 round casting time even in wand form. Protection from Evil is another good wand, Endure Elements can be a life saver, but might be too conditional to merit the investment. (At least hold off until you run into a scenario that sounds like you'll be facing extreme hot of cold.) Scrolls of lesser restoration are handy at 150GP a pop, (you need to hit 20+spell level to UMD scrolls, so the higher the better for those, but Lesser Restoration is an out of combat spell, so it's not THAT important to have a high UMD.)

[Feend]

Thanks Akerlof. I thought all mithral armor was considered masterwork and was part of the 3 reduction to ACP.

[Serum]

Feend wrote:

Thanks Akerlof. I thought all mithral armor was considered masterwork and was part of the 3 reduction to ACP.

Yes, those are the two conflicting lines of thought.

[Akerlof]

Serum wrote:

Feend wrote:

Thanks Akerlof. I thought all mithral armor was considered masterwork and was part of the 3 reduction to ACP.

Yes, those are the two conflicting lines of thought.

I hadn't actually run into anyone who ruled that the reduction included both the bonus from mithral and the bonus from being masterwork.

[Feend]

So in PFS games I can use the -4 reduction putting the ACP at 0?

[Serum]

Check out the CRB specific magic armors 'Elven Chain' and 'Mithral Full Plate of Speed'. Both are mithral, so look at their ACPs.

[Conman the Bardbarian]

I think it's only -3 to ACP but it adds +2 to max dex and drops the armor one category so medium becomes light.

[fretgod99]

Conman the Bardbarian wrote:

I think it's only -3 to ACP but it adds +2 to max dex and drops the armor one category so medium becomes light.

It does, but you still need medium proficiency wear mithral medium armor without penalty. Elven Chain is an exception in that it actually becomes light armor.

[Conman the Bardbarian]

My right barain overlooked that aspect of what bards are proficient with.

[Feend]

fretgod99 wrote:

Conman the Bardbarian wrote:

I think it's only -3 to ACP but it adds +2 to max dex and drops the armor one category so medium becomes light.

It does, but you still need medium proficiency wear mithral medium armor without penalty. Elven Chain is an exception in that it actually becomes light armor.

Thanks Fret. For PFS am I able to make the Elven Chain a +1?

[Feend]

And the penalty for wearing a Medium Mithil BP would only be the ACP or would it also be arcane failure? I thought the mithril property made an armour one type lower. Would I only get a 10% reduction to arcane failure or would it be 0%?

[Akerlof]

Serum wrote:

Check out the CRB specific magic armors 'Elven Chain' and 'Mithral Full Plate of Speed'. Both are mithral, so look at their ACPs.

You learn something new every day. Thanks.